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My Browser Builds (Part 3)


roytam1
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53 minutes ago, roytam1 said:

:thumbup Fingers crossed. Honestly, unless they're hell-bent on flushing all memory of XP, I can't think of a  good reason for why they wouldn't accept this fix.

Let's hope Tobin won't have a heart attack if his so-called "MSFN hackers" manage to get official recognition. :D (Less name-calling, cussing, and paranoid lashing out at people who have been helping their project, and maybe they wouldn't need appeals like UXP development: it doesn't magically happen...)

EDIT: If Tobin or someone else from PM reads this: sarcasm aside, I'm actually not saying this to fan the flames of conflict, the point is that it's painful to watch the upstream I believe most of us would ideally like to support and root for make that as hard as possible, and not just for MSFN members, but also a number of those in their own community.

Edited by mixit
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Thanks guys.

On 7/30/2021 at 7:26 PM, UCyborg said:

Firefox 52.9 can do AVC without a plugin.

Does that mean that with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, if I only set this pref: media.webm.enabled = false, I can play that YouTube video with H.264 and YouTube stats will show AVC1 Codec? And I don't need to install Adobe Primetime CDM plugin or any other plugins?
When I tested earlier with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, with media.webm.enabled = false, and the video could not play, was that because I am on XP x86 SP2?

Thanks @VistaLover, really great info, much appreciated.

 

PS:
Was I wrong that I said "AVC/AVC1" Codec support? Maybe I should have said "H.264" support?
I am sorry for this, I may have caused some confusion.

 

On 7/31/2021 at 8:54 AM, nicolaasjan said:

Sorry, it was another Firefox version...

This is with Firefox ESR 52.9.0 on XP SP3:

vp9-Firefox.png.8d376350366edb8ca02fb18009ceae66.png

No problem. Thanks.

Edited by we3fan
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2 hours ago, we3fan said:

Does that mean that with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, if I only set this pref: media.webm.enabled = false, I can play that YouTube video with H.264 and YouTube stats will show AVC1 Codec? And I don't need to install Adobe Primetime CDM plugin or any other plugins?
When I tested earlier with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, with media.webm.enabled = false, and the video could not play, was that because I am on XP x86 SP2?

Yes, it won't work on any XP version without a plugin, it only works without a plugin on Vista and later.

2 hours ago, we3fan said:

Was I wrong that I said "AVC/AVC1" Codec support? Maybe I should have said "H.264" support?

No, same thing.

Edited by UCyborg
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17 hours ago, mixit said:

Ran a quick test on both with MP4, seems to "work for me". :cool: Hopefully the same will be the case for everyone!

Ok, i check this 50 min video on Invidious and no freeze on 23 minute. Checking on YouTube make not much sense since last versions of YT layer make auto-correction if freeze happen in NM28. But invidious player always freeze on 23min. And now no freeze. Great job mixit!

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3 hours ago, we3fan said:

Does that mean that with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, if I only set this pref: media.webm.enabled = false, I can play that YouTube video with H.264 and YouTube stats will show AVC1 Codec? And I don't need to install Adobe Primetime CDM plugin or any other plugins?
When I tested earlier with Firefox ESR 52.9.0, with media.webm.enabled = false, and the video could not play, was that because I am on XP x86 SP2?

3 hours ago, we3fan said:

If you still have Firefox ESR 52.9.0 installed, can you please do only this 1 pref change in about:config > media.webm.enabled = false, and tell me what YouTube Stats show?
I can't test this now because I am on SP2, but I will try it on SP3 at some point.

With respect @we3fan, I believe the answers to ALL this second wave of your questions are to be found inside my previous post to you ;) ; I know you did thank me for it, and you're welcome, of course, but have you actually took the time to digest it? Was my "language" too "techy" for you? If yes, I do apologise, but I assume this community of XP die-hards to be more savvy than the average Joe :P...

To re-iterate:

Firefox 52 ESR on Windows XP, no matter the SP level:
Zero h264=avc=avc1 native decoding support for HTML5 MP4 video/HTLM5 AAC audio
This means that if you disable native webm support by setting
media.webm.enabled;false
, on YT there'll be no way to play any video.
NB, that webm is actually a media container, NOT a codec; webm is a subset of the matroska container and can contain VP8/VP9 video codecs, as well as opus/ogg audio codecs...

Firefox 52 ESR on Windows XP 32-bit SP2 => no known way to implement h264/aac decoding support on such a setup :( (h264=video, aac=audio)
Firefox 52 ESR on Windows XP 32-bit SP3 => implementation of h264/aac decoding support is possible via installation of the Adobe Primetime CDM (which, once more, requires XP SP3). 

- So, no need to demand further testing from @nicolaasjan ... -

Firefox 52 ESR on fully updated Vista SP2 32-bit (and more recent WinOSes) => by default h264/aac decoding support enabled, without additional action on behalf of the user; the browser uses, via WMF, patented decoders already present in the OS level... :thumbup

2 hours ago, UCyborg said:

At least theoretically, it should work on Vista with a Platform Update Supplement,
(redacted)
Theoretically, because Vista is this preliminary OS with quirks that nobody tests on, so some random things that are supposed to work don't.

As a Vista SP2 32-bit user on actual hardware, I can assure you that FxESR 52.9.x 32-bit on a fully updated Vista OS does have working h264/aac decoding support, without any need for AP CDM; however, I'll agree with you that some "quirks" are indeed present in that support, in the sense that some MP4 videos with highly unusual DAR (e.g. "perpendicular" video shot with a mobile phone) fail to decode with Vista's WMF decoder... :(

Edited by VistaLover
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4 hours ago, Rod Steel said:

Ok, i check this 50 min video on Invidious and no freeze on 23 minute. Checking on YouTube make not much sense since last versions of YT layer make auto-correction if freeze happen in NM28. But invidious player always freeze on 23min. And now no freeze. Great job mixit!

Didn't even know about that site, it's a good front-end to youtube, thanks for the link.

One thing I notice about it is that it caches videos to your temp folder in Local Settings while watching it, something youtube used to do. I've got firefox disk cache disabled and store cache in memory only so youtube videos don't store anything to disk.

For those using Invidious it's probably more convenient to just manually download the longer videos and watch them locally since it's automatically downloading them anyway.

Edited by DanR20
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5 hours ago, Rod Steel said:

Ok, i check this 50 min video on Invidious and no freeze on 23 minute. Checking on YouTube make not much sense since last versions of YT layer make auto-correction if freeze happen in NM28. But invidious player always freeze on 23min. And now no freeze. Great job mixit!

can you find a webm file that is long enough and having both audio and video? so I can test the fix on vanilla windows 2000 (nm26-vc8)

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9 minutes ago, roytam1 said:

can you find a webm file that is long enough and having both audio and video? so I can test the fix on vanilla windows 2000 (nm26-vc8)

You can try the "traditional" one :):

On 7/29/2021 at 2:07 PM, mixit said:

After I found that it didn't matter if I used an online stream or a local file, I just downloaded a a random longish file VP8 WEBM video from search results, which happened to be this one.

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49 minutes ago, mixit said:

You can try the "traditional" one :):

alright, it works in vanilla windows 2000 (actually windows Neptune)

3MN6WRu.png

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5 hours ago, DanR20 said:

Didn't even know about that site, it's a good front-end to youtube, thanks for the link.

Another useful trick i just found about yesterday is that you can change www.youtube.com to music.youtube.com for a somewhat lighter viewing experience. 

Still, playback lags like hell here tough...

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@UCyborg, @VistaLover - Thanks guys.

@VistaLover - The only reason why I "suddenly" thought no plugin is needed is because I misinterpreted UCyborg's post.

He said: "AFAIK, Firefox itself only ever used Windows Media Foundation (Vista+) for AVC, which is not available on XP, hence you need a plugin on that OS, but otherwise, Firefox 52.9 can do AVC without a plugin."

I thought he said: "Firefox 52.9 can do AVC without a plugin on XP"

My mistake, I am sorry.

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4 hours ago, roytam1 said:

alright, it works in vanilla windows 2000 (actually windows Neptune)

Good to hear, although I can't give any guarantees re: Win2K, not having investigated it at all.

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9 hours ago, RainyShadow said:

Another useful trick i just found about yesterday is that you can change www.youtube.com to music.youtube.com for a somewhat lighter viewing experience. 

Still, playback lags like hell here tough...

The site itself is quicker and more responsive. 

Invidious seems to be an excellent alternative for older computers, it doesn't even require javascript to run videos and that by itself is a huge plus.

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On 8/1/2021 at 12:55 AM, mixit said:

:thumbup Fingers crossed. Honestly, unless they're hell-bent on flushing all memory of XP, I can't think of a  good reason for why they wouldn't accept this fix.

Let's hope Tobin won't have a heart attack if his so-called "MSFN hackers" manage to get official recognition. :D (Less name-calling, cussing, and paranoid lashing out at people who have been helping their project, and maybe they wouldn't need appeals like UXP development: it doesn't magically happen...)

EDIT: If Tobin or someone else from PM reads this: sarcasm aside, I'm actually not saying this to fan the flames of conflict, the point is that it's painful to watch the upstream I believe most of us would ideally like to support and root for make that as hard as possible, and not just for MSFN members, but also a number of those in their own community.

Merged! https://github.com/mozilla/cubeb/pull/656#issuecomment-890597950

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4 hours ago, roytam1 said:

Excellent, thanks for taking care of this! :thumbup

Re: his acceptance comment, the bug is actually in wdmaud.drv; wdmaud.sys you could say is ahead of its time, therefore getting nerfed by the 32-bit API limitation. But let's not nitpick, I probably should have made that more clear in my source comments. :) Since we're not concerned with Windows 7 (WinMM is never used there by UXP browsers), I didn't delve into it too much, but WinMM did appear to be substantially rewritten there. IIRC at some point official Firefox added an option to pick an audio subsystem, so at least in theory WinMM could be selected even with Win7 (however unlikely that is). I'm pretty sure that in that case my fix would simply be superfluous and not cause any problems, but I think it's really up to them to make sure of that as library providers.

Edited by mixit
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