Windows 8 - Deeper Impressions

[jaclaz]

No one would think a car made exactly as new cars were made in the 1970s is acceptable.  Remember those, that rusted-out in about 3 or 4 years?  That killed their occupants in the most minor of collisions?

 

 

You may need to take note that not ALL cars made in the 1970's were Ford Pinto's .

But of course you are right, about the attempt to make better (safer) products, with the only downside that sometimes they don't work or don't work as expected.

Getting more practical, in the 70's and 80's having a flat tire was if not "common" something that any driver experienced several times, it is now what, 15 years or 20 that myself or anyone in my family has not got one.

Something has become better, be it the wheels, the tires, the roads does not really matter, as long as the result is positive.

Still, dishwashers, washing machines and fridges made in the 70's often worked 20 years or more, without a hitch, while now we have electronic, touch screen, wi-fi enabled "intelligent" washing machines that will probably work for 3 or 5 years only (but you might get, while driving in your fully connected car, some three hundreds miles away, a senseless SMS telling you that the washing cycle ended successfully and that the machine is ready for a new one^[1]).

 

jaclaz

^[1] Btw, according to Murphy's Law, the message will be in Korean and you will be distracted by it and crash into the road barrier 

[JorgeA]

Windows Technical Preview weighs in around 4GB, here's where the download will be

 

Wondering if I should quintuple-boot on the machine where, in addition to the original Windows 7, I also have the Windows 8 DP, CP, and RP. Prudence suggests I should install it somewhere else...

 

Anybody else planning to give the Technical Preview a spin?

 

--JorgeA

 

[JorgeA]

Windows 9: Telemetry data will be near real-time

 

Microsoft will be using a new system, codenamed 'Asimov', that will provide a near real-time view of what is happening on users' machines. Before you freak out and think Microsoft is watching all of your mouse clicks, our knowledge of the system indicates that the data is obscured and aggregated, but affords Microsoft new insights into user interactions with the OS. Mary Jo Foley, who uncovered the codename, says that the system was originally built by the Xbox Team.

 

The idea is quite simple: gather as much data as possible to make sure that the user experience is exactly like Microsoft has envisioned. With more telemetry data, it will help the team behind the OS make sure that updates, features, and every other aspect are all working correctly and if not, they will have high-quality data to troubleshoot the issue.

 

I'm not sure how much of an opportunity testers will have to put into actual words any concerns they might have, but one thing I intend to do is to repeatedly type "Aero Glass" in the Search function.    And any time I accidentally find myself in the Metro environment, I will leave immediately.

 

Wonder how much and how closely Microsoft will be watching. Maybe I'll try to install Office 2000 and the CompuServe Information Manager to see what happens...

 

--JorgeA

 

[JorgeA]

Heh, heh... this is rich in more ways than one -- take your pick:

 

Apple still uses Windows XP in its production factories -- It's time to upgrade guys

 

Thanks to a report and video from CNBC, who were looking at how the iPhone 6 is made, Neowin spotted one of the many Apple machines running Windows XP. The install has been customized to be running the old, trusty silver theme, an alternative to the Bliss theme which came as standard in Windows XP.

 

--JorgeA

 

[NoelC]

Anybody else planning to give the Technical Preview a spin?

 

--JorgeA

 

Of course, but in a VMware virtual machine.  Multiple booting is getting to be a bad idea, with Microsoft thinking they don't actually have to leave the file system in a stable state any more.

 

-Noel

[MagicAndre1981]

Anybody else planning to give the Technical Preview a spin?

 

 

I'll try it in a VM and later maybe in Native VHD Boot to see how it works on real hardware.

[TELVM]

Is this some kind of prank? (honest question):

 

 

 

http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/30/6868695/microsoft-windows-10-announced-official

Edited September 30, 2014 by TELVM

[Kelsenellenelvian]

If it is real i like it. Still kinda ugly but tons better than 8

[Aero7x64]

I'm not impressed so far. Microsoft didn't show any way to use full Windows Aero or use locations instead of live titles. If this would be what they release I wouldn't upgrade. I will test this in virtual machine when iso is downloadable.

 

And is this some kind of joke?

 

Verge:

 

10:50:04 AM PDT

Q: When it comes to your enterprise customers about Windows 10. How big has the push back been to get Windows away from Live Tiles, back to Windows 7 stuff?

 

10:50:19 AM PDT

A: We don't hear pushback that we don't like Live Tiles. We hear pushback about too much training.

 

Seriously how they could not hear this. They must have had ear plugs on their ears. I will definately send them feedback trough Windows Insider preview program about possibility to use full Windows Aero theme and possibility to use locations (right side colum) with start menu.

Edited September 30, 2014 by Aero7x64

[Tripredacus]

Its funny, that guy isn't even using that "computer" he is standing in front of.

[JorgeA]

It's pretty neat that the new OS will be able to tell whether it's being used on a PC or a tablet, and change its look accordingly on the fly.

 

But I'm hoping that the concept of adjusting the UI to the hardware will extend as far as reviving Aero Glass so that people with powerful enough machines have the option to enjoy a more pleasant working environment.

 

And... why jump over 9 to call it "Windows 10"? I don't get the reasoning there.

 

--JorgeA

 

P.S. I forgot to mention the universal search from the Start Menu. I hope that one can disable this -- if I want to look up references to baseball on my PC, I don't want to be inundated by millions of irrelevant results from the Web. Even if they're somehow listed in separate categories, I'm not sure that I want to deal with mentally processing one type of result vs. another. If I want to look up something on the Web, I'm competent enough to launch a browser, thank you.

 

If made the default value, this "feature" has the potential to annoy and turn off further millions of people from Windows.

 

 

Edited September 30, 2014 by JorgeA

[JorgeA]

 

Anybody else planning to give the Technical Preview a spin?

 

--JorgeA

 

Of course, but in a VMware virtual machine.  Multiple booting is getting to be a bad idea, with Microsoft thinking they don't actually have to leave the file system in a stable state any more.

 

-Noel

 

 

Can you fill me in on the part about leaving (or not leaving) the file system in a stable state? If there's no time to explain, a link or search term will do and I'll take it from there, thanks.

 

--JorgeA

[Formfiller]

Well, at least it's better than Windows 8. This thing is basically Windows 7 with a Windows 8 theme. Not exciting in any way, but I can live with it.

 

The only surprise was the name - and the reason for skipping the version number sounds like a lame troll attempt:

 

"Microsoft's Terry Myerson said that Windows 10 is a more appropriate name, given the extent of the changes in this release versus the previous version."

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-confirms-its-next-os-will-be-called-windows-10

 

Oh man, not even analysts would fall for this.

 

By the way, the neowin thread is great for watching Dot Matrix spouting some high quality diarrhea - claiming that metro is still "front and center" and other crazies. Highly recommended if you started to miss getting metrotarded.

[Formfiller]

The collected wisdoms of sir Matrix:

 

Love that Metro is still front and center here. As it should be.

If you want "Windows 7 stuff", then use Windows 7. Windows 10 is not, nor will be Windows 7. Terry Myerson said it himself when he announced Windows was at a threshold. The world in which Windows grew up has changed.

Metro is still the default view. Not sure how it being on the desktop changes that, either.

Start is still Start. The Store is still there, and will be a big part of the OS, as will Universal Apps.

Start Screen is still there, Charms Bar is also still there, and will be getting an update. Live Tiles are still the center of attention in the menu, and Universal Apps are a key part of the OS.

 

If you're talking about the desktop itself, then yes, I said it was dead, but it seems like Microsoft listen, and brought Metro to it, and will be evolving it, just like we saw today with new multitasking features, and scalable bits, and judging by what was said, it sounds as if there's still more to come.

So, if you want, I guess you could say the old, stale desktop of Windows past is dead.

Live Tiles are front and center on the Menu and Screen. The menu also picked up many of the Start Screen's feature, seeing how it is nothing more than a Mini Start. It scales up or down, something the old menu never did.

>"You said the Charms bar would never be removed from the desktop."

So far, it hasn't been.

>"You said the Store apps would never be resizable."

No, I didn't. They've been resizable from the start, and even more so in Windows 8.1, scalable to different sizes. The whole point of Metro apps was to introduce apps that scale.

>"You said the Start Menu would never be back."

Technically, it hasn't been back. The new "menu" is based off the Start Screen, picks up its features, and is completely scalable, and resizable.
 

[NoelC]

 

Can you fill me in on the part about leaving (or not leaving) the file system in a stable state? If there's no time to explain, a link or search term will do and I'll take it from there, thanks.

 

--JorgeA

 

 

Sure. 

 

First, in a nutshell, Windows 8 (if you haven't reconfigured it not to use Hybrid/Fast Boot) can and does leave the file system in a "dirty" state when it is shut down.  One of the first things I recommend is to disable Hybrid/Fast Boot, even if you're not going to dual-boot.  But imagine shutting Windows 8 down with a dirty file system, then having another (older) OS come along and clean it up at bootup.

 

Then there's the LFS Version...  Consider the following command:

 

 

C:\TEMP>fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo c:

NTFS Volume Serial Number :       0xdc00eddf00edc11e

NTFS Version   :                  3.1

LFS Version    :                  2.0

Number Sectors :                  0x00000000df846fff

Total Clusters :                  0x000000001bf08dff

Free Clusters  :                  0x000000000c120f4a

Total Reserved :                  0x0000000000000fc0

Bytes Per Sector  :               512

Bytes Per Physical Sector :       512

Bytes Per Cluster :               4096

Bytes Per FileRecord Segment    : 1024

Clusters Per FileRecord Segment : 0

Mft Valid Data Length :           0x0000000053f00000

Mft Start Lcn  :                  0x00000000000c0000

Mft2 Start Lcn :                  0x0000000000000002

Mft Zone Start :                  0x000000000f6a8d80

Mft Zone End   :                  0x000000000f6b55a0

Resource Manager Identifier :     2AFD1794-8CEE-11E1-90F4-005056C00008

 

Do the above command on a Windows 7 system and note that the Log File Structure version isn't shown.  That's because it's 1.1.  I don't know all the implications of having the Log File Structure unrecognized by an older system, but it surely doesn't sound good.

 

This link has info that's exactly pertinent:

 

http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/15645.windows-8-volume-compatibility-considerations-with-prior-versions-of-windows.aspx

 

-Noel