White flash

[Peter]

Maybe you can help me with the following.

In windows 8, 10, 11 there is a white lightning flash when you open a folder window. It is not there in windows xp and windows 7. You can only see the white flash when darker colors than white are used in the windows theme!

When a folder window is opened then windows 10 starts to build the colors of that window, it starts with white! In xp when you open a folder on the desktop it just starts with the color of the background of the desktop. But in w10 it starts with white. Not everybody notices it because a lot of people use the original theme of windows and in that case almost everything is white. The problem is a bit solved when the windows animations are all on but I don't like those irritating animations. Even now when people start using black themes microsoft hasn't done anything to change this. It seems hard coded in the product.

Link to a youtube movie made by someone where you can see that it starts building the window with white.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKUA2ycceak

Discussion at microsoft.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/high-contrast-themes-issue/ff386d33-dcfe-4116-8d4a-9c8cd06eb4c0

Could you help me solving this problem?

 

Edited August 18 by Peter
formatting

[Dixel]

12 hours ago, Peter said:

When a folder window is opened then windows 10 starts to build the colors of that window, it starts with white! In xp when you open a folder on the desktop it just starts with the color of the background of the desktop.

There's nothing you can about it, it's hardcoded that way, In XP you could change the background folder, in 10 - not. The white 255-255-255 colour is default.

[Dixel]

On a side note, you can try a faster RAM and CPU, it should be less noticeable, then. Also, remove thumbnails generating software to free up the resources for faster rendering.

[Peter]

45 minutes ago, Dixel said:

There's nothing you can about it, it's hardcoded that way, In XP you could change the background folder, in 10 - not. The white 255-255-255 colour is default.

But there must be some place in the code where you can change the default behavior.

Where could that place be?

[D.Draker]

On 8/18/2024 at 3:12 PM, Peter said:

But there must be some place in the code where you can change the default behavior.

Where could that place be?

Even if you manage to mod the files, you'd have to disable Windows 10 files protection first, and at least to have a bit of skills.

Modded files will be overwritten by numerous Win10 updates, you'd have to redo many times, it's not worth it in my opinion.

[Peter]

59 minutes ago, D.Draker said:

Even if you manage to mod the files, you'd have to disable Windows 10 files protection first, and at least to have a bit of skills.

Modded files will be overwritten by numerous Win10 updates, you'd have to redo many times, it's not worth it in my opinion.

Files will not be overwritten because I never update any windows so that is not a problem. I believe it is possible to remove the windows 10 protection in various ways. But I don't know where the code is that has to be changed.

 

In windows 7 a folder would open using the background color of the current theme but in w10 it always opens with white!

 

 

 

Edited August 19 by Peter
formatting

[D.Draker]

13 hours ago, Peter said:

In windows 7 a folder would open using the background color of the current theme but in w10 it always opens with white!

When I tried Win7, it also had a white burst with a hacked dark theme applied. And in Win7 you can't officially change the white folder background.

[TSNH]

Were you using Windows 7 without DWM? (Windows 7 basic, Classic or high contrast theme).

If so then Windows 10 doesn't support running without DWM, but I'm sure these guys https://winclassic.boards.net/ tried making it work (I haven't read into details).

Dark theme implementation in Windows 10 and 11 is still far behind what could be achieved with custom themes and classic theme, it doesn't recolor the UI automatically like those custom and classic themes did, but every single app must support it. There are still many apps in Windows that don't.

[UCyborg]

Testing in my Win10 20H2, there seems to be something at fundamental level. Creating bare bones app with a window, I made it use red color for background, hints here. So register a class, create a (initially hidden) window, then show it. I made a breakpoint before ShowWindow and right afterwards. After it went in ShowWindow, window was briefly shown in white and then it switched to red. Without color specified, it would stay white.

On Windows XP, when it finished with ShowWindow, the window's content (technically called client area) was see-through if background color isn't specified, but if it is, the selected color is seen right away.

I'm sure Microsoft could optimize it if they wanted or go with the right theme dependent color right away, but it's probably low on priority list, if it's there at all!

Edited August 28 by UCyborg

[D.Draker]

20 hours ago, UCyborg said:

I'm sure Microsoft could optimise it if they wanted or go with the right theme dependent colour right away, but it's probably low on priority list, if it's there at all!

No plans! Ophthalmologists need work, try to understand.

[Peter]

22 hours ago, UCyborg said:

Testing in my Win10 20H2, there seems to be something at fundamental level. Creating bare bones app with a window, I made it use red color for background, hints here. So register a class, create a (initially hidden) window, then show it. I made a breakpoint before ShowWindow and right afterwards. After it went in ShowWindow, window was briefly shown in white and then it switched to red. Without color specified, it would stay white.

On Windows XP, when it finished with ShowWindow, the window's content (technically called client area) was see-through if background color isn't specified, but if it is, the selected color is seen right away.

I'm sure Microsoft could optimize it if they wanted or go with the right theme dependent color right away, but it's probably low on priority list, if it's there at all!

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/high-contrast-themes-issue/ff386d33-dcfe-4116-8d4a-9c8cd06eb4c0

In the above link it says:

Windows 7's classic themes were rendered using GDI graphics rendering (the "Windows 98 graphics engine").

In Windows 8 and higher, the entire desktop is always drawn using the DWM graphics engine.  That engine was formerly known as "Aero" in Windows 7 and Vista and back then it was optional, but now it's mandatory. For programs not built for Aero/DWM, it will cause this flash, particularly in "tablet mode" (it's less noticeable or even gone if you turn off tablet mode).

Shawn "Cmdr" Keene | Microsoft MVP 2010-2024 | CmdrKeene.com | tweet: @CmdrKeene
Microsoft MVPs are independent experts offering real-world answers. Learn more at mvp.microsoft.com.


Do you think that DWM has really anything to do with it?

[Dixel]

11 hours ago, Peter said:

In Windows 8 and higher, the entire desktop is always drawn using the DWM graphics engine.  That engine was formerly known as "Aero" in Windows 7 and Vista and back then it was optional, but now it's mandatory. For programs not built for Aero/DWM, it will cause this flash, particularly in "tablet mode" (it's less noticeable or even gone if you turn off tablet mode).

Shawn "Cmdr" Keene | Microsoft MVP 2010-2024 | CmdrKeene.com | tweet: @CmdrKeene
Microsoft MVPs are independent experts offering real-world answers. Learn more at mvp.microsoft.com.


Do you think that DWM has really anything to do with it?

I think Shawn Keene is being a bit misleading, Aero is not officially supported starting Win8, it was dropped to favour the absolutely flat "Metro" design. 

DWM in Vista and 7/8 can't be lumped together, they are different.

In Vista mu idling GPU with Aero stays at 0%, in Windows 7 it's about 3%. @UCyborg , why?

[vinifera]

also AERO was never an engine, it was just the UI "type", just like in XP you had "Luna"
DWM was and still is the engine that renders your UI (vista, 7, 8, 10, 11)

[UCyborg]

On 8/29/2024 at 9:35 PM, Peter said:

Do you think that DWM has really anything to do with it?

If I would've assumed, I'd be wrong, because I'd think DWM would only ever put on screen what was specifically rendered by the application. I tried on Windows 8.1 and it does appear to be influenced by DWM. You can force it off there with some hackery, when it's on, empty window does appear white when background color is not specified, but it does switch to selected color if specified without flashing white. Though we should assume application may not have the need to specify background color, so the whiteness will remain until the client area is filled with content. With DWM forced off, the client area is see-through if the color is not specified right after ShowWindow call.

It's not something that DWM should be causing, it's fine on Vista, didn't get around to trying Windows 7.

On 8/29/2024 at 10:01 PM, Dixel said:

In Vista mu idling GPU with Aero stays at 0%, in Windows 7 it's about 3%. @UCyborg , why?

IDK, it's not something I personally witnessed on any Windows version in the past. If nothing else runs and I just watch GPU utilization, it's 0%.

[Peter]

On 8/31/2024 at 8:00 AM, UCyborg said:

If I would've assumed, I'd be wrong, because I'd think DWM would only ever put on screen what was specifically rendered by the application. I tried on Windows 8.1 and it does appear to be influenced by DWM. You can force it off there with some hackery, when it's on, empty window does appear white when background color is not specified, but it does switch to selected color if specified without flashing white. Though we should assume application may not have the need to specify background color, so the whiteness will remain until the client area is filled with content. With DWM forced off, the client area is see-through if the color is not specified right after ShowWindow call.

It's not something that DWM should be causing, it's fine on Vista, didn't get around to trying Windows 7.

IDK, it's not something I personally witnessed on any Windows version in the past. If nothing else runs and I just watch GPU utilization, it's 0%.

In windows 7 there is the flash only in the basic themes but not in the high contrast themes which I use.

It is difficult for me to understand but for me it looks like DWM is causing this. The client area should have been see-through if the background color of the application is not specified, like in xp and before.

I got a few skills doing things with a hexeditor and resource editors. Could this be done with a hexeditor or something?