saugatak

Uh, why? M$ still releasing hotfixes. There are other ways to integrate hotfixes into Win2k SP4. Just look at my sig

In KB913807, OUTLOOKff.msi is a new security patch. OLKINTLff.msi is the same security patch as in a previous KB (forget which number). Even though OLKINTff.msi is the same as a previous KB, it's included anyway so that you can completely get rid of the old patch. To be certain, I'd recommend you apply both even though it's possible that you don't need to apply OLKINTLff.msi if you've already applied it before. In KB917151, I have Office 2003 Std and PVMSO.msi was not applied, whereas MSO.msi was applied. My guess is that PVMSO.msi stands for Professional Version MS Office and MSO.msi stands for MS Office. So short answer is, if you have Office 2003 Std, dump PVMSO.msi and just apply MSO.msi. If you have Office 2003 Pro, try both and see what happens and report back to us so we all know. But my guess is if you have Office 2003 Pro, you'll only have to apply PVMSO.msi and will be able to dump MSO.msi. However, it's possible Office 2003 Pro users will have to apply PVMSO.msi and MSO.msi. Hope that helps.

If you look at the files replaced, often the cumulative patches replace the same .dlls with newer versions of the same files. So you should just do latest patch because it's going to replace the files put in by earlier patches anyway.

I was checking registry on lots of removed services and don't see any entries. Did see that HFCLEANUP removed OS/2 and Posix but left those entries in the registry. Right now I'm doing a .reg file to get those entries removed, but here it is if you want to incorporate. Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00 ;Remove OS/2 & POSIX ; [-HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\OS/2 Subsystem for NT] [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet001\Control\Session Manager\Environment] "Os2LibPath"=- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet001\Control\Session Manager\SubSystems] "Optional"=- "Os2"=- "Posix"=- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet002\Control\Session Manager\Environment] "Os2LibPath"=- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet002\Control\Session Manager\SubSystems] "Optional"=- "Os2"=- "Posix"=- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Session Manager\Environment] "Os2LibPath"=- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Session Manager\SubSystems] "Optional"=- "Os2"=- "Posix"=- Edit: Grabbed latest HFCLEANUP, testing it now

That explains why your fileset improves bootimes so much in 2k.

Sweet . . . Was wondering how you did it so that IE dependent programs were installing no problem but IE missing. Guess it's similar to the nLite function of leaving IE Core intact. OK, I'm going to take out different reducers and see what results are. Also curious if I install FF and use IE tab functionality whether the updates will work. June 1, 2006 Edit: With IEGarbageRemoval reducers, IETab in FF works weirdly on VM. Can't tell on this build whether it's IEGarbageRemoval reducers or other ZZZZ reducers. Just going to yank 'em all.

That's weird. There's only four 4Z or 5Z reducers. I'm not running the 5Z TOTAL_REMOVER_IE.rem, so it can only be 1. ZZZZ_IE6_JAVA_Killer.REM, but this only removes JSCRIPT.DLL, which should not affect the applet 2. ZZZZ_IE6_JAVA_Killer.RIN - no idea if this is the one responsible, but there are a ton of files here so it'll be hard to eliminate. 3. ZZZZZ_TOTAL_REMOVER_MPLAYER.REM - removes only Windows Media files (MPLAYER2.EX, mplayer2.in unregmp2.ex) which should not affect the applet. I'll try a build taking out IE6_JAVA_Killer.REM & RIN to see if it works. Edit: Just noticed in this build that IE is completely missing even though I didn't use the 5Z TOTAL_REMOVER_IE.rem. @tommyp, do the ZZ_IEGARBAGE reducer files take out IE altogether?

Uninstall Tools looks good, maybe do a switchless installer. Which reducers do I have to remove to get the Add/Remove programs applet to work? I guess other solution is, remove the Add/Remove applet altogether and use Uninstall Tools, but I don't see a fileset that takes out the Add/Remove program applet completely.

@tommyp, do the 2 IEGARBAGE reducers have any impact on IE or Explorer functionality? HFSLIP Win2k, IE6 + OE, HFCLEANUP (including IEGARBAGE reducers) causes the Add/Remove Programs applet to not work. Am taking out suspect reducers and trying out different builds on VMWARE to identify cause of this problem (think I forgot to take out the Explorer reducer out by accident), but was wondering if you had anything to add.

I can't see myself upgrading to Vista. Win2k is good until June 2010, counting on M$ extending support for another year or two since so many big corporations use it, so I guess it's good until June 2011. By then 64 bit systems should be mainstream and I'll probably switch to Windows XP 64 bit until support runs out.

@FDV, thanks. Makes sense, since everyone is using different filesets, registry edits would be a major PITA. I guess it'd be a good idea to create a registry tweaker that HFSLIP could install along with HFCLEANUP. I made a tweak.reg file and put it into HFSVCPACK but for some reason it did not work. Also, don't know how to make a tweak.reg file that takes out registry entries. Links to any sites or threads on how to go about making a good tweak.reg appreciated. I think I'll make a reg file for Win2k users with comments and then users can add or delete to it. Shouldn't be too bad because I can base it off FDV's tweaks.

How does HFCLEANUP handle registry edits? In other words, when you use HFCLEANUP to rip out POSIX, for example, does HFCLEANUP also clean out the POSIX entries in the registry?

Only way is to use HFSLIP (slipstreams latest updates and/or IE6 into Win2k) and HFCLEANUP (rips out unwanted services) OR nLite. Both of these work, pick which you prefer. My personal opinion is that HFSLIP and HFCLEANUP are better choice once you get it set up.

Not sure if you know this already, but FDV has a LOT of documentation on his site at vorck.com http://www.vorck.com/2ksp5.html is his Win2kSP5 documentation. For explanation of the various HFSLIP features, see http://users.telenet.be/tc76/hfslip/ Check out the Special Features and Advanced Features links.

FDV fileset, which removes IE and a bunch of other crap in Win2k, editing registry and IE cleanup. Not sure how it compares to what you do for IE removal, but FDV's fileset is very stable. I've installed lot of programs with FDV fileset and only had problems with programs that are IE dependent. http://www.vorck.com/data/sp5files.zip Link to HFCLEANUP filesets and instructions for Win2k, WinXP and Win2k3 Server. The readme in the zipfile contains more detailed instructions. The names of the HFCLEANUP files correspond pretty well to nLite options, but there are a few where I have no idea what's going on, such as the GOSH files. http://www.vorck.com/hfexpert.html#hfcleanup According to TommyP, only the Win2k cleanup set works well, the other two need work. As for hive editing, TommyP will have to chip in. I remember trying to add some reg files into an HFSLIP folder to mod the registry but could never make it work so now I just do it manually after install.

Woohoo!!!! I can't wait for new HFCLEANUP with Clint's contributions!!! Let me know if you need any testing done, glad to do it.

I was hoping you'd have something to add to TommyP's HFCLEANUP files. That way we could take advantage of what you've done and you'd only have to deal with TommyP's questions, who knows what he's doing, as opposed to questions of people who have no clue.

Clint, you should talk to Fred Vorck and TommyP at the HFSLIP forum. TommyP is doing HFCLEANUP which are reducer files used with HFSLIP (slipstream hotfixes and IE6 and other stuff into Win NT OS's). I'm impressed you were able to do that. Do you rip out IE as well?

Any idea if the network stacks actually are better than what's found in 2k or XP? Wondering if it's possible to take Vista .dll for network stacks and then replace them into Win2k or XP to improve performance. Hmm, maybe I'll give this a try. BTW, I heard somewhere that NT network stack is just a slightly modified version of the BSD network stack, is this true?

I think NT 3.51 was actually pretty good, very fast. NT 4.0 was OK after SP4 IMO. NT 5.0 or Win2k good after SP2. NT 5.1 or WinXP took until after SP2, before it was junk. No way am I going with Vista. WinXP is bloated as it is. I can get a 350MB install or less with Win2k and it takes 15 minutes to install. I can't imagine waiting hours for a 7GB install, insane.

Wanted to bump this poll because I just got a demo copy of Win2k3 Server and want to try it out as a workstation OS, more than happy to beta test reducers and FDV fileset with the programs I run.

Depends on which reducers you use. My experiences has been that the Win2k reducers take out more than nLite. But mainly I use it because tommyp has tested in and it's faster to use HFSLIP and HFCLEANUP rather than doing nLite after HFSLIP. I still use nLite for rare XP installs though.

Yeah, I'm going Win2k until its last legs and then switch over to whatever's after Vista which IMO is just a beta for post-Vista.

If I just needed basic office, email and browser, I'd switch to Linux, OOo, Thunderbird and Firefox right now. Businesses and individuals that just need those basics will eventually switch over to that I'm sure. But for my work I need to use various programs that run only on Windows. Aside from OOo, I just don't see a lot of Windows programs being ported over to Linux. Also, best games run only on Windows. So the short answer is, the intrusion level of WGA is complete bullcrud, but we have to put up with it because there's no alternative out there . . . unless you have Win2k When support for Win2k runs out, there had better be a massive outcry so that M$ extends support for Win2k beyond 2010 like they did for NT and the Win 9x/ME family.

Only used HFCLEANUP with Win2k and it works fine so I was wondering what you meant by buggy. Looking forward to next release of HFCLEANUP with the few more things added.