NoelC Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Well, for what it's worth, as of 10074 at least Classic Shell is a little bit broken - nothing shows up in the Apps list. Normally we'd see all the Metro/Modern apps there. I've let the author know about it, though I imagine he's not keen to try to keep up with the changes in every build that Microsoft releases. -Noel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeA Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Whew! I'm glad that you said that about the Apps list in Classic Shell under 10074 -- the same thing happened to me and I thought that maybe some tweak I'd made had broken it. Normally, the apps not showing up wouldn't bother me in the least; in fact, we could view it as one way to dispense with all of those Metro cr*pps. But during this preview phase I do want to be able to get to the feedback app and Insider Hub. IIRC one of the Classic Shell developers said in their forum that they intend to make CS work with Win10 once it's "stable." --JorgeA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 I wondered whether the guy with the Pokemon avatar over there is a developer. In other news, speaking of impressions... As an exercise, since my Win 10 systems in VMs are all throwaways anyway, I re-enabled UAC and converted over to a full Microsoft cloud account. As might be expected, the process is utterly painless. I imagine they've put in man-centuries on making sure no one has a problem with going through it. Everything just continued to work, and I think something that wasn't starting up quickly during logon is now happier, as the logon process is quicker. I talked to Cortana a little and re-confirmed that the feature is still just a curiosity, and I explored what might be different (better/worse?) than the other extreme I had been experimenting with (UAC disabled, local account). I still am keeping OneDrive synchronization disabled, though I have no problem accessing the online server storage through more conventional means. It seems a bit less "we've got you in our cloud now, here's what we're going to do to you" than I had been thinking. Clearly any new value that one will derive from this OS will be in finding ways to embrace the new parts, as Microsoft hasn't really done anything to improve desktop operations. Rumor has it Microsoft is re-introducing some Aero Glass, but whether they will touch the parts of the theme that really matter remains to be seen. They may make it possible to have translucency, but keep all the controls as undifferentiated as they possibly can (e.g., square-edged, flat). I'm betting they'll make it as little like the Aero Glass Win 7 people know and love as they possibly can. One can't help but feel they're being almost childish about it. It seems to be the same kind of thing as a car maker that refused to paint any cars yellow, orange, or red because, well, that just wouldn't be considered "green". I've got this version pretty well tuned up now... Time for a new build to break things again. -Noel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formfiller Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Absolutely terrifying, to be honest. The electronic world as we know it could be crumbling before our very eyes. But try and speak up about it anywhere besides here, where we're (mostly) friendly to people who actually think, and most assuredly we'll be labeled as "haters". Such is the universe of users Microsoft has cultivated. -Noel You had a rough ride on Channel9 eh? You were far too calm and reasonable. You need to be aggressive with these guys. See here: http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/There-is-no-end-of-life-XP-problem?page=3 http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/E3-Smackdown?page=5 I have certainly shaped up my rhetoric skills there.. NuMicrosoft has cultivated a fanboy-base akin to that of a pyramidal scheme or multi-level marketing.. anyone outside of the bubble knows it's BS because it has proven time and time again that the schemes break down (the "success" of W8, WP, the controversy regarding ALL their products in the last few years). That's why you can't be nice with people who are still fully into the scheme. The only way of talking they might be receptive to is extreme confrontation. It's like with an alcoholic. Edited May 12, 2015 by Formfiller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 The only way of talking they might be receptive to is extreme confrontation. It's like with an alcoholic. What I find fascinating is understanding WHY (the heck) you actually want to talk to them and/or trying to convince them of anything, or rather WHY you insist so much on this. At the end of the day you appear as an anti-fan-boy with the same obstinacy and insistence the fan-boys show. I mean, I understand attempting to explain to them the truth once , it's OK twice , but from the third time onwards it seems to me like bordering obsessiveness. After all they have their own (wrong, but thanks to freedom legitimate) opinions, they gather in their own club and talk their nonsense between them, what is the reason why you go there and try over and over to gatecrash their little parties? And why do you come back here posting links to the discussions there where you exercised your increased by exercise rhetoric skills? You cannot help an alcoholic untill he/she actually wants to be helped, and in the case of the good guys at Channel9 it is by now evident that they don't want to be helped. jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formfiller Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) What I find fascinating is understanding WHY (the heck) you actually want to talk to them and/or trying to convince them of anything, or rather WHY you insist so much on this. I know it's fruitless. It has become something of silly a past-time (forum-chess). I am not the only "anti-metrotard" there by the way. I don't expect anything productive out of this. That ship has sailed. The above "advices" are strictly for Noel, who appeared on C9 and tried to be a "nice guy". Edited May 12, 2015 by Formfiller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I know it's fruitless. It has become something of silly a past-time (forum-chess). I am not the only "anti-metrotard" there by the way. I don't expect anything productive out of this. That ship has sailed.Good , then leave that d@mn ship cruising alone, the sea, the wind or some deity will decide on its destiny. The above "advices" are strictly for Noel, who appeared on C9 and tried to be a "nice guy".... but he completely failed at it, more or less openly calling them all a bunch of brainless/mindless jerks.Seemingly not that much "calm and reasonable".IMHO a given amount of bickering (as we - Noel and myself - often manage to put up ) may well be OK, since by now we know each other and there is (I hope reciprocal ) respect, and in a friendly place/environment like MSFN, it can even be - besides fun - constructive but being "aggressive" as you suggest with those guys over there seems like being leading to nowhere anyway.jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeA Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 IMO @Formfiller has the right best attitude for going into combat with these yahoos: he approaches it as a sport or game. Me, I would have a heck of a time keeping my cool (as happened to @NoelC). Worse than trying to reason with an alcoholic, it's like trying to talk to a roomful of seven-year-olds: unless you happen to be the teacher, they'll taunt you and make fun of you and keep repeating the same cr*p over and over again. You see it in Neowin too, maybe worse there. The amazing thing is how such a cult has managed to emerge for Microsoft. I mean, they were always the serious, dull, rational business-oriented company in contrast with Apple, which was the "fun" company with the fanatical following. (Those Apple TV ads contrasting the PC guy in a suit to the Apple hipster in jeans had a kernel of truth to them.) How on earth did that happen?? Maybe the Insiders forum is more congenial to people like us. Not only does our side seem to be dominating the discussion there , but by and large it's reasoned and mutually respectful. With the occasional outbreak of Stalinism by the mod... --JorgeA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formfiller Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) The amazing thing is how such a cult has managed to emerge for Microsoft. I mean, they were always the serious, dull, rational business-oriented company in contrast with Apple, which was the "fun" company with the fanatical following. (Those Apple TV ads contrasting the PC guy in a suit to the Apple hipster in jeans had a kernel of truth to them.) How on earth did that happen?? --JorgeA Microsoft made more often than not the right decisions in the past. Some people who rode the wave can't accept that this is not the case anymore. It's like finding out that your spouse is cheating on you. Some are drawing the line right there, others don't want to accept it and get angry at the people who have the incriminating photos. Edited May 12, 2015 by Formfiller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Thanks for noticin' me. I'm trying to remain moderate, as I cannot fully form an opinion on something until I have all the information. Call it an analytical mind at work or whatever. I'm not particularly rude by nature, and I like to think I try to be helpful when I can. I honestly don't know whether Windows 10 will be worth having - yet. I absolutely am NOT a "hater" nor "fanboy". I'm a "get it to work" kind of guy. I certainly cannot say Windows 10 won't be any good - yet. Nor can I say it's good - yet. Ultimately I'll probably adopt some version of it - perhaps not on the day of release - for my systems here. I always have so far. And I have always maintained the capability of dropping back if the meadow I think I'm stepping into unexpectedly becomes quicksand. I honestly don't know if the advantages of giving over one's information to Microsoft for cloud management could provide value that could outweigh the potential disadvantages. I also don't know whether the disadvantages we imagine will actually materialize. Certainly Microsoft hasn't a track record of tightly and perfectly managing privacy or quality. Take for example that they made everyone's Skype profile available to the world. Now we get unsolicited contact requests. Nor are they particularly good about delivering updates that are always perfect. There have certainly been reports of problems after updates. But on the other hand, I've personally gotten value by keeping current. My interactive systems here (save for a server I just set up that runs Win 7) are running Win 8.1 x64 Pro or MCE. Regardless of whether I'm a nice guy or aggressive, I'm trying to be moderate. I really do want to keep an open mind about many things, no matter whether others want to pigeon-hole me as a "hater" or a "fanboy". I have a crapload of real world experience and I know what works and what does not. Some parts of that are beyond needing prefix of "in my opinion". I am willing to share my experience and insight with those who'll listen. Those who don't, well, that's their problem. -Noel P.S., Jaclaz, since you mentioned it I do respect you and your experience - very much - and I'm glad you feel (as I do) that our debates can be generally positive for both of us. I hope I haven't come across as too much of a @$$#@+. Edited May 12, 2015 by NoelC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I hope I haven't come across as too much of a @$$#@+.Naah don' t worry when and if you came, come and will come as too much of it rest assured that I made, make and will make you notice it . jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tripredacus Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 This OS is driving me nuts. I've seen Explorer.exe crash during OOBE twice. You can't disable Cortana (or that search thing on the taskbar) without logging into a MS account. And now this... I've been using Win10 on a 4k notebook... It went to sleep and upon waking, certain elements of Windows are WAY TOO BIG. OK its cool. Not sure what happened... how did my icons get so big. I just had to take a screenshot of this! well... then this happened... Is that really necessary? ps: I was torn as to whether I should put this post here or in the Funny Farm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeA Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Considering the general thrust and tendency of the Windows UI since Metro in Win8, I guess the idea is that they assume that you, the user, are probably a 3-year-old with limited coordination and control of your fingers, therefore you need gigantic blocks to make sure that you manage to poke them somewhere. --JorgeA P.S. BTW, what's that bit in the Run dialog about an "Internet resource"?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 ps: I was torn as to whether I should put this post here or in the Funny Farm...Well posts on the Funny Farm should be fun, this one seems more like tragic than anything else Maybe when you were sleeping you started snoring very loud and Cortana catched it interpreting it as "enlaaaaarrrrrrgggge myicons" . jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn10950 Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 P.S. BTW, what's that bit in the Run dialog about an "Internet resource"?? I'm pretty sure that's for a URL to open in your default browser or a \\SERVER network location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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