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The MOZ_APP_NAME would stay the same of course, that's fine. Same with application.ini who's values failing the existence of some alt build configuration dictate the location of the application profile. SAME goes with NSIS generated installer/uninstaller and helper.exe used by both NSIS and shellservice as well as shellservice its self. Unfortunately, this is set in stone and it is too unreasonable to change that stuff now. Maybe two years ago but not now as it would cause too much end-user trouble. Not to mention it would be annoying from a patch porting point of view. So that's fine. So just need to change the name in branding configure.sh, graphical assets, and l10n. Pretty simple once you have the name and logo. Now, I can sort of dig the circles with lines in em and perhaps do something with the concept though they MAY be a bit abstract. However, I hope that modified Firefox logo is not a serious contender because clearly that would not acceptable to Mozilla as it would get the the drones all fired up in a second and of course blame us not you for it. The general problem with the New Moon branding was it was intended to be basically like the Firefox Nightly branding and while yes it pulled double duty as generic branding anyone could use, it is still intrinsically linked to us and despite the feeling from some people here that there is and never has been any confusion, I can tell you there is.. People know that Pale Moon is the older Firefox-based browser with the interface of Firefox 4-28 and that builds are sometimes called New Moon. But with the divergent path of what continues to happen to support Windows XP what is produced isn't even going to be an unbranded Pale Moon for Windows XP as most people see it. Perhaps that is how you see it but as time goes on the differences mount. Let me put it to you another way, what if we had just kept the original non-trademarked Nightly branding for Pale Moon, both Basilisk's, and you also created your other half-dozen Firefox-based builds.. ALL called Nightly because that is what was there. How could you tell them apart then? Is it reasonable to put the burden on us to explain to people that the Windows XP builds you produce aren't the same as someone else producing Windows 7 unbranded builds or unbranded mac builds which also use the New Moon branding because mac isn't at the official level yet. The un-knowledgeable user who doesn't read more than maybe two sentences of a paragraph would assume New Moon == Pale Moon because they look the same and because despite being referred to as generic branding the name is too unique and intrinsically linked with us. This is the result of a decision made six years ago and it turns out to not have been a very good one on our part. Let me also say again, that this happens in the wild. THERE IS CONFUSION because I have specifically gone out of my way to berate and s*** on the confused user because it p***ed me the hell off and does every single time. Should I? No. Do I? Yeah. Should I continue to do so.. Well despite what one may conclude I actually don't know.. I do know that I don't really want to be angry about it anymore. I do know that over the past two years it has accomplished nothing. I also know that roytam1 took the unofficial branding as-is but hasn't been bothered to change it for whatever reason that may be. I do know I am a half-way decent designer and have the technical knowledge to implement it easily for roytam1 to slot into place. I also figured I had nothing to loose by str8 up offering to do it instead of expecting someone else to. A very common situation I find my self in a lot these days actually. I talked, bitched, complained, pleaded with and begged SeaMonkey for almost 10 years to not turn out the way it turned out and it accomplished nothing but in the Pale Moon project and beyond to the Unified XUL Platform, lots of things have gotten done through hard a** work via cooperation, coordination, and discussion and maybe that should be applied elsewhere. Especially to places that have historically annoyed the hell out of me for whatever real or imagined reason. After all, it is a process to better ones self and help make world at large better too. Can't have it all in a day but you can't have anything if you don't try. So I am trying (and yes there is likely a joke in there). Besides, I can't keep calling the paradigm "new" if it is the same old crap, eh?

@roytam1 Call the browsers as you like but leave the exe with the original name. If you change the name of the exe, a multitude of software will no longer work, especially those specific for the protection of the browser used which have strict rules for the various popular browsers used. @LoneCrusader Even if I'm in the minority, I think the same way you do.

I *VETO* these two *HEAVILY*, no offense intended. They look like illustrations you'd see in an anatomy text discussing female reproductive organs. =================================================================================================== Where did the name "New Moon" come from in the first place? I thought it was an APPROVED "generic" branding and methinks it could remain "generic" FOREVER. People don't stumble upon these forks "by accident". There is no "confusion", from what I perceive, with these and their upstream counterparts. My computer-illiterate parents and grandparents, aunts, and uncles are NEVER going to "find" these forks. =================================================================================================== I propose a morphed version of something like this (from here - https://www.freepnglogos.com/images/beats-png-logo-5027.html ) Only three colors for the 'fox/panda', maybe four, then the fifth color is what is in red below. But the "b" would be an "R" (for Roytam) [or for Red Panda, lol]. And I propose the same EXACT icon be used for ALL of Roytam's builds. The "red" area would be one color for New Moon, another color for Serpent, yet another for Borealis. Roytam adds another unknown browser down the road, it's the same exact icon but a fourth color is introduced. =================================================================================================== I would also vote to *NOT* do what has been done 'upstream'. New "official" Pale Moon versions have one systray icon when "pinned" (Win10) and closed, another icon when opened. I for one do *NOT* like my systray icons behaving this way.

If you delve back into the original 200-page thread, you'll find plenty of suggestions for new names. None caught on, probably because we soon had far too many to choose from! I tried to avoid that this time, figuring @Matt A. Tobin's suggested names were good enough and I didn't want to start another avalanche of name suggestions So far the leading alternative suggestion seems to be RoyFox and variations thereon. Which would also be fine by me. ================ Well yes, but I think the immediate concern is rebranding New Moon, Serpent, Navigator, and Interlink (mail/news). The others (FF 45 SSE, Arctic Fox, K-Meleon) can remain as they are for now. So maybe four polls (five if you consider Serpent 52 and 55 separate).

XMoon27, 28.... XFox52... VFox... RoyFox45... 2.... 3.6.... (yeah I know, no rebranding now, just fantasy) LoneCrusader said: > Should Mr. Tobin be allowed to "make his mark" (and a very visible and prominent mark) > on a project he has, in the past, done his level best to destroy? > I don't understand how these issues aren't striking a chord with anyone Certainly am uneasy feeling about THIS too, but RT himself isn't as emotional about such stuff as us mere mortals ;-) As he already stated, if others are willing to do the (boring part of) the work, he doesn't mind adopting it, same as with Mathwiz past commits. And planning to post a poll. IMO that people so readily take the first suggestions is mainly due to a lack of better alternative suggestions. But thinking about, there were already other suggestions in the past... someone should copy them over here... And one prob I see for setting up a poll is the multitude of browsers, getting a bit complicated...

Thanks for splitting off the REBRANDING discussions https://msfn.org/board/topic/180861-on-branding-roytam1s-browsers/

Granted, "MSE" has other meanings, but this thread's Jarhead title could easily be overlooked by anyone searching for information about Microsoft Security Essentials. (Edit: I approve of the thread's new title.) The GUI should "show MSE as being up to date in Windows 7" with respect to definition updates for an unknown period of time after January 14. As recently as December 11, my assumption was that MSE definition updates would cease after January 14. (Windows 8.1 and 10 have Windows Defender, MSE was never officially supported on any server, and today's Microsoft is a leaner and meaner corporation than the MS of yesteryear.) However, my assumption has been proven wrong: The official Microsoft Extended Security Update FAQ mentioned in the above-referenced article was indeed updated on December 18: Nearly all MSE users running Windows 7 are no doubt using version 4.10.209.0, which cannot be installed on XP and is only half as old as the version that many XP diehards are nostalgic about.

As if I need your "credibility" - ha! From my perspective, the BSD issue appears as just another incarnation of yourself and Moonchild whining about an "unsanctioned" build for an "unsanctioned" platform. You can't control them, so you try to intimidate them. You might be surprised the difference making a request in a reasonable manner makes versus dropping in and making demands. Machinations.. LMAO.. wow. The sad part here is that none of that was even directed at you at this point. Those links were simply directed at TechnoRelic, who has, time and again, refused to understand what was going on. And almost all of them, including the BSD one, were in the previous thread already. We've had our debates, and said our piece. Probably never going to like each other, or agree about very much. But provided you continue with this "better attitude," cease you threats, treat roytam1, his project, and its users with respect and common courtesy, then I'm mostly content to sit back and watch. I wondered how long it would take for someone to accuse me of some "past bias" against Mr. Tobin. Frankly I resent that. Sure, I don't like the guy. But everything I have said here in relation to this issue has been strictly based on the events at hand, and strictly in response to Mr. Tobin's behavior toward roytam1 and his project. I have been perfectly willing to have "civil discourse" with Mr. Tobin, provided that he cease his attacks and threats and behave like a reasonable person. If peace can be made with Mr. Tobin, that's fine too, with a couple of caveats: 1) That this "peace" not be based on giving in to threats or intimidation; and 2) That this "peace" not be based on everyone pressuring roytam1 to accept a change to his project that he clearly does not see as a priority. In fact, I had pretty much said everything that needed to be said, and even stated that I was mostly indifferent to the name changes, and stated that I would stand by roytam1 whatever HE decided. And then everyone here started jumping on the bandwagon and pressuring roytam1 to accept. Let's let roy make this decision himself, it's his project after all. He does the work. I'm interested in what HIS view is, not what is "popular." Fine, put me on that list. Not that many here seem to care what I have to say though anyway. IMO re-using Microsoft code names that are completely unrelated seems to be going off on a weird tangent. Not to mention that Microsoft has now abandoned XP and is in the process of "disappearing it" from history. As noted by others, let's have more original names, preferably with some degree of relation to (or being derived from) the parent programs... Ah, den. I thought you, of all people here, would understand where I've been coming from. If you don't at this point, I'm not sure how I could make it any clearer... And what you say is not even wholly correct. I'm not entirely opposed to the renaming. I'm opposed to it under certain conditions. The first of which is being opposed to renaming to appease people making threats. Fine, that one seems to be behind us for now. The second of which, however, you yourself contributed to by jumping on the bandwagon pushing for this. roytam1 doesn't see it as a priority, and it's his project. But now everyone but myself is pressuring him to accept this.. and for what? Like I asked before, what benefit do we gain from changing a name and a graphic? How is this "positive" pressure really any different from the "negative" pressure when roy, unlike the rest of you, doesn't see this issue as some kind of crisis? When and if roytam1 chooses, on his own, without influence from either side, to make changes to his project name or branding, I will be perfectly willing to accept it. Possibly. However, does no one but me see the intricacies of the irony in the situation? How can I phrase it... Does no one but me have a problem with the fact that roy is being pressured to allow Mr. Tobin, the very person who has been a thorn in his side for however long now, to essentially place his chosen names and his chosen graphics on roy's projects? Should roy, who has continually worked on his project and succeeded through all the criticism and nastiness, allow his ("former?") enemies to put their stamp on his work, which just recently they were trashing? Should roy, every time he builds or uses his project, have to look at a name or a graphic chosen by those who did their best to harass him and cause him any trouble they could? Should Mr. Tobin be allowed to "make his mark" (and a very visible and prominent mark) on a project he has, in the past, done his level best to destroy? I don't understand how these issues aren't striking a chord with anyone... It's not that Mr. Tobin lacks the ability. It's not that he hasn't been making a seemingly genuine and sincere effort. It's simply the sum of the situation itself. I'm not interested in "popular." I'm quite used to being in the minority, you should know this by now. Everyone here should know this, from or OS choices if nothing else. This is roy's project, not a group project. Occasionally some members are able to help, but essentially without roy this project would cease to exist. So I'm interested in what HE thinks and decides. I don't care for how everyone is "pushing" him, and you are the one who started that by pointing out roy's ignoring of Tobin's message. roy has every right to ignore Tobin if he so chooses. What has Tobin previously contributed to this project? Nothing. What had Tobin previously done to "sabotage" roy's projects? Most everything he could. So why is roy expected to "sit up and take notice" when Tobin posts? It's not as if Tobin were offering any real help with actual functionality of the project... Once again, this is not wholly correct. I am NOT trying to "derail any compromise." I have even stated that I am NOT completely opposed to changing the names. I do favor keeping them as is (say 60/40), but it's not that important. The situation is the issue. Aside from the points I've already made clarifying my standpoint I am simply disgusted with all this "bandwagonism." I may be the only one speaking now, but several others have spoken in favor of keeping the current naming convention in the previous thread. (I know, I re-read it yesterday while looking for links.) "Whenever you find that you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain

It'll keep on working! See: https://www.computerworld.com/article/3510500/microsoft-blinks-security-essentials-will-continue-to-receive-updates-after-jan-14.html

The @LoneCrusader is a dear friend and it grieves me to be pushed into arguing publicly with him about this, but I was never given any choice about it, since he seems to be the main (and, ATM, only) voice oposing the (re-)branding of the browsers. That said... True enough. But, while not forgetting, moving on is sometimes required, and I think this is one such case. There is a time for appeasing, and one for open confilct. I hope we won't keep arguing uselessly until we are beyond all possible compromise. Most of those in this thread are for the (re-)branding. I think that PoV has already won by acclamation. ... and you are the only one doing quite a strong effort to derail any compromise, when most of us don't see the facts in the same light as you do.

I can confirm that - happens to me as well... It also happens after every restart of the OS..

Guys, check your version of Potplayer because there seems to be a more updated version than the one released on December 12th:

Admittedly, there's zero benefit to me from new branding. At best, we'll get some spiffy new icons, and new artwork in Help / About, but the core functionality of our UXP-derived browsers isn't changing. The difference I see is that this time, @Matt A. Tobin is offering to do a good portion of the necessary work. And I don't see that we're sacrificing anything; if we are, please enlighten me. I'd be much more dubious about this if I though we were losing anything concrete .

Personally I would go for the PS2 keyboard. The USB 2.0 pci card (while a nice idea ) seems to me something that would be worth the time of an experiment, but there is a concrete risk that the install will fail, or - if you prefer - PS2 keyboard surely works, your USB 2.0 PCI card may. jaclaz

I was able to patch this using Alky applications

Another article: https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/windows-remote-desktop-services-used-for-fileless-malware-attacks/ As a precaution I have also disabled the service below: and my OSA software has the following rule enabled:

I got some ideas for branding.. Pale Moon could be called Whistler after the Codename for Windows XP Basilisk could be called Freestyle the Codename for Windows XP Media Center Edition because of the extra media features and Australis UI Borealis could be called Neptune the Codename for a developmental predecessor of Windows XP Interlink could be called Lonestar the Codename for Windows XP TabletPC Edition (writing, email, get it?) These are all UXP based applications for Windows XP and there you go a theme for all your forks of them. OH just call Basilisk 55, call it the codename for the repo.. Moebius/Mobius. Good name at any rate. Again for the four UXP applications.. I am willing to do the work for you, get em all in one repo, do the branding (yes I will keep the appdata paths as they are to avoid profile issues) and gift wrap it for you for Christmas. What do you say? EDIT: Thank you for removing the official branding from the modified-uxp repository. ALSO, if you go forward with this I will list you on thereisonlyxul.org in a special section for Windows XP users.

@foxzzy First, I want to welcome you to the MSFN forums ... However, and any forum admin will probably agree with me, it's not polite or even compliant with forum rules to have your second post be a slightly reworded version of your first one, asking about the exact same thing... You made your first post here: <thread link invalidated because of thread merge: it's the 1st post on this thread, now> and @Mathwiz was kind enough to provide you with links to the main MSE thread, where your query should have been answered, beyond any doubt... Did you ever bother reading the relevant posts (found in the "last-ish" thread pages...) ? You obviously didn't like the answer you received and you opted to come back with this duplicate query/thread... This is a real faux pas... MSE/XP is dead; first, M$ made its engine non-XP compatible; an interim mitigation was applied, but the final end was imminent: M$ also changed the "format" (for lack of a better term) of the actual definitions to be only compatible with the updated (non-XP compatible) engine; any attempt to patch those files will invalidate their file signatures/HASHes and render them "corrupt", unable to be used even with the old engine... What you're asking is for someone to deeply patch official Microsoft files (both engine DLL and definition files); even if some able person manages this, it wouldn't be allowed to post here "hacked" Microsoft files... FWIW, MSE is kept going by M$ only for the sake of Windows 7 (and they are being gracious to those few Vista users, too); once Win7 reaches EoS in several months, the future is unclear for "legacy" MSE (replaced by updated WD in Win8+)...