ATI Widescreen support for Win9x?

[Tommy]

'kay, so my NVidia Geforce came today and it's a dud, I think the pins are damages so the motherboard won't pick it up. So while I'm waiting for the seller, here's my question.

 

I have an ATI Radeon X600 PCI-E card that works just fine under Windows 98. It actually has the nonstandard DMS-59 connector on it but that's not important. What is important is...getting 1360x768 resolution working.

 

Now, I've ebbed away from Radeon since Windows 98 doesn't seem to play nicely with widescreen and ATI, at least from what I can tell.

 

So, apparently the control panel recognizes my monitor as being 1024x768, it's actually a 32 inch Toshiba television capable of 1360x768 and that's the resolution I'm aiming for. Now this is why I always go for NVidia because it seems to work perfectly with this resolution. Now when I go ahead and try forcing it to use 1360x768, it does this stupid screen panning thing. All the information will not stay on the screen at once. It seems to work just fine but I need it instead of panning, to just have it fit completely on the screen.

Now, I cannot figure out how to do with this the ATI Control Panel, there doesn't seem to be an option. But this was the deal with my Radeon 9550 as well. In Windows NT+ it supported widescreen just fine, but in Windows 98, no dice, it wasn't even an option. The only reason I think it was here because I took out an NVidia to begin with so my default settings were at 1360x768. So obviously it is capable of it, but something in the software is limiting it from happening. I've read it's about the driver for the monitor but that can't be, I believe the driver is the same on the GeForce.

 

And also since I'm at it and waiting for the seller, since he has no more 6800s that I can see, would a NVIDIA Geforce FX 1300 or Nvidia Quadro FX3450 work with Windows 98 since those are for sale?

[Drugwash]

You'd probably have to add a custom resolution, if at all possible. I believe this issue has already been discussed here somewhere for both NVIDIA and ATI. With NVIDIA it's relatively simple but no idea about ATI, personally I could never stand them, can't remember why - maybe because of the bloated Control Center, maybe because it wouldn't install or do what I wanted it to.

 

Here's the scaling options in the NVIDIA control panel; if there's similar capabilities in the ATI control panel you may be able to work around the issue:

 

[CharlesF]

Hi Brooke's Tommy Honey,

 

you have a french page on this very subject here: http://win9x4ever.online.fr/index.php/dossiers-et-tutos/65-utiliser-un-ecran-large-avec-windows-9x

 

Try to read it with Google Translate

(If needed, I could try to help you)

[Tommy]

Hi, thanks for the reply guys.

 

Now, here is where the real problem lies. I have the option now to change to 1360x768 (I actually modded the registry the first time but this time I followed the instructions to add the option to the drivers themselves which I sort of started to begin with) but what it's doing is only showing 1024x768 pixels at a time. So in order to show the rest of the pixels, when you move your mouse pointer, it pans in that direction to reveal the other pixels cut off from the 1024x768 limit. So what's going on here is that even though I forced it to 1360x768, it's not a true "fit" and only pans instead. It's very irritating.

 

NVidia works just fine, never had an issue with that on this television, ever. But I'd still like confirmation if those cards I listed above work, in case I'm able to get a different card due to the one being shipped being no good.

[Drugwash]

You got the scaling problem, that's why I mentioned it. If you don't have any options similar to NVIDIA's drivers and you can't add custom resolution then I don't think there's any other solution. Anybody else disagreeing, please speak out.

[Tommy]

Okay, I see exactly what you're saying now. I actually didn't install the control panel this time so I'm wondering if there is a registry key that can change that problem.

[jumper]

You don't have a scaling problem. You're stuck in virtual desktop mode because the video board thinks the display is only capable of 1024x768, max. You need to tweak the monitor driver settings, not just the video card settings, or autodetect the monitor's native resolution....

In Display Properties->[Advanced...]->Monitor, [Change...] to "Plug and Play Monitor". Also set "Automatically detect Plug & Play monitors."

After a reboot, in Device Manager->Monitors you should see "Toshiba ###". Open it and under Driver you should see "No driver files are required or have been loaded for this device." Display Properties should report the Display as "Toshiba ### on ATI ###". If so, you should now be able to select resolutions up to 1360x768 without scrolling (also try 1366x768).

[Tommy]

Hey jumper, I think you might be on the right track, but it still seems like I'm stuck at 1024x768. I went into safe mode and removed all my monitors so it would detect it fresh. Now it does detect it as a Toshiba-TV, but it's still not letting me go higher than 1024 without this panning crap.

[pangoomis]

Does this monitor actually have "drivers" available for it? (probably won't do anything, but worth mentioning)

Also, Radeon + 98SE always meant trouble.

[Tommy]

Does this monitor actually have "drivers" available for it? (probably won't do anything, but worth mentioning)

Also, Radeon + 98SE always meant trouble.

I've been looking but I haven't noticed any. And I kinda knew that already because I had a Radeon 9550 that also did this stupid thing. I'm tempted to go into the monitor.inf file and manually change anything that says 1024 to 1360 and see what happens. Can't hurt anything I don't imagine.

[submix8c]

Acer/eMachines 18" Wide Screen INF...

;=========================================; ACER_E180HV.INF 08/22/09 Ver. 1.0; INF File for Windows XP/Vista/7; Copyright (c) 2009, ACER Corporation;=========================================;[version]signature="$CHICAGO$"Class=MonitorClassGuid={4D36E96E-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}Provider=%ACER%catalogfile=E180HV.catDriverVer=08/22/2009,1.0[ControlFlags]ExcludeFromSelect.NT=Monitor\ACR0211ExcludeFromSelect.NT=Monitor\ACR0211[DestinationDirs]DefaultDestDir  = 11E180HV_Analog.copyfiles = 23E180HV_Digital.copyfiles = 23[SourceDisksNames]1=%diskname%,,[SourceDisksFiles]E180HV.icm=1; Manufacturers;-------------------------------------------------[Manufacturer]%ACER%=ACER,NTAMD64; Manufacturer sections;-------------------------------------------------[ACER]%E180HV_Analog%=E180HV_Analog.Install, Monitor\ACR0211%E180HV_Digital%=E180HV_Digital.Install, Monitor\ACR0211;-------------------------------------------------;------------------------------------------------- [ACER.NTAMD64]%E180HV_Analog%=E180HV_Analog.Install, Monitor\ACR0211%E180HV_Digital%=E180HV_Digital.Install, Monitor\ACR0211; Install Sections;-------------------------------------------------[E180HV_Analog.Install]DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REGAddReg=E180HV_Analog.AddReg, 1366, DPMSCopyFiles=E180HV_Analog.CopyFiles[E180HV_Digital.Install]DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REGAddReg=E180HV_Digital.AddReg, 1366, DPMSCopyFiles=E180HV_Digital.CopyFiles; AddReg & DelReg sections;-------------------------------------------------[DEL_CURRENT_REG]HKR,MODESHKR,,MaxResolutionHKR,,DPMSHKR,,ICMProfile[1366]HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1366,768"[DPMS]HKR,,DPMS,,1; AddReg sections;----------------------------------------------------------------------------------[E180HV_Analog.AddReg]HKR,"MODES\1366,768",Mode1,,"31.0-80.0,55.0-76.0,+,+"HKR,,ICMProfile,0,"E180HV.icm"[E180HV_Digital.AddReg]HKR,"MODES\1366,768",Mode1,,"31.0-80.0,55.0-76.0,+,+"HKR,,ICMProfile,0,"E180HV.icm"[E180HV_Analog.CopyFiles]E180HV.ICM[E180HV_Digital.CopyFiles]E180HV.ICM[Strings]MonitorClassName="Monitor"ACER="ACER"diskname="ACER LCD Monitor installation diskette"E180HV_Analog="E180HV (Analog)"E180HV_Digital="E180HV (Digital)"

I have no clue if this will help. Note the max is 1366x768. Also be aware of the potential necessity to change the Frequency.

 

HTH

[jumper]

What is the exact model of the 32" Toshiba TV?

Be very careful with this, but if you set the monitor driver to "Super VGA 1600x1200" you should be able to select physical modes up to 1600x1200 including 1360x768. You might want to experiment with "Super VGA 800x600", "Super VGA 1024x768", and "Super VGA 1280x1024" first to see how the video card and TV react/interact.

Stay away from the "@ 75 Hz" modes unless you're sure the TV can do 120Hz in progressive video and PC monitor modes.

I was able to use this method with my original 640x480 VGA CRT monitor to overdrive it to 800x600 and even 1024x768@43i (after opening the case and tweaking a high-voltage coil with the power on!).

[Tommy]

What is the exact model of the 32" Toshiba TV?

Be very careful with this, but if you set the monitor driver to "Super VGA 1600x1200" you should be able to select physical modes up to 1600x1200 including 1360x768. You might want to experiment with "Super VGA 800x600", "Super VGA 1024x768", and "Super VGA 1280x1024" first to see how the video card and TV react/interact.

Stay away from the "@ 75 Hz" modes unless you're sure the TV can do 120Hz in progressive video and PC monitor modes.

I was able to use this method with my original 640x480 VGA CRT monitor to overdrive it to 800x600 and even 1024x768@43i (after opening the case and tweaking a high-voltage coil with the power on!).

I always use 60Hz for the refresh rate. The model of the TV is Toshiba 32C120U1. I sort of tried the super vga monitor driver but it was before I actually removed all the other "monitors" hooked up to the system so I'm going to try that again and see what happens. Like I said, NVidia works perfectly out of the box, no configuration needed, but ATI just has this weird problem.

[jumper]

The 32C120U1 is 1366x768@60.

Here's a similar .inf I found online for an LG:

; http://forum.oszone.net/nextnewesttothread-187849.html; generated by PowerStrip 3.0, 07.10.2010; Copyright (c) 1995-2005, EnTech Taiwan.; Web: http://www.entechtaiwan.com[Version]Signature="$CHICAGO$"Class=MonitorClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}Provider=%MFG%[Manufacturer]%MFG%=MonMfg[MonMfg]%MODEL%=Mon.Install[Mon.Install]DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REGAddReg=Mon.AddReg,RES,DPMS[Mon.AddReg]HKR,%MODE%,Mode1,,%RANGE%[DEL_CURRENT_REG]HKR,MODESHKR,,MaxResolutionHKR,,DPMS[RES]HKR,,MaxResolution,,%MAXRES%[DPMS]HKR,,DPMS,,0[Strings]MFG="LG"MODEL="32LH2000"MAXRES="1360,768,60"MODE="MODES\1360,768"RANGE="15.0-106.0,55.0-160.0,+,+" 

Perhaps PowerStrip can read the 32C120U1's capabilities and generate an .inf for you to use or customize. Other hardware utilities might also be able to read the monitor (*thread about this last year*) and provide the details you need to customize an .inf file.

[Tommy]

Really?? That's interesting because I could've sworn that NVidia sets it at 1360, but maybe I'm just remembering wrong. That or it just sets it as that. I've never used any other OS with it either. From what I can tell *at this point*, that 1024x768 is UNSTOPPABLE! Super VGA 1600x1200, no difference, I even used monitor drivers from Windows 2000 which actually *seem* to work and even has the Chicago signature on it and it even references Windows 95 still. But even that made no difference. I can try PowerStrip and see what I come up with. I ordered an NVidia Quadro X1500 from another seller and it should be here Monday, but I'd still like to at least figure out what is going on here. Windows 2000 doesn't seem to have this quirky problem. But something I found interesting is when I'd go into the registry and change the key for the ATI Control Panel's "quick resolutions", I'd either add or change 1024 to 1360...and upon reboot, it silently changes it back or deletes the key if I added it in.