Extreme Explorer 360 Chromium 78-86 General Discussion

[Hunterw]

This thing is letting the screen saver cover full screen video.

Is there a way to prevent it?

[NotHereToPlayGames]

Um, is this a "real" post/enquiry ???

[Cixert]

Is it possible to limit memory consumption?
I have a serious memory problem with 360 Extreme Explorer 11.0.2251.0 on a computer when I reach more than 150 open tabs, if I close 360 Extreme Explorer it is not able to start.
I had 4 GiB RAM limited to 3 GiB for the i3 processor video card.
I observe that when reopening 360 the memory consumption increases in a few seconds to 5.36 GiB, then 360 crashes. Playing with the restoration window, I manage to open 360 and close some tabs, at which point the problem disappears.
So I think it is necessary to increase RAM memory, so I install 8 GiB RAM.
Now when opening 360, with the same tabs, the memory consumption increases up to 9.36 GiB RAM, at which point it crashes.
I have tried to remove and put the Windows XP virtual memory (I have SSD disk). I have tried to override the 360 cache but the problem continues anyway.
How can I limit the 360's memory consumption?
I cannot understand why if I cancel the Windows XP virtual memory the consumption increases up to 9.36 GiB RAM with 8 GiB RAM installed.

Edited April 5, 2021 by Cixert

[Vistapocalypse]

58 minutes ago, Cixert said:

I have a serious memory problem with 360 Extreme Explorer 11.0.2251.0 on a computer when I reach more than 150 open tabs...

The solution is obvious. There is no need for 150 open tabs! Bookmarks are very useful.

[Cixert]

36 minutes ago, Vistapocalypse said:

The solution is obvious. There is no need for 150 open tabs! Bookmarks are very useful.

On Serpent Mobieus Basilisk55, Windows XP does not exceed 1.5 GiB RAM with 150 tabs open.
I need to work with 300 or more tabs open at the same time, sometimes in a single day, it is not a question of bookmarking. These are everyday tabs for various issues I work on. They can be different every day.

Edited April 6, 2021 by Cixert

[Vistapocalypse]

49 minutes ago, Cixert said:

On Serpent Mobieus Basilisk55, Windows XP does not exceed 1.5 GiB RAM with 150 tabs open.
I need to work with 300 or more tabs open at the same time...

Sounds like Serpent is the right browser for you, assuming XP is the only OS available for your work.

[NotHereToPlayGames]

4 hours ago, Cixert said:

...when I reach more than 150 open tabs...
...the i3 processor...

You have UNREALISTIC expectations.

Plain and simple.

 

Either you need Chrome and the VAST amounts of web that only CHROME can give you or you do not.

Give us a LIST of these 150 to 300 tabs so we can inspect them ourselves.

I have a strong hunch that MyPal v27 can handle those 150 to 300 tabs better than anything "newer".

"Newer" is simply NOT always "better".

 

Throwing 300 tabs at an i3 - come on man, you can't be serious!

Disable ALL .js, disable ALL .css, disable ALL images, view ONLY the TEXT on those 300 tabs and you might be fine that way.

 

I'm with @Vistapocalypse  "The solution is obvious. There is no need for 150 open tabs!"  NOT ON AN i3 !!!

I'd be interested in seeing that list of 150 to 300 tabs so I can gauge for myself which browser can handle that task best.

[Cixert]

9 hours ago, ArcticFoxie said:

You have UNREALISTIC expectations.

Plain and simple.

 

Either you need Chrome and the VAST amounts of web that only CHROME can give you or you do not.

Give us a LIST of these 150 to 300 tabs so we can inspect them ourselves.

I have a strong hunch that MyPal v27 can handle those 150 to 300 tabs better than anything "newer".

"Newer" is simply NOT always "better".

 

Throwing 300 tabs at an i3 - come on man, you can't be serious!

Disable ALL .js, disable ALL .css, disable ALL images, view ONLY the TEXT on those 300 tabs and you might be fine that way.

 

I'm with @Vistapocalypse  "The solution is obvious. There is no need for 150 open tabs!"  NOT ON AN i3 !!!

I'd be interested in seeing that list of 150 to 300 tabs so I can gauge for myself which browser can handle that task best.

I have no interest in getting into deep philosophical discussions but thanks for the interest :-)
The question is simple:
When I have 150 tabs on this computer and I close 360 Extreme Explorer when restarting it, the RAM occupies less than 1 GiB RAM.
But when I have 151 tabs open, only 1 more, when restarting the memory consumption shoots up to 9.56 GiB RAM, at which point 360 Extreme Explorer crash.
I just want to know why just one more tab causes this situation.
Similar events happen to me on other computers, but they occur in a number of different tabs. It may happen that just having 1 more tab 360 Extreme Explorer takes 30 min. to restart. Everything indicates that it seems to be related to cache or virtual memory but I can't guess what the cause is.

[NotHereToPlayGames]

43 minutes ago, Cixert said:

I have no interest in getting into deep philosophical discussions...

NEITHER DO I !!!

 

I can only offer assistance where I can duplicate the claimed scenario here - which I have been unable to do.

I have no special cache settings and I do not use virtual memory.

I'm on an i7-4770 with 16GB RAM, running 32-bit 360Chrome v13 build 2206 on WinXP x64.

I have 32 bookmarks so opened them all SIX times (ie, I opened 192 tabs).

I then reviewed Task Manager and only saw 86 .exe's opened.

So I then opened all 32 bookmarks in a new window (so now one window has 192 tabs and the other has 32 tabs).

I opened two more sets of 32 so now that second window has 96 tabs open.

So I now have a total of 288 tabs open.

But Task Manager still only shows 86 .exe's (if I counted correctly - I screencap'd below as witness to my test-run).

 

You did cite v11 - how many .exe's does v11 show when you have a *sh!t-L0ad* of tabs open ???

 

[Cixert]

Right now I have 136 tabs open, seven .exe are open.
The error does not occur when I open many tabs, but when I close 360 Extreme Explorer with many tabs and reopen it. Opening it is when the crash occurs, suddenly increasing the RAM consumption.
It seems that the less powerful the computer is, the earlier the error occurs based on the number of open tabs.
Although it could be that it only happened in my computers, because I use Windows XP with cloned versions from one computer to another.

Edit:
At this point I have rebooted with 137 tabs and upped the RAM to 7.02 GiB. 360 Extreme has not crashed but the processes of all the extensions have been closed (it is another collateral error before the crash)
Right now I have 72 processes of 360chrome.exe without crashing.
The next time I rebooted with 138 tabs it crashed.
 

Edited April 7, 2021 by Cixert

[NotHereToPlayGames]

3 hours ago, Cixert said:

It seems that the less powerful the computer is, the earlier the error occurs based on the number of open tabs.

No surprise there.

It's 2021 -- we can only get Win 98 to do so much, we can only get Win 2000 to do so much, we can only get Win NT to do so much, we can only get Win XP to do so much.

But just like when it came out, none of us are wasting our time with Win Me.

 

So, you are closing 360Chrome with 136 tabs open and then telling it to "continue where you left off" when you open it back up?

If so, and just for giggles, I just opened 96 tabs in Win10 using official Chrome version 89.0.4389.90, closed Chrome, and let it "continue where i left off" and it CRASHED !!!

That was in a VirtualBox VM with 2GB RAM allocated.

But evidence that opeing that many tabs "where i left off" could just be 'too much to ask' - even for Win 10 let alone Win XP.

 

"mileage may vary"

[Cixert]

8 minutes ago, ArcticFoxie said:

closed Chrome, and let it "continue where i left off" and it CRASHED !!!

Yes, that's what I do and it happens to me.
I am observing that with just one more tab it increases to 72 processes in the task manager
No problem with Mozilla versions and many tabs, except slower system.

Edited April 7, 2021 by Cixert

[NotHereToPlayGames]

I assume that you are well-versed in the vast differences between Chrome and Mozilla?

They do "processes" differently BY DESIGN.

There's a TON of history and a LOT of reading to really be well-versed (I am not).

I think 360Chrome v11 is based on Chrome 78 (not positive as I use 360Chrome v13 which is based on Chrome 86 [October 2020]).

Serpent/Basilisk55 is basically Firefox v54 with "some" (not sure if it's just a "few" or if it's "most") patches from v55.

Firefox v54 was released in June 2017 and Firefox v55 was released in August 2017.

Chrome v78 was released in October 2019.

Firefox v54 was the first Mozilla release to support multi-threading.

I think the first Chrome version to support multi-threading was v70 [October 2018].

You mentioned running an i3  --  you can get an i3 with 2 cores or with 4 cores, which one do you have?

 

For what it is worth, my "slower" computers strictly run MyPal v27.

I benchmark on occasion and it just performed better on my slower computers.

But I also do not continue where I left off, the slate starts clean with every new browsing session.

Edited April 7, 2021 by ArcticFoxie

[VistaLover]

15 hours ago, ArcticFoxie said:

I think 360Chrome v11 is based on Chrome 78 (not positive

Actually based on Chromium 69 - 360EEv12 is the one based on Chromium 78... 

15 hours ago, ArcticFoxie said:

Serpent/Basilisk55 is basically Firefox v54 with "some" (not sure if it's just a "few" or if it's "most") patches from v55.

Basilisk 55/Moebius was actually born by MCP as a fork of a snapshot of Mozilla Firefox 53.0a1 (yes, the Nightly channel); there's very little, if anything, backported from Firefox stable 54.0 or 55.0; in fact, MCP, right after forking, started removing features, so that Basilisk 55 was even inferior to release channel Firefox 53.0, feature-wise (especially in what concerns e10s and WebExtension APIs) ... MCP just gave it an appVersion=55.0.x for purely "sensationalism" reasons ...

Today's Serpent 55, as maintained by Roytam1 (updated roughly once a month), is a mixed-bag, an experimental app where patches from Mozilla, TenFourFox and, mostly, UXP are being applied... 

As for the matter at hand, Chromium-derived browsers are notorious for gobbling up RAM at the speed of light... By design, each tab is run in its own browser process, add to that several other processes needed by the browser core and extensions, add the amount of RAM devoured by your ad-blocker extension alone and you get the picture... Session restore in Chromium browsers is also an issue, because the application has to spawn, after initial launch, ALL these additional processes to "resurrect" the tabs present in the previous session...

I was first introduced to PCs when Windows XP was the OS du jour, with its IE6 fine (!) browser which, if you care to remember, did not support tabs - opening 150-300 browser windows was unthinkable at the time...

When "tabbed" browsers came into being, people started abusing the feature, many ending up doing, what was later called, tab-hoarding  ; but websites of yesteryear were mainly static HTML pages, so the impact on consumed RAM (my initial XP box came with 512MB!) was small; this allowed tab-hoarders to continue the type of workflow they had been accustomed to... 

But lately, certainly within the last 5 years, web-sites have turned into web applications in their own right, laden with omnipresent rich media content and heavy scripts; embedded videos and high resolution images are now obligatory to attain high Google-analytics figures (which is what drives webpage creation now), plus wizards to social media are everywhere (even here on MSFN...).
Browsers are being served huge blobs of (minified) Javascript, Web Assembly (wasm) code, huge CSS files, HTML5 video etc., that have to be decoded and rendered locally by the browser engine  ! Especially the design of the (very popular) Social Media sites (Facebook, VK, instagram, twitter, tiktok, youtube e.a.), targeting mobile devices with touchscreens, with their "infinite-scroll" pages (where more content is loaded in memory as you scroll further), all that is a veritable menace to under-resourced and on "hardware-of-the-past" desktop machines... 

I am mentioning the above just to highlight the fact tab-hoarding has become a lot more difficult these days, especially on older (32-bit) OSes (which, by their nature, have worse RAM-handling/allocating capabilities than the recent 64-bit ones...). 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not passing judgement on @Cixert's workflow habits, just pointing out that his practice will simply get worse in the future, irrespective of browser/OS bugs...

Pre-quantum Mozilla forks, like the ones issued by Roytam1, are basically single-process applications, which, by that fact alone, makes them more lenient on system resources; if you only have a few vital extensions, an intelligently configured content-blocker, you try to stay clear of desktop-hostile places like the main Social sites, then I suspect you can afford to open more tabs there... But remember, single process means that if one tab crashes, it takes the whole browser with it!
On the subject of RAM consumption, let me also recommend the Lull-the-tabs legacy extension (by JustOff), which minimises significantly RAM consumption at browser start-up, especially when it tries to restore a large previous session... 

Looking for a similar add-on for Chromium browsers, The Great Suspender Original

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/the-great-suspender-origi/ahmkjjgdligadogjedmnogbpbcpofeeo

sounds promising, but I've not tried it myself, since I never have more than 25 tabs open in 360EEv12/13 (several of which are system tabs that don't consume RAM). Some more extensions to try are mentioned in: 

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/google-chrome-ram-memory-usage/

By the looks of it, Cixert has hit some session-restore bug on 360EEv11 that manifests itself under his specific usecase and/or OS configuration... In the following URL, 

https://www.webnots.com/8-ways-to-reduce-memory-and-cpu-usage-of-google-chrome/

I urge you to read chapters 2+3+4 ; if the session restore bug kicks-in at 151 opened tabs, then make sure you close the additional ones before exiting the browser; as others have said, you have to adapt to the browser's capabilities, should you wish to continue using 360EE... 

I'm not quite sure what is the exact OS/architecture this happens on, but later 360EE versions may fare better with regard to RAM management and session restore; have you tried 360EEv12 and/or 360EEv13? 

At the end of the day, if you find that none of the 360EE versions quench your work-related absolute need for 300 open tabs, you should consider staying with/switching to a browser that lets you do it... We can only help up to a point here, sadly... 

Best regards, stay safe 

Edited April 7, 2021 by VistaLover

[Cixert]

21 hours ago, VistaLover said:

Actually based on Chromium 69 - 360EEv12 is the one based on Chromium 78... 

Basilisk 55/Moebius was actually born by MCP as a fork of a snapshot of Mozilla Firefox 53.0a1 (yes, the Nightly channel); there's very little, if anything, backported from Firefox stable 54.0 or 55.0; in fact, MCP, right after forking, started removing features, so that Basilisk 55 was even inferior to release channel Firefox 53.0, feature-wise (especially in what concerns e10s and WebExtension APIs) ... MCP just gave it an appVersion=55.0.x for purely "sensationalism" reasons ...

Today's Serpent 55, as maintained by Roytam1 (updated roughly once a month), is a mixed-bag, an experimental app where patches from Mozilla, TenFourFox and, mostly, UXP are being applied... 

As for the matter at hand, Chromium-derived browsers are notorious for gobbling up RAM at the speed of light... By design, each tab is run in its own browser process, add to that several other processes needed by the browser core and extensions, add the amount of RAM devoured by your ad-blocker extension alone and you get the picture... Session restore in Chromium browsers is also an issue, because the application has to spawn, after initial launch, ALL these additional processes to "resurrect" the tabs present in the previous session...

I was first introduced to PCs when Windows XP was the OS du jour, with its IE6 fine (!) browser which, if you care to remember, did not support tabs - opening 150-300 browser windows was unthinkable at the time...

When "tabbed" browsers came into being, people started abusing the feature, many ending up doing, what was later called, tab-hoarding  ; but websites of yesteryear were mainly static HTML pages, so the impact on consumed RAM (my initial XP box came with 512MB!) was small; this allowed tab-hoarders to continue the type of workflow they had been accustomed to... 

But lately, certainly within the last 5 years, web-sites have turned into web applications in their own right, laden with omnipresent rich media content and heavy scripts; embedded videos and high resolution images are now obligatory to attain high Google-analytics figures (which is what drives webpage creation now), plus wizards to social media are everywhere (even here on MSFN...).
Browsers are being served huge blobs of (minified) Javascript, Web Assembly (wasm) code, huge CSS files, HTML5 video etc., that have to be decoded and rendered locally by the browser engine  ! Especially the design of the (very popular) Social Media sites (Facebook, VK, instagram, twitter, tiktok, youtube e.a.), targeting mobile devices with touchscreens, with their "infinite-scroll" pages (where more content is loaded in memory as you scroll further), all that is a veritable menace to under-resourced and on "hardware-of-the-past" desktop machines... 

I am mentioning the above just to highlight the fact tab-hoarding has become a lot more difficult these days, especially on older (32-bit) OSes (which, by their nature, have worse RAM-handling/allocating capabilities than the recent 64-bit ones...). 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not passing judgement on @Cixert's workflow habits, just pointing out that his practice will simply get worse in the future, irrespective of browser/OS bugs...

Pre-quantum Mozilla forks, like the ones issued by Roytam1, are basically single-process applications, which, by that fact alone, makes them more lenient on system resources; if you only have a few vital extensions, an intelligently configured content-blocker, you try to stay clear of desktop-hostile places like the main Social sites, then I suspect you can afford to open more tabs there... But remember, single process means that if one tab crashes, it takes the whole browser with it!
On the subject of RAM consumption, let me also recommend the Lull-the-tabs legacy extension (by JustOff), which minimises significantly RAM consumption at browser start-up, especially when it tries to restore a large previous session... 

Looking for a similar add-on for Chromium browsers, The Great Suspender Original

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/the-great-suspender-origi/ahmkjjgdligadogjedmnogbpbcpofeeo

sounds promising, but I've not tried it myself, since I never have more than 25 tabs open in 360EEv12/13 (several of which are system tabs that don't consume RAM). Some more extensions to try are mentioned in: 

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/google-chrome-ram-memory-usage/

By the looks of it, Cixert has hit some session-restore bug on 360EEv11 that manifests itself under his specific usecase and/or OS configuration... In the following URL, 

https://www.webnots.com/8-ways-to-reduce-memory-and-cpu-usage-of-google-chrome/

I urge you to read chapters 2+3+4 ; if the session restore bug kicks-in at 151 opened tabs, then make sure you close the additional ones before exiting the browser; as others have said, you have to adapt to the browser's capabilities, should you wish to continue using 360EE... 

I'm not quite sure what is the exact OS/architecture this happens on, but later 360EE versions may fare better with regard to RAM management and session restore; have you tried 360EEv12 and/or 360EEv13? 

At the end of the day, if you find that none of the 360EE versions quench your work-related absolute need for 300 open tabs, you should consider staying with/switching to a browser that lets you do it... We can only help up to a point here, sadly... 

Best regards, stay safe 

I think it is a bug that occurs in 360 Extreme Explorer, since memory consumption suddenly skyrockets.
Technically I don't understand why if I cancel 360 Extreme cache and delete Windows XP x86 virtual memory the consumption of this type of memory increases.
(even a warning notice appears).
On older computers with SATA disks it does not crash, but rather slows down for many minutes at startup.
It is with the SSD that it crashes.
I would like to find a system to limit the memory consumption in 360, for example controlling the time that the tabs are kept open in RAM.
I have tried various extensions.
CAUTION The Great Suspender is removed from the Extension Center, according to Google the new version has spy code. In any case, the extension works to reduce the RAM using 360 but it does not reduce the RAM when starting 360 Extreme restoring tabs, but on the contrary, it increases it, since it must proceed to perform additional operations.
I have also tried the One Tab extension, with one button it concentrates all the tabs in one, but unfortunately restores them out of order.
I have found little tricks to restore tabs.
After a crash it sometimes works not to press the restore tabs button. I leave 360 with a tab for several minutes and then press control + shift + t and it restores the tabs without firing the RAM. It doesn't always work.
Yes it works to open 360 with a single tab and use the Tab Session Manager extension restoring the tabs from there, it does not fail and it does not increase the RAM.
Another option I have found is to override Isolation
chrome: // flags / # site-isolation-trial-opt-out
But I have not observed real effects.
I will test with 360 Extreme Explorer v13
I insist on thinking that it is a bug.
And one thing I am very clear about.
If something cannot be done with Windows XP it is something that does not interest me. Windows XP is forever or it won't be.
I would abandon computing  :-)

Edited April 8, 2021 by Cixert