NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 3, 2023 Share Posted August 3, 2023 16 minutes ago, UCyborg said: "What do you mean "obsolete browser"!? I just updated it last Saturday!" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 3, 2023 Share Posted August 3, 2023 1 hour ago, UCyborg said: But megabytes of JavaScript for relatively simple tasks, c'mon... I haven't added up the byte count for this one. Those that have been around for a while have heard me complain about my Water Bill web site - ONE HUNDRED AND SIXTY EIGHT SCRIPTS !!! I had to painstakingly block one by one, log out, log back in, rinse and repeat. Many weeks later, I only allow THIRTEEN of those one hundred and sixty eight scripts to do their thing. My water bill site NO LONGER pukes tree-hugger environmentalist crap at me each and every time I log in. Got NOTHING against environmentalist causes, I just want to know how much my water bill is and shouldn't have to parse through "crap" to find it! My water bill web site now basically ONLY shows me how much I owe! I don't need a history chart of my water usage, I don't need to know about the latest environmentalist causes, I just want to pay my water bill. I can no longer "pay" my bill on their web site, I only use it to see how much I owe then I make the payment from my checking account web site. I don't need one hundred and sixty eight scripts, I only "need" THIRTEEN of them (Proxomitron replaces them with a "dummy.js" local file so that the web browser doesn't log the intentional .js block as an "error"). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 3, 2023 Share Posted August 3, 2023 2 hours ago, UCyborg said: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/628744/chrome-ie8-multi-process-design-is-it-possible-in-net Maybe that is why I am "pro multi-process" - because my very first career job was running moldflow analysis on a UNIX workstation, I remember fork()'ing. Kind of begs the question - why are Unix programmers viewed as ahead of their times when they multi-process'd DECADES AGO but Windows "browser creators" viewed the opposite "in 2023 and beyond" (an MSFN phraseology) and that they should stick with single-process ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UCyborg Posted August 3, 2023 Share Posted August 3, 2023 1 hour ago, NotHereToPlayGames said: Kind of begs the question - why are Unix programmers viewed as ahead of their times when they multi-process'd DECADES AGO but Windows "browser creators" viewed the opposite "in 2023 and beyond" (an MSFN phraseology) and that they should stick with single-process ??? My hunch is that typical MSFNer is just angry that he can't run today's browsers/web pages well on his old 2001 (or worse!) computer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidao Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 4 hours ago, UCyborg said: My hunch is that typical MSFNer is just angry that he can't run today's browsers/web pages well on his old 2001 (or worse!) computer. Agreesed with you, but I think may be the computers on 2010 or before who used in this topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 7 hours ago, UCyborg said: My hunch is that typical MSFNer is just angry that he can't run today's browsers/web pages well on his old 2001 (or worse!) computer. Bingo! The next time the "typical MSFNer" starts shouting about "single-process being superior", that MSFNer should ask himself, "Am I being a grandpa sitting on the porch yelling at the neighbor kid to GET OFF MY LAWN". Because that's how these single-process comments always sound to me - a rickety old wooden rocking chair with a 90-lb frail grandpa barely able to get the thing to rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 (edited) Another way to look at it is this, and here I use the word "you" as an all-encompassing pronoun, not any one or two or three specific people. You are a hypocrite if on one hand you applaud the safety and security that an airbag brings to a modern vehicle but on the other hand shout from the roof top for single-process opposed to multi-process. Vehicle "onboard computers" are extremely complex. Safety circuits on top of safety circuits. Reaction times at split-second precision so that an airbag doesn't explode under false pretense. What kind of world would we live in if the "correct way to advance" was for browsers to remain single-process, televisions to remain Cathode Ray Tube, phones to remain wired to the wall, but then we hand-pick what technologies are allowed to advance as opposed to them kind of ALL advancing ??? Edited August 4, 2023 by NotHereToPlayGames 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UCyborg Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Sorry, my rant was a bit overreacting yesterday, my opinion is more mixed on multi-process specifically. I mean in theory, it could overall be lighter on resources due to absence of overhead for interprocess communication, no allocations inherent to spawning new processes ect. But all single-process browsers (referring to old school Mozilla browsers...what else is out there anyway?) that are kinda usable today (if you don't visit too complex websites) all get crapped up, resources aren't freed, it just gets slower and more RAM hungry until you close and restart the browser, worst case scenario in my experience is getting stuck in a permanent loop when it 100% CPU core and you can't interact with the browser at all. While multi-process browser just terminates the process and BAM, resources associated with the tab are freed instantly. And this old school Mozilla code seems to have a funny quirk that resource consumption will actually spike up when you close tabs, so if you're reaching the limit if you're on a 32-bit browser, that'll be the final nail in the coffin. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Agreed! Don't get me wrong, I see "both sides". Heck, my daily driver is single-port throttle body injection which is essentially one step up from 1980's carburetor technology which is one step up from a 1930s downdraft carburetor which is essentially one step up from an 1885 Karl Benz wick carburetor. And no, it doesn't have airbags. But the grandpa sitting on the wooden rocker has to acknowledge the hypocrisy of complaining about that single-process pegging at 100% when multi-process technology remedies that complaint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkinis Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 (edited) new feature from chrome in 2023.... the annoying bottom end download bar is gone we have been using this on Firefox and forks for ages LOL Edited August 4, 2023 by Milkinis 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UCyborg Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 11 hours ago, NotHereToPlayGames said: But the grandpa sitting on the wooden rocker has to acknowledge the hypocrisy of complaining about that single-process pegging at 100% when multi-process technology remedies that complaint. Somewhat related, but Windows also doesn't bother stuffing multiple services in a single process anymore by default, at least when 3,5+ GB of RAM is available. Funny, this practice of stuffing services in single process (aka. svchost.exe) was even listed as being outdated in the one long list of complaints of flaws about Windows at http://itvision.altervista.org/why-windows-10-sucks.html. So MS does listen to customer feedback every once in a while. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 The best Speedometer score I can get at home is "only" 157 (I hit 170 once but all other tests landed at 151 thru 157). Ungoogled v113. i7-6820HQ @ 2.70 GHz. 32 GB RAM. Win10 LTSB 2016 x64. Wired LAN versus wireless does not effect the score, my bad. The laptop running on BATTERY versus plugged in for a recharge DOES effect the score. Best I can get while running on battery is 102 thru 106 - that seems quite substantial to me. My work laptop is "never" unplugged (not good for battery but also "not my battery", lol). Three trial runs on Ungoogled v115 while plugged in for a recharge scored 96.6, 97.4, and 97.87 - will not be "upgrading". Three trial runs on Ungoogled v114 while plugged in for a recharge scored 157, 154, and 154 (average = 155). Reverted to Ungoogled v113 and scored 156, 154, and 155 (average = 155). Plan to upgrade to v114 but skipping v115. Not strictly based on Speedometer scores but also this - https://www.securityweek.com/chrome-114-update-patches-critical-vulnerability/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkinis Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 52 minutes ago, NotHereToPlayGames said: The best Speedometer score I can get at home is "only" 157 Wired LAN versus wireless does not effect the score, my bad. as expected this benchmark site is somewhat useless. I don't think your browser at work runs two times faster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHereToPlayGames Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 (edited) The benchmark *IS* useful. Not sure why the nay-sayers don't "see" it. It doesn't just test the "browser", but how well the CPU is communicating with that browser. The "browser" isn't usually the bottleneck, how well your CPU is handling the browser IS - that's also why "era correct" computers are a valid discussion and I admit that these are not "era correct" CPUs that I run 360Chrome on. My work computer *IS* that much faster than my home computer. How about PassMark scores? I'm open for alternatives, but I "must" have a "number", I do not go by "gut feelings". Edited August 5, 2023 by NotHereToPlayGames 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkinis Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 44 minutes ago, NotHereToPlayGames said: I'm open for alternatives, but I "must" have a "number", I do not go by "gut feelings". ok. you feel and sleep better with higher testbed scores. but did you notice any lag or latency while browsing the same web sites ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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