Could Web Enviornment Integrity block old operating systems?

[Xack]

In the last few weeks there has been a lot of concerns about Google's new Web Environment Integrity proposal and its possible effects on web freedom. One particular concern that I don't feel can be addressed is the fact that old versions of Windows (and other unsupported operating systems) are likely to not be certified meaning only "supported" systems will be able to access large amounts of the internet if the proposal is successful. Expect large amounts of sites to use it, including banking websites, paywalled news sites, DRM'd video sites and social networks that could potentially be blocked from being accessed. Since remote attestation will be used and possibly be enforced by TPMs and signed drivers it might be impossible to get say Windows 7 to be certified for a WEI protected site. If you want to be able to continue to browse the web on older operating systems please oppose the proposal for WEI.

[nicolaasjan]

A valid concern.

Also, @roytam1would have to implement support in his browsers as well, or else websites that use this API would just not work, even if the underlying OS would be trusted.

Googles own sites, like Gmail and YouTube would be among the first to implement this...

Also, no more video downloading with e.g. yt-dlp.

 

Code has been committed to the Chromium source already.

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If you want to be able to continue to browse the web on older operating systems please oppose the proposal for WEI.

 

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US:

* https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/report-antitrust-violation

* [antitrust@ftc.gov](mailto:antitrust@ftc.gov)
 

EU:

* https://competition-policy.ec.europa.eu/antitrust/contact_en

* [comp-greffe-antitrust@ec.europa.eu](mailto:comp-greffe-antitrust@ec.europa.eu)
 

UK:

* https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tell-the-cma-about-a-competition-or-market-problem

* [general.enquiries@cma.gov.uk](mailto:general.enquiries@cma.gov.uk)
 

India:

* https://www.cci.gov.in/antitrust/

* https://www.cci.gov.in/filing/atd
 

Canada:

* https://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/eic/site/cb-bc.nsf/frm-eng/GHÉT-7TDNA5

 

https://vivaldi.com/blog/googles-new-dangerous-web-environment-integrity-spec/

https://github.com/mozilla/standards-positions/issues/852#issuecomment-1648820747

(pinging @VistaLover)

Edited August 1, 2023 by nicolaasjan

[nicolaasjan]

New Google Chrome browser security plan slammed by experts

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Google has received Internet-wide backlash for plans it has drawn up which consider the implementation of what it calls a Web Environment Integrity (WEI) API.

The four authors behind the WEI explainer article explain how such an API would allow servers to “evaluate the authenticity of the device” in order to prevent some types of fraud, however comments on the GitHub page were largely negative.

 

Among the many complaints, some users raised concerns about surveillance and discrimination, while others called for approval by regulatory bodies and indeed for Google to compare the preposition to the W3C code of Ethics.

Google backlash

To add insult to injury, Google is now facing criticism from rival browser makers, including some that use the Chromium foundations.

Brave co-founder and CEO (and ex-Mozilla CEO) Brendan Eich pointed out on Twitter that the browser will not be shipping with support for Google’s proposed API, comparing it to other “junk” that Google puts into Chromium which Brave disables.

Firefox developer Brian Grinstead posted on a GitHub thread that “Mozilla opposes this proposal,” suggesting that other avenues for detecting fraud and invalid traffic should be explored.

Vivaldi developer Julien Picalausa called the result of Google’s developers’ work “toxic” and “dangerous,” but in a glimmer of hope, Picalausa suggests that the EU will almost certainly want to look into the effects of the WEI API should it be given the green flag by Google.

 

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We also asked Google whether it had anything further to add beyond last week’s comment, when a company spokesperson told us that the program had been paused, and directed us in the face of early backlash to a response by the explainer article’s author, which concluded:

“We welcome collaboration on a solution for scaled anti-abuse that respects user privacy, while maintaining the open nature of the web.”

 

 

[Milkinis]

this is the outcome of building all browsers with the same source code.

if dad google says something all other sheeps have to follow up

 

[OutlawHusbando]

Stop using Google Chrome asap if you don't want to see this disaster, only a loss of 60% market share can stop Google from doing DRM for WWW.

 

If you don't want to live in a world without yt-dlp, MPV.

[Milkinis]

6 minutes ago, OutlawHusbando said:

Stop using Google Chrome asap

@NotHereToPlayGames 

[NotHereToPlayGames]

This WEI stuff is going to fall flat on its face.  And it certainly will NOT be because of Mozilla and their 2.79% market share - https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share

Technically, my preferred browser of choice is not "Google Chrome" -

[Milkinis]

1 hour ago, NotHereToPlayGames said:

Technically, my preferred browser of choice is not "Google Chrome" -

technically, ''chromium'' is is a free open-source software project created by Google

apparently it's the latency-free browser that scored 300 points on speedometer. 

 

[NotHereToPlayGames]

Keyword being "open-source".  Ungoogled Chromium does not equal Google Chrome.  Just like Serpent 52 does not equal Firefox 52.

321 today, woot woot.  Still the BEST quantifiable number until proven otherwise.

I like this one because it doesn't only score the browser, but it scores the network also.  Kind of like running a browser test and a network speed test with one test.  (later tests indicate network does not effect score)

I'm still on v113.  Have not tested newer yet.  If they score lower on Speedometer, then I don't upgrade, that's the way I roll.

Edited August 5, 2023 by NotHereToPlayGames

[Milkinis]

11 minutes ago, NotHereToPlayGames said:

I like this one because it doesn't only score the browser, but it scores the network also.  Kind of like running a browser test and a network speed test with one test.

there's another website best suited for such a network speed test

https://msfn.org/board/topic/184624-arcticfoxienotheretoplaygames-360chrome-v1352036-rebuild-1/?do=findComment&comment=1243939

 

[UCyborg]

Don't know where you're getting such numbers, the best I get on average is 83 (rounded down) on work laptop (Edge 114, 40 Mbps D/L speed, Intel Core i7-6700HQ @ 2,60 GHz).

[NotHereToPlayGames]

Work laptop.  Ungoogled v113.  Wired LAN.  Win10 Enterprise 21H2 x64.  i7-12850HX @ 2.10 GHz.  32 GB RAM.

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by NotHereToPlayGames

[NotHereToPlayGames]

Same work laptop but now connected via wireless instead of wired LAN.  I guess wireless versus wired isn't affecting my score here at work (it definitely does at home).

[nicolaasjan]

Speedometer (on Linux); new clean test profiles; 100 Mbps D/L speed :

Firefox Nightly 118: 129

Chromium dev. 117.0.5929.0: 109

[Milkinis]

double post.

Edited August 4, 2023 by Milkinis