well some of those programs id rather not have because there slow or annoying or useless to me like zone alarm (i use ipcop instead) quicktime (quicktime alternative is smaller and has no startup items) realplayer (real alternative is smaller and has no startup items) yahoo messenger (include gaim or trillian instead winzip (not free i suggest tugzip) winrar (not free i suggest tugzip) acrobat reader (slow, bigm, foxit reader would be better) msn messenger 7.0 (why not use 7.5 or include gaim or trillian instead) it would be better to have these programs in a seperate patch its a nice idea though