Windows 10 - Deeper Impressions

[JorgeA]

 

While we're on the topic of configurable routers, I'm wondering if it is feasible to place a router in front of or behind another router.

 

Reason I ask is that I'm using a Verizon-supplied DSL router/modem. I admit that my knowledge of networking technology remains very fuzzy, and so I don't know if (for example) Verizon might have either a technical or contractual problem with my outright replacing its router with a third-party router. And thus I'm wondering about putting a third-party router either in front of or behind VZ's router, for the purpose of using it to block unwanted connections to Microsoft without the OS objecting

 

    Absolutely you can.  If you're not concerned about port forwarding (for accessing services or servers on your network), there's no reason you can't disable the WiFi on your cable/DSL modem, plug the WAN port of a quality router into one of your modem's LAN ports and use your new router's WiFi/LAN ports instead.  There's no risk of breaking anything since your new router will simply appear to the modem as another device.  In fact, this is highly recommended given that the WiFi on many ISP modems isn't that great to begin with.  The Asus routers I listed earlier all get top marks for wireless performance, in addition to being supported by Tomato.

 

Great to know, thanks!

 

BTW my setup is even simpler, as there is no wireless involved -- all connections are via Ethernet cable. (Physician wife has concerns about the long-term health implications of adding local EM waves to the already existing soup from outside sources.)

 

Looks like I have a couple of ways to go here. I could either set things up wall---VZ router---new router---switch---PCs, or I could do wall---VZ router---switch, and then connect the other PCs to the switch and use one of the switch's LAN ports for the new router, which would then lead to the Windows 10 machine specifically.

 

 

There is another factor to throw into the mix. A couple of years ago, my VZ-supplied Westell F90 router burned out and they sent me a new one. It was an arcane, convoluted process to get Verizon to recognize/authorize it or whatever the procedure is called, so I'm not eager to go through that again.    I ended up having to make several phone calls to Verizon tech support (which in itself is a nightmarish experience) to get back on the 'Net.

 

 

Actually, it does seem to give a pretty fair amount of configuration options. A few years ago, @Tripredacus even found a quite advanced manual for the Westell, which I made sure to download.

But the settings and much of the manual are beyond my pay grade.     Here are a few screenshots to illustrate:

 

Westell Advanced.jpg Westell Custom Firewall.jpg

 

Westell Firewall.jpg

But I haven't seen anything in there expressly relating to an ability to blacklist specific addresses, let alone create a large Hosts-type file.

 

    Those look like the Westell 7500 modem configuration pages.  These modems offer little as far as customizability is concerned.  I've had many of these where a customer wanted content filtering and I couldn't even specify the DNS servers without turning off DHCP on the Internet side, which would cause problems of its own.  Such a basic setting!

 

Man, you are good -- I forgot to type in the number of that Westell series of routers and you still knew what it was!

 

 

 

    Anyway, I have quite a bit of experience setting up networks of various sizes, and would gladly assist you guys if you would like.  Just create a thread over in the Networking section, and PM/link me so I find it.  Noel, if I don't show up for awhile, you might need to get my attention elsewhere.  My MSFN email notifications worked great when I joined, but suddenly stopped working on July 20 and haven't worked since.  I'm only here now because I used a disposable email address to get re-confirmed.  My half-dozen PMs regarding the issue have gone completely unanswered. 

 

Thank you for the offer, I might just take you up on it.

 

Regarding the MSFN notifications, I stopped getting them at the end of May last year and then they spontaneously started coming in again a month ago. The IPB gods work in mysterious ways...

 

--JorgeA

[j7n]

If you're not concerned about port forwarding (for accessing services or servers on your network), there's no reason you can't disable the WiFi on your cable/DSL modem, plug the WAN port of a quality router into one of your modem's LAN ports and use your new router's WiFi/LAN ports instead.

In most cases you could forward a generous range of ports, or all of them, on the limited modem, toward the new router behind the modem, and set up detailed NAT policy on the quality router.

If one isn't prepared to do an installation of custom software onto a router and often resort to the command line, but still needs detailed firewall options, a Mikrotik RouterBoard (such as the hAP or the 3011) with a responsive, compact Windows GUI might make an attractive option. In this case, I can't recommend it, because the built-in DNS server can't handle more than about 500 or so static entries, nor directly parse a hosts file. It works for me, I manually add blocked entries and local hostnames as they are needed. They can be loaded via a script; DHCP DNS can be disabled; user's DNS can be redirected via NAT; any MAC can be assigned to a port; wifi can work on any frequency without needing the ddwrt superchannel 'license', and other common options.

[JorgeA]

Woody Leonhard reports another new upgrade outrage:

 

Banishing 'Get Windows 10' nagware isn't as easy as you think

 

If you're running Windows 7 or 8.1 on a computer that isn't attached to a domain, you're no doubt familiar with the "Get Windows 10" ads that try to convince you -- sometimes subtly, sometimes forcefully -- to install Windows 10. Microsoft's intrusive campaign has drawn much well-deserved ire among Windows customers. I think it represents a new low in Microsoft marketing -- right down there in the Scroogled end of the gene pool.

 

[...]

• Beginning about a month ago the KB3035583 update started installing a new background task -- beyond the ones previous versions already installed -- that resets the AllowOSUpgrade value to 1 (enabled) twice a day. Not all users have this background task -- I don't know how Microsoft decides how these things get distributed -- but for those who do, changing this value like [bott] suggests will only help you for 12 hours or less.

[emphasis added]

 

It's beyond clear now that Microsoft has no respect for its customers.

 

--JorgeA

 

P.S. I'll bet Josh Mayfield didn't expect that maintaining his tool would turn into a full-time proposition...

[jaclaz]

So, Windows 10 is more secure than previous Windows OS's.

 

Too bad that it is the ONLY OS here:

https://technet.microsoft.com/library/security/MS16-007

 

where 5 (five) items out of 6 are considered "important", whilst all the older OS's are affected by only one ...

 

jaclaz

[NoelC]

Banishing 'Get Windows 10' nagware isn't as easy as you think

 

 

It's exactly as easy as *I* think.  No nagware here on my multiple systems.

 

I've been posting here about people needing to be wary of Windows Updates since I joined in 2013 (and certainly far before that elsewhere).

 

Feels both bad to realize I am right and good to know the folks who tell me I wear a tin foil hat haven't got a clue what's real and what isn't.

 

And I'll reiterate:  It's time to think about whether you want to divorce yourself from Windows Update on any and all of your systems.  What bugs have they left to fix?  Do you want the same people who are willing to code "GWX" to be changing the system software you already know well? 

 

You might opt to keep getting "security" fixes, or not, but you at least need to THINK about it!  And you CERTAINLY need to vet every update.  Anyone who still has Windows Update on full automatic is irresponsible to say the least.

 

-Noel

Edited January 12, 2016 by NoelC

[JorgeA]

Here are more details from Woody on what's going on with that infamous GWX update:

 

How 'Get Windows 10' sets its hooks into Windows 7 and 8.1

 

Over the weekend, a barrage of tests proved what many of you had feared: Even if you use the Microsoft-sanctioned DisableGWX and DisableOSUpgrade registry settings, the KB 3035583 patch still installs all of the Get Windows 10 nagware. GWX and all of its components sit there, hidden, running in the background even if you can't see the Get Windows 10 icon in the system tray.

 

[...]

 

Several of us, sensing that the game was afoot, undertook a thorough examination of those four Registry entries to see what they really do. We found that, although the Registry entries succeed in keeping the most visible part of GWX from appearing -- the Get Windows 10 icon in the system tray -- they do absolutely nothing to keep GWX off of Windows 7 and 8.1 PCs. In fact, the phalanx of programs, settings, scheduled tasks, and automatic Registry-changers continue to work behind the scenes no matter how you jigger those settings.

 

I looked at installation of KB 3035583 on brand-spanking-new Windows 7 SP1 and Windows 8.1 Update 1 PCs. I adjusted the Registry settings as prescribed on fresh installs of Home and Pro. Then I ran exactly one update -- KB 3035583 -- on all of the PCs. Sure enough, the Get Windows 10 icon didn't appear in the system tray, but all of the Get Windows 10 accoutrements (described below) are installed and fully functional.

 

And:

 

Mayfield found that the DisableGWX Registry entry merely prevents the Get Windows 10 icon in the system tray from appearing. "Having this entry in place does not prevent the KB 3035583 patch from being installed, and it doesn't prevent the other background tasks associated with the patch from running."

 

[...]

 

Most damning: Uninstalling KB 3035583 doesn't uninstall any of the files in the GWX folder or remove the scheduled tasks. Uninstalling it merely rolls you back to an earlier version of KB 3035583.

 

In short, I've never seen such a robust "Potentially Unwanted Program."

 

I suppose that all of this applies to people who ever did install KB3035583 and then thought they were removing it by following the official instructions.

 

Woody's final line:

 

Confidence and trust -- at least among the cognoscenti -- is withering away.

 

A pertinent comment by a reader on Woody's own website:

 

At this point in time, I doubt that I will ever buy another product that has anything to do with Microsoft. Things that turn themselves back on or change your settings to something you do not want are nothing but malware no matter who they are made by. My confidence and trust in Microsoft is long gone.

 

Trust is hard to get, easy to lose and almost impossible to get back.

 

--JorgeA

 

[NoelC]

Withering away?  More like a dead weed from two seasons ago...

 

 

Not running into any bugs with my Win 7 or 8.1 systems.  Tell me again why I should want patches?

 

 

-Noel

[helpdesk98]

I moved back to Win 7 has my primary and the only issue I have come across I the lack of desk space. I have been converting my what was my Windows 8.1 system into a Linux system and using my W7 system for support. I need it terminal commands; I have been stuck in dependency he**! lol

[bpalone]

I moved back to Win 7 has my primary and the only issue I have come across I the lack of desk space. I have been converting my what was my Windows 8.1 system into a Linux system and using my W7 system for support. I need it terminal commands; I have been stuck in dependency he**! lol

 

If you only load programs from the Distro's Repository you shouldn't have any dependancy issues.  Now, you may be having some hardware issues, which for new hardware is still sometimes an issue, then I understand.  Might want to try a different distro  if there are to many issues.  Once, you get the hardware working, it will probably be very stable and easy to use.

 

@Noel:

 

You nailed it on the head.  The Trust Factor is LONG GONE.   And, for what it is worth, I never trusted updates, from day one.  So, we must get our headware from the same source.

[TELVM]

Banishing 'Get Windows 10' nagware isn't as easy as you think

 

Epic exchange of comments    :

 

Actually, it's extremely easy to get rid of these (GWX) notifications. Here's what I did.  Just install Windows 10. I did this for all my PCs and I never got a notification again.  Seriously, why wouldn't want to upgrade to Windows 10? It's the best version of Windows yet, and ... blah blah ... (shilling routine)

 

^ For those who want to avoid being murdered, commit suicide. Problem solved!

[JorgeA]

 

Epic exchange of comments    :

 

Actually, it's extremely easy to get rid of these (GWX) notifications. Here's what I did.  Just install Windows 10. I did this for all my PCs and I never got a notification again.  Seriously, why wouldn't want to upgrade to Windows 10? It's the best version of Windows yet, and ... blah blah ... (shilling routine)

 

^ For those who want to avoid being murdered, commit suicide. Problem solved!

 

 

 

It reminds me of the "advice" that women fearing rape used to be given (supposedly):

 

Just lie back and enjoy it.

 

--JorgeA

[JorgeA]

Woody Leonhard has been on a tear over the last week:

 

Microsoft walks a thin line between Windows 10 telemetry and snooping

 

The retained data goes way beyond typical usage information. I, for one, was shocked to find out how much Microsoft keeps as personally identifiable telemetry entries. In the process of the Windows 10 Fall Update flip-flop, we learned that Microsoft had in its files historical settings for four security preferences -- advertising ID, Background apps, SmartScreen Filter, and Sync with devices -- for every single Windows 10 machine.

 

That should make you wonder exactly how much information Microsoft is keeping about your specific machine.

 

[...]

 

Experiments conducted immediately after that post showed that Windows 10 was collecting data even with the myriad privacy settings turned off, and sending it to bing.com. What data? We don't know. Microsoft encrypts everything prior to sending it to its servers, and it has yet to give a full accounting.

 

I also don't buy the idea that Microsoft is throwing away all of its personally identifiable telemetry data. While we haven't seen much advertising in Windows 10 yet -- the Weather Universal app showed ads for a short time in the beta, and the advertising entries in the Start menu (Start > Settings > Personalization > Start > "Occasionally show suggestions in Start") appear sporadically -- I think it's a fair guess that we'll see more advertising in the not-too-distant future.

 

--JorgeA

 

[NoelC]

If you're considering whether you need to install an update, of course you have to read what's written about the update.  If it's vague, then they're trying to hide something or be lazy, and you have to ask yourself:

 

Do I want to change out my operating system software for something written by someone trying to hide something or being too lazy to write even a few lines of documentation?

 

Have you checked your Reliability Monitor to see what problems you have actually experienced lately?

 

 

-Noel

[helpdesk98]

 

If you only load programs from the Distro's Repository you shouldn't have any dependancy issues.  Now, you may be having some hardware issues, which for new hardware is still sometimes an issue, then I understand.  Might want to try a different distro  if there are to many issues.  Once, you get the hardware working, it will probably be very stable and easy to use.

 

 

 

I was download programs that were not in the free list (virtual box, wine, ect) did not realize you could point yum extender to a non-free repository (would have saved me a lot of time) 

 

before I decided to put Linux on the computer I tried to install 10 just to see how it was on a real machine. I blue screened on first boot lol!

[JorgeA]

 

 

If you only load programs from the Distro's Repository you shouldn't have any dependancy issues.  Now, you may be having some hardware issues, which for new hardware is still sometimes an issue, then I understand.  Might want to try a different distro  if there are to many issues.  Once, you get the hardware working, it will probably be very stable and easy to use.

 

 

 

I was download programs that were not in the free list (virtual box, wine, ect) did not realize you could point yum extender to a non-free repository (would have saved me a lot of time) 

 

before I decided to put Linux on the computer I tried to install 10 just to see how it was on a real machine. I blue screened on first boot lol!

 

 

The way the Linux repositories are organized is a bit of a mystery to me. I've been experimenting with a Netrunner installation; one category in the Muon Package Manager is labeled "multiverse", with no explanation of what that might possibly mean.

 

A user-friendly setup would include descriptions of the categories, or at least links to online explanations. That's one area where Windows has historically been superior to Linux. Not perfect of course -- just better.

 

--JorgeA