Monroe

thanks dencorso... I have all the downloads and will try everything out shortly. OK ... ran into a problem. Got the first part done: "Then sort the desktop and save the layout, with a custom name, using the GUI version." No problem doing that part. Went to install the "Command line version" and this box pops up: This Installation Package is not supported by this processor type. Contact your product vendor. ... Any idea what that exactly means ... I'm on a Dell Pentium 3 notebook with Windows 2000 Pro installed.

Thought I'd resurrect this topic again. Still having problems with the desktop icon order changing every time Windows 2000 Pro starts. Anyone else have this same problem and how you maybe fixed the problem. I have a program to restore the icons in the order I want them but it drives me crazy to have to restore them every time I turn on the computer. I have tried a couple of desk lock programs but they are hit and miss. Anyone have any suggestions or a good icon lock program or can I make a change somewhere in the registry? Any and all ideas welcome ...

Not sure if this is what you are asking ... I'm using this NetGear card that I bought from Amazon ... it's actually cheaper now than when I bought it last November (2010) ... paid around $14 but today I see it is listed at $11.75. It has been a great Wi-Fi card and still works with Win 9x. I actually bought two extras for spares but I have no problems yet with it and it installs easy. NETGEAR WG511NA Wireless G Pc Card http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00008I9K8 Easy Setup The WG511 is a PC Card and requires a Pentium class PC with an available 32-bit CardBus slot for installation. It supports Windows Vista and is also compatible with Windows XP, 2000, 98SE, and Me. Setup is as simple as inserting the card into the slot and installing the included software. A built-in stub antenna helps you receive a strong signal for the fastest possible speeds. Fast and Secure The NETGEAR WG511 supports the 802.11g protocol standard for speeds up to 54 Mbps and a longer range than previous-generation 802.11b adapters. With a good connection, you'll notice the difference right away as you'll be able to stream high-quality music without any hiccups and load videos much faster. Downloading files is up to five times faster than it was with 802.11b. Since 802.11g is also interoperable with 802.11b, you don't have to worry about whether or not you'll get a connection at specific airports and hotspots; the WG111US will automatically detect the network and allow you to connect to it at the highest speed possible. .... wasn't sure if I completely understood your question but decided to make mention of this Wi-Fi card. Update ... if anyone is interested, the price for that Netgear card has dropped to $8.99 with free shipping, from $11.75 earlier today, that earlier price only had "free shipping" with a $25 dollar order. Just checked that link at Amazon ... prices change every few hours so it could be different tomorrow. ...

Have no complaints about Windows 98SE in 2011 ... I have dial-up through my cell phone and it's very slow since I'm on an old plan from 2004 but it's cheap and I'm still getting data with my voice plan. I use the K-Meleon browser and just block JavaScript, Images and Popups and I can really zip around pretty fast on dial up ... when I get to a place with very fast Wi-Fi then I have nothing blocked and have several tabs going at once. I also don't belong to Facebook and such so I can't say anything about those sites in regards to Windows 9x but 98SE still works just fine for me in 2011. As I said in another thread, I do have Win 2000 Pro on a separate small hard drive just to run a few programs that I can't get to run on Win 98SE even with KernelEx installed, but that can be expected in 2011 ... I'm just glad that most everything that I need to use still runs on Win 98SE. I guess one day some of the people I consider "experts" ... which is just about everyone, will stop posting at this Windows 9x site but I hope that day will be many years down the road ... I'd mention some names but we all know who they are ... the same people who always come to assist with a problem or answer some questions and that includes some "newer" names every so often. If that day ever truly comes when these people are no longer here ... then, in my opinion, Windows 9x will be truly dead. ...

herbalist ... have a question for you from your earlier post. You mention using the program Tor with SeaMonkey ... "while my default browser connects through Tor" ... could you go into a little detail of what version you are using, with Win 98SE I assume. I have heard of Tor years ago but never really checked it out. The only version I can find listed to work with Win 98SE is the Expert Bundle at the TorProject website: Expert Bundle Windows 7, Vista, XP, 2000, 2003 Server, ME, and Windows 98SE Contains just Tor and nothing else. You'll need to configure Tor and all of your applications manually. ... is there an older stand alone version for Win 98SE maybe already configured to work with this OS? Any drawbacks to using Tor or do you highly recommend using it with a browser? Is it complicated to set up? Might as well cover all this and anything related to browsers in 2011 ... unless you feel this should be a separate topic, if it's really involved. ... thanks ...

ScrewUpgrading ... I have KM 1.7a2 running as I type this ... so far it seems to be working OK on Win 98SE ... also have KM 1.6 working good on Win 98SE ... strange that KM 1.6 doesn't work well for you. Have you gone over to the KM forum for some assistance or ideas? I got help there getting v1.6 to run on 98SE. I also intend to stay with 98SE ... only have 2000 Pro or XP for a couple of programs that won't run on 98SE even with KernelEx. I would like your opinion of the "Fred" K-Meleon version ... had tried some of his versions early in the year and they seem to be very different over the regular KM but as I said earlier, people seem to like his work. May have to try this latest version myself, don't know much about his work, probably needs KernelEx but not sure. I'm pretty satisfied with all three KM versions (1.5.4, 1.6, 1.7), they aren't 100% but they are close. Foxbat ... I will try Opera 10.10 and see how it works on my machine. Yes, I also have IE 6 still on my computer but I never use it very much ... just have it there in case it would be needed. Since herbalist mentioned KM 1.7a2 earlier, of which I wasn't aware ... got the download and have it running ... want to test it out better next week on some fast Wi-Fi. Looks good so far, still have some settings to work with. I also hope KernelEx is not dead but things change, sad to say. The whole program was and is a great idea for the 9x crowd. ...

OK, I just finished downloading KM 1.7a2 ... will work with it later or tomorrow. I will experiment with both SeaMonkey versions and see how they work on my machine. Those "unofficial" KM versions by Fred are in the General topic at the KM Forum. He just published a new version on Sept 1st ... KM-16-F3621. If you decide to try it out, I'd be interested in knowing how it works on your machine. KM Forum: http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/forum/ General Topic: Latest "unofficial" version about 6 or 7 items down. http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/forum/list.php?1 ...

I have to correct myself about KM v1.7 ... I now think I have never tried any 1.7 version. The KM versions that I have tried and didn't care are by a person named Fred ... a lot of people seem to like his "unofficial" versions but they seem to mess things up in my computer and I would have to get offline and reboot ... at least with some of the earlier versions in 2011. His latest is: New unofficial version : KM-16-F3621. I was looking around for the 1.7a2 version that you are using ... I finally located the download ... wasn't aware of that version so I am going to give it a try. I will also get SeaMonkey 2.0.14 and see how it works on my computer. Yes, I also wonder why certain browsers work better on one Win 98 machine over another one. For instance, I can install the portable KM v1.5.4 on 98SE, 2000 Pro and XP ... KM works good on all three systems ... for my Dell notebook I have 2 hard drive caddies ... one with Win 98SE (FAT32) and the other hard drive is NTFS so I can either put Win 2000 Pro or XP on it. As I said, the KM v1.5.4 works great on any system but KM v1.6 Beta 2 will not work on Windows 2000 Pro ... things freeze up and I have to reboot but it seems to work OK (if I remember) on XP. Thanks for the heads up on the KM v1.7a2 version ... definitely want to try it out. You say it has potential for the future, hope the development continues. ...

Thanks Rick for bringing that to my attention concerning K-Meleon ... I also have better luck with the portable versions ... the install version never seems to be quite right. I also like the portable version since it can put very fast onto another computer or OS once all the settings are the way you want. I use the same KM folder on Windows 98SE, Windows 2000 Pro and XP ... makes for a quick setup ... just be sure to run Clear Read Only or something similar to clear the "read only" check marks out of the KM folder if you had it burned to a CD or the "Profile" folder won't update right ... if the folder is stored on a flash drive it doesn't seem to matter. I'm going to try SeaMonkey 1.1.19 later this weekend ... sounds OK to me for another backup browser. Just to add, I have had no luck with any of the KM 1.7 versions and really don't like them so far. ...

Glad you brought this topic up ... browsers and Windows 98. Just a few weeks ago I was searching around for any newer browsers that would still work OK in 2011 with Windows 98SE. Didn't have much luck and got busy with other projects. I read your list of browsers and will try a few of them ... been wanting to try Firefox 2.0.0.20 and Seamonkey 1.1.19 ... have had them downloaded for some time. At present I still use and like K-Meleon 1.5.4 ... I occasionally run into a "scripts" downloading problem ... always at Fox News and once in awhile with a few other web pages, but not very often. It's my main browser and also K-Meleon 1.6 Beta 2. I'm on KM 1.6 Beta 2 now as I type this reply. The newer version can be used on Windows 98SE with KernelEx installed. Might be worth a try, the "scripts" thing seems to be less of a problem with that version, at least for me. I fire it up every so often but mostly use KM 1.5.4 ... probably should use the 1.6 version more often, also a very fast browser. Well, hope some interesting replies come along. I will try the Firefox and Seamonkey browsers. ... just a quick note, they have a good forum over at K-Meleon and lots of people like to offer help and solutions to any problems with K-Meleon. I also use "The Proxomitron" with Windows 98SE with the Sidki filter set ... sometimes (not often) at a certain web page I will have to put it on "Bypass" but I mostly use it as is. ... Since I posted this message, I have been running K-Meleon v1.6 Beta 2 ... with version 1.5.4 I always get a "scripts" download problem window popping up at Fox News, nothing with v1.6 Beta 2. I thought that was the case before but I wanted to try that web site again and a few other sites. I really never remember any web sites having a scripts download problem except there was just one and it was an odd site, if I remember ... not one I regularly visit. Once you get all the settings the way you want (in both versions) things seem to go pretty smooth. I will run the 1.6 Beta on a daily basis from now on, a real joy to run on the internet. ...

Well I was having trouble getting signed in to reply. Tons of good feedback from everyone. ... CharlotteTheHarlot, good to hear from you again, you helped me some time back with some registry questions. I did not know that ExamDiff came in a Pro version, I found v1.9 on the web but I am also going to check out all the others you mentioned. jaclaz ... I downloaded Tiny Hexer v1.8.1.6 and FC.exe will take a little time to understand ... will work with these programs over the next few days. I41Mar ... I am searching around for Genesys Logic System Health Monitor ... other's have also indicated it can be found on a CD, maybe someone put the program online with a link somewhere. I came across an old 2001 article by Fred Langa dealing with CPU heat. Read his articles for many years. Fred Langa Mar 12, 2001 None Like It Hot http://www.informationweek.com/news/12802724 He mentions a program that he liked over MBM (Motherboard Monitor) called MBProbe ... I think I remember it but had forgotten about it, worth a try, might be surprised if it actually works. ... From the article: "While MBM is good, I've come to prefer the look and feel of a slightly different freeware tool called MBProbe. According to the site, it "monitors voltages, temperatures and fan speeds using hardware monitoring chip(s) available on many modern motherboards." thanks ...

I have a question for jaclaz, fhub, triger49 and anyone else ... not exactly related to my Pentium 3 question but all three of you made mention of using a filecompare utility in earlier posts. I will admit ... I have never used one of these programs but I can see where a filecompare program would be good to have on hand ... triger, you said you were using "ancient utility I had for Windows 95" ... I have searched around and found 2 programs that work with Windows 98, 2000 and XP .... WinMerge and ExamDiff ... just would like to know what program(s) you guys are using? ... thanks ...

I41Mar ... Rain 2 seems to only work when the processor is in an idle state, or maybe "near idle". On my Dell Latitude where I can actually read the CPU temperature ... if the computer is really doing some intensive work, the temperature will usually be high and stay there until I'm finished ... then usually a fast drop down to cooler numbers takes place. If the processor is at idle with Rain working, the temperature will of course be low but if I turn Rain off at "idle" or when doing nothing, the temperature will start climbing almost immediately and when turning Rain back on, the temperature reading starts to drop. I still have found no program to read my NEC Pentium 3 temperature but I can tell the same thing is happening with Rain running and not running because of the cooling fan going on and off. I really don't think Rain and probably most all cooling software are much use when the processor is working under a load. I could be wrong in that statement, just what I have read and my observations. My Dell temperature readings can get pretty high at times and will just stay there (more or less) until I'm finished doing something intensive and then the drop back down to better numbers starts to occur almost immediately. In conclusion, Rain (or some other program) seems to be of some use in CPU temperature control even if it is limited. Rain is so small and uses very little resources when running ... it seems like a good program to be using with Windows 98. Hope this helps a little. Now I have a few questions for you concerning your Pentium 3 processor .... just wondering what name brand your computer is and what temperature program you are using to get your readings. As I said earlier, I am still searching for a temperature program for my NEC notebook. I have several programs that will read the hard drive temperature but not the CPU temperature. I am assuming that you are running Windows 98SE. I have found some temperature programs that only work with Windows 2000 and XP so it's possible one of those will work but I'm not about to drop Windows 98SE yet (like never!), although I do like Windows 2000 Pro after fooling around with it on my Dell ... have 2 hard drive caddies so it's easy to switch from 98SE (FAT) to 2000 Pro (NTFS) if I need a program to run that won't work on Win 98SE. ... thanks ...

OK jaclaz ... thanks for making things more clear for me, have a lot to read in the posts. When I was hard drive shopping earlier in the year, I thought the adapter would replace the one that is already attached to the hard drive caddy where the hard drive is attached. I bought two additional IDE hard drives and almost bought a SATA 2.5 drive, thinking I could probably buy an adapter later on for it to fit in my notebook. I last bought new 2.5 hard drives in 2006 ... I really don't remember if there were SATA drives around then ... there was still a good selection of IDE drives at good prices in 2006. When I thought earlier this year to maybe get a few more IDE drives ... just to be on the safe side, I was surprised to see mostly SATA drives for notebooks and desktops ... very few IDE drives seem to be available and at higher prices. I might pick up another IDE drive or two, since I understand I won't have the option of using a SATA drive in my notebook. My NEC is really cramped for hard drive space and that hd caddy just fits inside that space. ... thanks dencorso for the info also. ...

OK I have a question for dencorso or anyone. I went to eBay to check out the adapter that you mention in your earlier post. I was going to buy one but then I realized this must be for a desktop hard drive. Earlier this year I bought a couple of IDE notebook hard drives to have on hand ... however when I was shopping around I noticed I could have gotten a new SATA hard drive with more capacity at a much lower price. At the time I didn't know much about adapters going either way ... SATA to IDE and so forth. Just a simple question, can you also recommend a good adapter so I could use a newer SATA hard drive on my older Pentium 3 notebooks. I've been following this thread and it's very interesting ... more things that I now have a better understanding of. ... thanks

jaclaz ... very informative and funny post ! ... an old program seeing the "light of day" again in 2011. Thanks for the info ... I might add, I got my first computer in '98 (Win 95) and have learned a great deal about computers since then but I still consider myself a newbie in many ways. I still have limited knowledge about DOS for one thing and the inner workings of an OS for another ... around two years back I had questions about USB drivers in DOS, you and dencorso went into great depth to try and make things clear about all that. This forum has been much help to me since I discovered it. ...

Jake ... good to hear there actually might be some differences between the two Rain versions ... as I said earlier, I have never used Rain 1 but you have worked with both versions. That may be of some importance to anyone trying Rain for the first time ... maybe just go with Rain 2. I don't overclock or do any exotic things with my notebooks ... just lots of downloads, a few games but those Pentium 3s seem to run very hot so anything that might help a notebook run a little cooler has my interest. I put plastic bottle caps (soda) under my notebooks for better air circulation but after a few hours the table top will still be warm from the heat of the computer. I have read to just let Rain install as a Pentium 2 or a Pentium Pro. I have tried both selections through the years and didn't seem to notice much difference. I will have to check that out and maybe reinstall Rain 2 again with the Pentium Pro setting ... I may have used the Pentium Pro setting anyway. I'm going to search around for more information from other Rain users about that. Do you (or anyone) have the Memload program installed ... just wondering what usage readings you get for Rain? I posted my readings for Rain 2 in the last post. ... I posted a download link for Rain 2 in Post #6. ...

I just wanted to be clear about my using Rain 2 over Rain 1 (or other cooling software) ... it sounds from the earlier posts like either will work. In case someone is new to cooling software programs ... I will say that Rain 2 does a very good job on my notebooks. I have downloads of Waterfall Pro, CPUIdle and others. They all seem to do a good job but Rain 2 does as well or slightly better (my own observation) in dropping the CPU temperature. The one thing I like about Rain 2 is it has the lowest amount of memory usage. Years ago I checked them all out with Memload (a little memory usage program for Windows 98) and Rain 2 was the lowest on that score. On my Dell notebook, where I actually have a working CPU temperature reading, it runs 8 to 10 degrees cooler. If I turn Rain off the temperature starts climbing almost immediately and when I turn it back on you can watch the temperature readings start to drop very fast. I have no CPU temperature program yet for my NEC Pentium 3 notebook ... still looking, but since I put Rain 2 on that computer many years ago, I know it is also running cooler because the fan will not run as much as it did with no Rain 2 program. So if Rain 2 is a fake or not much different from Rain 1 or other programs, I can say that Rain 2 does work very well and at the same time uses less memory than all the other cooling programs that I tested years ago. The memory thing is probably not such a big deal today, since I have added more memory to my Dell and NEC Pentium notebooks (512 MB) but I am just reporting what I observed with Memload when I tested all the cooling programs that I could find sometime back. It's just my decision that Rain 2 was the program for me in the end. .... I will add this, I never tested Rain 1 but I would assume that like Rain 2, it also has a low memory usage reading. I am using a Pentium M notebook now and I have no need for Rain 2 on this notebook since the CPU runs cooler and throttles down even more when idle (just like Rain 2 would do) so I don't have a Memload reading for now. If I get on the Dell or Nec later I will get a Memload reading on Rain 2. ... OK, I just got a Memload reading for Rain 2 off the Dell and NEC notebooks ... it is exactly the same reading on both notebooks ... 214.1 k ... if I remember, some of the other programs were close and one was 300 something, but this was so long ago and the memory usage figure is probably not a big deal in today's world anyway. Just use whatever program has the most appeal to you and really works. I am still on the hunt for a program that will give me a CPU temperature reading on the NEC. Just would like to have one ... if there is one that will work. ...

triger9 ... yes there is a Rain 2 but from what I have read, there isn't much difference between your version and Rain 2 ... maybe a few "extra" processors are listed ... not real sure. Never used version 1. Here's one download link, I just tried it now and it still works. Rain 2 doesn't list a Pentium 3 but this site says to select Pentium 2. Rain 2.0 http://www.eaglecomputing.com/portables/downloads.htm This utility will help keep your system cool and extend battery life. It's smaller than both Waterfall and CPUIdle and generally provides better results. To install, simply download, unzip, run install.exe, and select your processor--if you have a Pentium III, select Pentium II. When running, Rain will appear in your system tray as a chip with three water droplets. This utility is only useful under Win9x--NT's idle loop accomplishes the same job in NT. ....

Thanks jaclaz ... I had not come across that program (NextSensor). I will try it out later today and see what happens.

My two older Windows 98SE notebooks have a Pentium 3 processor ... a Dell and an NEC. I have never been able to find a program to read the CPU temperature for the NEC Pentium 3 ... I found a nice "unofficial" software program that reads the temperature (CPU and Hard Drive) for the Dell notebook. So far all the temperature programs that I have tried on the NEC notebook can only give a reading for the hard drive. I suspect it may be a motherboard thing but when I research if the Pentium 3 actually has any temperature sensors, some say no but some say yes ... but trying to find any actual software that can read a Pentium 3 processor will be the problem. As I said earlier, I found a program that was written for Dell notebooks (many models covered). I also use Rain 2 on both computers since they have Windows 98SE installed and it does work very well in keeping the CPU temperature lower. I can actually see a nice drop on the Dell with Rain 2 turned on and off since I can read the actual CPU temperature. With the NEC I think Rain 2 is also helping to control the CPU temperature. So my question is basically this ... I have tried many temperature programs for the NEC Pentium 3 but have not found any that read both the CPU and Hard Drive temperature, just the hard drive only ... like SpeedFan and such. Just wondering if anyone has come across a software program that works with Windows 98SE and can also read the Pentium 3 temperature on your notebook? ....in case anyone has a Dell notebook and would like to try the Fan-Temperature Control program, here's the link. I have a Dell Latitude and it really works nice for fan-temperature control along with Rain 2. http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/index.html Dell Inspiron/Latitude/Precision fan control utility I8kfanGUI is a graphical Windows application to show the internal temperatures and to control the fan operation on the Dell Inspiron/Latitude/Precision notebook series. It's running under Windows 2000 and above operating system versions (Windows 2000/XP/Server2003/Vista). For the original DOS command line utility look here. This program is licensed under the terms and conditions of the GNU general public license. FAQs ... http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/faq.html

I have a Thinkpad T-42 notebook with Windows 98SE installed. It came with XP SP1 but I bought it to get a newer notebook to run Windows 98SE. I had read somewhere that the Thinkpad T-42 was the last version that would run Windows 98SE ... but I am not 100% sure if that was correct. Anyway, yesterday I was searching around and came across this program called ThrottleWatch. I like how the Pentium M runs so much cooler ... on my Pentium III's I use Rain 2 to get a nice drop in temperature with using Windows 98SE. This little program might be of interest to some who also have a Pentium M and also a Pentium 4 and a Xeon processor for some extra information or just the throttle reading. It has a nice information display and works well with Windows 98SE. The website lists the version as 2.02 but I ended up with v2.01. http://www.techspot.com/downloads/400-throttle-watch.html ThrottleWatch v2.01 Windows All Utility for detecting and reporting the CPU throttling activity in Pentium 4, Xeon and Pentium M processors. The amount of heat a CPU produces varies according to the processing load. In situations of high sustained load (such as performance benchmarks, etc...), a CPU may produce more heat than the cooling mechanism is capable of removing and reach a high enough internal temperature to trigger throttling. ThrottleWatch monitors and graphically displays both the CPU load and any throttling that occurs. When ThrottleWatch is minimized, an icon is added to the system tray area of the Taskbar. The color of the icon changes when throttling is detected. ThrottleWatch can also create a journal file for use with external data analysis programs such as Microsoft Excel. Pressing the F5 key alternatively starts or stops the journal. additional info ... Monitors and displays both CPU load and throttling of Intel chips. ThrottleWatch is a utility for detecting and reporting the CPU throttling activity in Pentium 4, Xeon and Pentium M processors. The amount of heat a CPU produces varies according to the processing load. In situations of high sustained load (such as performance benchmarks, etc.), a CPU may produce more heat than the cooling mechanism is capable of removing and reach a high enough internal temperature to trigger throttling. ThrottleWatch monitors and graphically displays both the CPU load and any throttling that occurs. When ThrottleWatch is minimized, an icon is added to the system tray area of the Taskbar. The color of the icon changes when throttling is detected.Types of CPU throttling:TM1: "Thermal Monitoring 1" throttling is a feature of Pentium 4, P4 Xeon, Celeron ("Northwood" or "Prescott" cores) and Pentium M CPUs. TM1 throttling does not reduce the CPU clock speed - it inserts idle cycles into the instruction pipeline to reduce the processing load on the CPU, which in turn lowers the CPU temperature. TM2: "Thermal Monitoring 2" throttling is a superset of TM1 and is used on LGA-775 versions of the Pentium 4 and Celeron processors and also on the Pentium M series of processors. TM2 reduces processor temperature by lowering the CPU clock multiplier and thereby the processor core speed. ----------------------------------------------- Major Geeks site: http://majorgeeks.com/ThrottleWatch_d4431.html ...

Thanks tomasz86 ... I hadn't seen that program, looks interesting. I downloaded a copy to experiment with later on, hoping to stay with the icons for now. Just need to find where that "repair list" is when TweakUI uses it to "repair" the Desktop icons ... TweakUI goes to something on the hard drive ... probably in the WINNT folder somewhere but I wouldn't really know. ... thanks, was downloading some of your downloads yesterday. Great stuff.

I am having the same problem on XP also but I am working now with my Windows 2000 setup. I have tried some registry fixes, different programs that are supposed to keep the Desktop icons in the order that I want them to be ... nothing seems to work. I have 2 programs that work just fine in putting the icons back into the proper order that I originally had them in ... DIPS and Icon Restore. However, I would like a "permanent fix" to this problem. When I turn the computer on the icons always go back to the old order that I don't want or sometimes they will change back when actually doing something on the computer. I have deleted "shelliconcache" at least 8 times, found that tip on Google ... it doesn't work. When I go to TweakUI in the Control Panel there is a Repair tab there and it has a Repair Icons heading. I run that and it brings up the "old" arrangement that I don't want. What I'd like to know ... that "old" icon list is somewhere on my hard drive and hitting on that "Repair Icons" tab goes to that list and puts them back into that order on my Desktop. I go to DIPS and put them back in the correct order or the way I want them. Where is that list, what is it called and can I "manually" change it to the order I want or just delete it and it might show up again "fixed"? I don't understand all the really deep inner workings of an OS and there are people in this forum that really do have that knowledge. I'm mostly at the Windows 98SE forum but I started recently fooling around with Windows 2000 and XP. A few programs that I can't get to work on Win 98SE will work on Win 2000 or XP. I happen to like Windows 2000 Pro since I have been working with it and most all my Win 98SE programs will also work on Windows 2000. As I said earlier, I'm also having this Desktop icon arrangement problem with my XP setup but I'm thinking if I can get a fix for Windows 2000 ... then it may also solve my XP problem. Want to add ... all my icons are on the left side of the Desktop which is where I want them, they always stay on the left side but they just go out of order from the way I have them arranged. thanks ... want to add, I never seem to be able to get the forum search to work for me ... have tried many times before with this new forum setup but I get errors or something wrong with the parameter. If someone else had this problem and was able to solve it ... please share.

For anyone using the Stinger virus checker, there is a new updated version just released ... still seems to work on Windows 98SE ... at least on my machine. McAfee Labs Stinger ... Stinger is a standalone utility used to detect and remove specific viruses. It is not a substitute for full anti-virus protection, but rather a tool to assist administrators and users when dealing with an infected system. Stinger utilizes next-generation scan engine technology, including process scanning, digitally signed .DAT files, and scan performance optimizations. It detects and removes threats identified under the "List Viruses" icon in the Stinger application. http://www.mcafee.com/us/downloads/free-tools/how-to-use-stinger.aspx Stinger Build Number: 10.2.0.233 Build Date: 04-Aug-2011 Stinger download: http://www.mcafee.com/us/downloads/free-tools/stinger.aspx ...