Drive letters shifted when I add a 2nd HD w/1 logical partition. Why?

[Ludwig Von Cookie Koopa]

Another thing you can do is in the Bios you can set the drives before you go into Windows. IF your biois support this option.

Also about using outside programs to aline drives I would use this only if I need to use the D drive constantly.

About jumping in and out of DOS is another story. I think by the description it will work in DOS but you can't use the extra features. You could test the program while running windows to see if it works the way you want it to. Somebody needs to test this with a DOS program that loads items from multiple drives.

About this the extra partitian to the primary drive should have sloved the problem however in your case you have more then one.

[eidenk]

It is not recommended to make more than one primary partition per HDD and Windows 98 SE FDISK does not allow to create them.

Sorry to dig out this old thread but this does not appear to be correct, at least not the first part of it.

A user may create either:

0-3 primary partitions, and some number of logical partitions; or

4 primary partitions

If you have 4 primary partitions, there is no more room in this scheme for creating additional partitions. This is so because one primary partition entry is required to describe the first extended partition, if applicable, which will contain all logical partitions.

http://partitionlogic.org.uk/manual/partitions.html

[jaclaz]

eidenk, do take a deep breath , and re-read the sentence.

"It is not recommended" does not mean "impossible".

It is perfectly possible to make up to 4 primary partitions on a disk, and if you use some particular MBR's you can even make MORE than 4 .

The point is that a number of Operating Systems (particularly different versions of DOS and Win9x/ME) were developed and tested with the assumption that only one Primary Partitions in the MBR.

Using these operating systems on multiple primary partitioned hard disks can lead, in particular occasions, to data corruption , unlless all partitions but one are "hidden" at boot time, that's the reason why it is "not recommended".

Programmers of tools like the original MS FDISK evidently thought that to be so serious as to include in the tool a mechanism preventing the creation of more than one primary partition.

Several other tools, including Freedos FDISK, do not have such a limitation.

Please re-read this:

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showto...mp;#entry463153

and linked posts therein, where the matter is discussed.

jaclaz

[Ponch]

The idea of having multiple primary partitions did not even "touch" the minds of MS programmers at the time, and this is why the original fdisk won't allow the making of any primary partitions besides first one.

I guess the idea was "1 primary partition, 1 OS, Microsoft's, stick to it".

It is perfectly possible to make up to 4 primary partitions on a disk, and if you use some particular MBR's you can even make MORE than 4

Ranish Partition Manager and Boot Manager for instance can make and handle up to 31 primary partitions, but once you've booted, you only get 4 of them visible (could be including an extended and all it's logicals).

I also agree this is a strange reason to dig up a 5 months old thread.

[stax0711]

I think it is correct, Windows XP can be installed on logical drive in extended partition.

Sure but I think such a setup can cause problems, it's safer to have the system at C: and let a bootmanager hide other system partitions.

[jcarle]

The drive letters of drives using a FAT system is based on the following order:

Primary Partition of the IDE Primary Master (or SATA Channel 1)

Primary Partition of the IDE Primary Slave (or SATA Channel 2)

Primary Partition of the IDE Secondary Master (or SATA Channel 3)

Primary Partition of the IDE Secondary Slave (or SATA Channel 4)

Extended Partitions of the IDE Primary Master (or SATA Channel 1)

Extended Partitions of the IDE Primary Slave (or SATA Channel 2)

Extended Partitions of the IDE Secondary Master (or SATA Channel 3)

Extended Partitions of the IDE Secondary Slave (or SATA Channel 4)

The drive letters of drives using an NTFS system is actually controlled entirely by the NT HAL, which means that directly in windows, you can change the drive letter attributed to any drive.

Also, take note that although you can create more then one primary FAT partition, you will run into problems at some point or another. The reason that drive letters get attributed as I mentioned above is due to the fact that FAT was designed to have a single primary partition and a single extended partition. The extended partition can contain multiple logical partitions but the basis still remains that it's based around the primary/extended combo.

[jaclaz]

Sure but I think such a setup can cause problems, it's safer to have the system at C: and let a bootmanager hide other system partitions.

No, sorry, but the way you describe can potentially lead to much greater problems.

There is NO such thing as a "safer" way, as well as there is no "better" way, it all depends on what you need/want to achieve, but using third party bootmanagers, expecially if installed to MBR is, rather obviously, a deviation from "standard" and, as thus, can potentially lead to incompatibilities with other utilities that assume that the given "standard" is respected, statistically this is the MOST RISKY situation you can have.

On the contrary, more than 12 years of experience with NT based systems, confirm that installing on a logical volume inside an extended partition, as Gilles Vollant recommends:

http://www.winimage.com/bootpart.htm

keeping "standard" MBR and NTLDR, is a VERY safe way.

You might want to read this for further considerations:

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=33964&st=6

The drive letters of drives using an NTFS system is actually controlled entirely by the NT HAL, which means that directly in windows, you can change the drive letter attributed to any drive.

Though this is possible, a word of WARNING is needed, changing the SYSTEM drive letter can (and will) render the system UNBOOTABLE.

If you ever want to attempt such, BEFORE doing it, do read this and related links:

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=90495

jaclaz

Edited April 28, 2007 by jaclaz

[stax0711]

On the contrary, more than 12 years of experience with NT based systems, confirm that installing on a logical volume inside an extended partition, as Gilles Vollant recommends:

http://www.winimage.com/bootpart.htm

keeping "standard" MBR and NTLDR, is a VERY safe way.

Doesn't start Windows with standard setup only from a active primary partition which is always C:. If so a system in a logically partition hasn't drive letter C:, doesn't that fuddle some applications or tasks. I'm missing probably some things here

[jcarle]

Doesn't start Windows with standard setup only from a active primary partition which is always C:. If so a system in a logically partition hasn't drive letter C:, doesn't that fuddle some applications or tasks. I'm missing probably some things here

Not at all, unless the software was poorly written and assumes the system drive is C: without actually verifying it, but that's strictly a software point of view, it does not affect the Windows environment per se.

[eidenk]

Also, take note that although you can create more then one primary FAT partition, you will run into problems at some point or another.

Which ones ? I have disks with 4 primary partitions since years and I haven't encountered any problems so far.

The reason that drive letters get attributed as I mentioned above is due to the fact that FAT was designed to have a single primary partition and a single extended partition.

Nonsense sentence.

[jcarle]

Also, take note that although you can create more then one primary FAT partition, you will run into problems at some point or another.

Which ones ? I have disks with 4 primary partitions since years and I haven't encountered any problems so far.

The reason that drive letters get attributed as I mentioned above is due to the fact that FAT was designed to have a single primary partition and a single extended partition.

Nonsense sentence.

You are partly correct. I did make a mistake on half the information. I did further and more in depth research and here's what I found out. The Master Boot Record can contain a maximum of four primary partition only. The Extended Boot Record can however allow for more then partitions. And where I was correct is that you can only have a single EBR which will associate itself with the first MBR.

[eidenk]

Where you also have not been correct IMO is when you put FAT above all in the hierarchy and tie it to drive numbering.

FAT is only a filesystem on a partition.

http://www.sysinternals.com/Utilities/NtfsWindows98.html

The beeblebrox help file is also very good with regards to primaries/extended partitions:

http://students.cs.byu.edu/~codyb/

[jcarle]

Where you also have not been correct IMO is when you put FAT above all in the hierarchy and tie it to drive numbering.

Where did I say that?

The order of the physical drives is determined by the BIOS, then the OS. The order of the drive letters is controlled by the OS.

[eidenk]

Where you also have not been correct IMO is when you put FAT above all in the hierarchy and tie it to drive numbering.

Where did I say that?

Here :

The reason that drive letters get attributed as I mentioned above is due to the fact that FAT was designed to have a single primary partition and a single extended partition.

What do you mean by saying that FAT has partitions ? It does not make any sense, does it ?

[Ponch]

FAT was designed to have a single primary partition and a single extended partition.

What do you mean by saying that FAT has partitions ? It does not make any sense, does it ?

He obviously meant "FAT was designed for systems having single primary partition..." and he also meant FAT as OS from the times they only could read FAT and there for Win9X, as this is the Win9X forum. And may I remind both of you that this is a thread from november 06 and it's been answered since a long time .