Windows 8 Extended Kernel

[RaissaAlamanah]

Hey Im a new user on MSFN forum...

After seeing effort for older windows...

I want a Windows 8 Extended Kernel..

I'm not a coder but seeing you guys made Vista Extended Kernel...

It's not a demand but really cool to see it happened...

[ExtremeGrief]

2 hours ago, RaissaAlamanah said:

Hey Im a new user on MSFN forum...

After seeing effort for older windows...

I want a Windows 8 Extended Kernel..

I'm not a coder but seeing you guys made Vista Extended Kernel...

It's not a demand but really cool to see it happened...

Do you mean Windows 8 or Windows 8.1?

[yoltboy01]

Right now, there is probably no need for an Extended Kernel for Windows 8. 

Windows 8 was treated differently than Windows Vista. Software Support for Vista was mostly depended on XP‘s Software Support, as companies often ended support for them simultaneously.

Most of the current software still supports Windows 8. There are just a few applications like iTunes, Office 2019+ or OneDrive, who ended their support. However, there are workarounds in how to install the latest versions, with some modifications to the installers. I think Firefox for Windows 8 will be supported for at least 2024, as Mozilla hasn‘t said anything regarding EOL yet. Furthermore, if you pay attention to details, Mozilla itself still develops Firefox on Windows 7/8 machines, as Firefox 98 release notes show a screenshot from a W7 machine running Firefox, rather than a W10 machine. All common Antivirus programs are also still supported.

 

So, is there any need for an Extended Kernel yet?

[mina7601]

16 minutes ago, yoltboy01 said:

So, is there any need for an Extended Kernel yet?

In my opinion, I think Windows 7 and 8 need an extended kernel. I don't think Windows 8.1 needs one, which like you said, can have the latest versions of some software with workarounds/modifications.

[RaissaAlamanah]

3 hours ago, mina7601 said:

In my opinion, I think Windows 7 and 8 need an extended kernel. I don't think Windows 8.1 needs one, which like you said, can have the latest versions of some software with workarounds/modifications.

Windows 8.1 kinda need them...

it's just less than a year the EOL would come...

and Windows 8.1  it's not a major success and app dev could discontinued app right away..

[LonghornXP]

19 hours ago, RaissaAlamanah said:

Windows 8.1 kinda need them...

it's just less than a year the EOL would come...

and Windows 8.1  it's not a major success and app dev could discontinued app right away..

Windows 8 is End-of-Support on 2016 but 8.1 is End-of-Support on 2023 

[sonyu]

Windows 8.0 6.2.9200 is the best Windows with WDDM 1.2.

I'm interested in this too since it's also possible to install Net Framework 4.8 on Server 2012 (same kernel as 8.0) and also PowerShell version 5.1

 

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by sonyu

[Jakob99]

In all honesty, Windows 8.1 is the better of the two. Everything is easier to access due to the readding of the native start button (classic shell on 8 (6.2) doesn't count), plus the start screen in my opinion is more organized. With that, I believe a Windows 8.1 Extended Kernel to be the better option. Since it appears this thread is gonna be dedicated to Windows 8, I'll create a separate thread to see if there is enough interest in a Windows 8.1 Extended Kernel. Before I go, this may be of help to anyone running Windows 8 on modern hardware. I'm under the impression this supports up to 10th Gen Intel. 11th Gen and later as well as subsets such as Jasper Lake are not currently supported, but I'm going to post about that in his thread. Oh, and I think his driver only supports either Q0 or Q1 stepping.

[Jaguarek62]

there is probably very small chance for this to happen. Windows 8 has system file verification and thus won't boot with modified files. I know just 3-4 apis that are missing in user32.dll and kernel32.dll. Most of issues comes from API-MS-YADA YADA files.

Local redirection works only in certain cases so I don't know about that. But I would love to see that. First we need to see win NT version spoofer since 8.1 can run most of the windows 10 only apps only if it spoofs it's os version. 

[sonyu]

8.1 is not a bad OS. 

But:

- The UI lag we have and know in w10 right now, started with 8.1

why? Cause new DPI improvements, new Virtual GPU memory pagination and other new features were introduced with this OS with the introduction of WDDM 1.3. do you remember "Windows Blue" ? 

WDDM 1.2 ( Windows 8.0 ) it's the best WDDM version. You can try Windows 8,0 on all hardware (only requirement is WDDM drivers) and it will improve any Windows XP, Vista and 7 machine (all are good OSes, well.. vista sp2 I mean).

You won't have this improvement when you install Windows 8.1 on the same old hardware. The more memory you use on Windows 8.1 the more you will notice how laggy the UI can be. Try it yourself.

I have nothing against Windows 8.1, 7, XP or Vista. I tried them all, and I love XP. But after I tried w10 RTM, Windows 10 beta builds on modern hardware (less lag than RTM or 1511 or anything after >1607) and all other Windows 10 builds, as you can see in the following link, I can confirm Windows 8.0 makes a difference on every hardware I tried, it's the last Windows you can decently run on old WDDM compatible hardware and the fastest experience on modern hardware. 

Start button isn't relevant for me, why?  You can run explorer.exe from Windows 7 on w8,0 and you'll have the start button and the start menu or you can install a million alternatives to get start button and menu working on w8.0. 

The really only interesting part it's the kernel, the virtual memory pagination, the memory management, the WDDM version 1.2 (you can also install some 8.1 gpu drivers on it) and of course the UI lag.

In other words, for me Windows 8.0 it's the new Windows XP. All software work on 8.0, no incompatibilities. Just click and run like the good old school windows 9x and 2k and xp and 2k3. It's like Windows 7 but with native uefi support, dwm improvements, memory improvements and less lag than 8.1 or 10. Windows 8.0 it's more like 7. Windows 8.1 it's more like 10. Why? Cause 8.1 loves memory like 10.

Anyway you can run Windows 10 1511 on some old hardware from 2008 era and you'll have a better experience playing browser videos, youtube... than you'll have on 7,8.0 or 8.1. it's not all bad, it has a really interesting process, memory and cpu management... but again the more memory you use the more lag you'll have on the UI cause it has WDDM 2.0. This never happens on w8.0 and when you have lot of memory used on 8.0, you can use standby memory cleaner and memreduct and all will be free in seconds like when Windows started.

All this comment is based on years of experience. I use windows since 3.1, I spend tons of hours in 95, 98, ME, XP and 2k3. And considering the resources you need these days to run modern software, I get the best and fastest experience in Windows 8.0.

both 8.0 and 8.1 are great OSes. but less is more and I can't find the simplicity of 8.0 on 8.1.

modern windows 10 UI lag started with 8.1, this is why I love WDDM 1.2 and 8.0 

I tried 8.1 and 8.0 on netbooks (atoms, celerons...), powerful desktops, i3, i5, i7, dedicated gpus, integrated gpus... and I always ended using 8.0 having the best experience. better than xp, vista and 7. you will end having the best of an era with windows 8.0: I mean the best of 9x, 2k, xp, 2k3, vista and 7.

And of course, I really don't believe the GUI lag of these OSes >10 are caused by less powerful hardware. It's all about how the OS works. If you don't believe think how fast Windows 95 and 98 worked without tons of RAM and SSDs and resources here and there.  Even Windows 2000 with the kernel extension shows us how all these modern windows versions are really laggy and feels like a beta OSes.

Windows 10/11 it's now like a videogame you need to check first if you have all the minimum resources to play it. To run what or to do what? And all these Metro Apps running in background... it's like a webpage... lot of colours, animations... 

Click here to remember what a real OS it is. Or here 

Long live windows 8.0. The best.

And why it's better than Windows 7 ? Long story short. Article about 8.0 wrote while MS was finishing the development of Windows 8 RTM release date:

https://web.archive.org/web/20170918122254/https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/b8/2011/10/07/reducing-runtime-memory-in-windows-8/

Yes it's the ONLY windows version that needs less memory than it's predecessor.

Edited March 24, 2022 by sonyu

[Sergiaws]

I would prefer an implementation of UWP for older Windows.

[Tommy]

21 hours ago, Sergiaws said:

I would prefer an implementation of UWP for older Windows.

Please refrain from cross posting the same or similar posts in multiple threads. Thanks!

[NotHereToPlayGames]

On 3/24/2022 at 1:52 PM, sonyu said:

Yes it's the ONLY windows version that needs less memory than it's predecessor.

Did you keep any data to support this?

I was given two laptops with i3's and I've opted to not put XP on these two laptops.

I have tested Vista Extended Kernel and was thoroughly unimpressed - I applaud the endeavors of "extending" kernels, but I don't see myself going that route (at least not yet).

I have been leaning towards installing Win7 Enterprise on these laptops until I stumbled into this 'claim' regarding Win8.

[sonyu]

1 hour ago, NotHereToPlayGames said:

Did you keep any data to support this?

I was given two laptops with i3's and I've opted to not put XP on these two laptops.

I have tested Vista Extended Kernel and was thoroughly unimpressed - I applaud the endeavors of "extending" kernels, but I don't see myself going that route (at least not yet).

I have been leaning towards installing Win7 Enterprise on these laptops until I stumbled into this 'claim' regarding Win8.

@NotHereToPlayGames

Reducing runtime memory in Windows 8

https://web.archive.org/web/20170918122254/https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/b8/2011/10/07/reducing-runtime-memory-in-windows-8/

 

 

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by sonyu

[WinCare]

Windows 8 Extended Kernel, based on Windows 10 build 9888, transformed to Windows 8 or Windows 8.1, which you can run apps which is compatible with Windows 10 or above on Windows 8.x.