Tripredacus Posted October 7, 2014 Share Posted October 7, 2014 I would put Windows Out Reach as the ones to be most ignored or ignored more thoroughly The problem with either our Winoutreach users here (David or Jessica) is that they tend to post using "form answers." This is typical also of the MSFT users on the Technet forums. While they are real people their posts seem more robotic. I totally understand why they post like this, its what their bosses want. If anyone has worked in a call center or help desk, they try to tie you down with basically using a form to get through the contact with the customer. I think that is why those types of posters are "ignored" because of how their posts come off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted October 7, 2014 Share Posted October 7, 2014 The problem with either our Winoutreach users here (David or Jessica) is that they tend to post using "form answers." This is typical also of the MSFT users on the Technet forums. While they are real people their posts seem more robotic. I totally understand why they post like this, its what their bosses want. If anyone has worked in a call center or help desk, they try to tie you down with basically using a form to get through the contact with the customer. I think that is why those types of posters are "ignored" because of how their posts come off. That is part of the problem. As I see it, the real problem is that they often answer to either question that were never asked or downright to a completely different question from the one that was asked. While it is common that people slip on a chocolate covered banana (or more generally in the xyz fallacy):http://homepage.ntlworld.com./jonathan.deboynepollard/FGA/put-down-the-chocolate-covered-banana.html i.e. there are issues in the actual question, they never try to get hold or what the actual problem/issue is and they simply spurt a pre-made answer that may or may not (usually not) apply to the asked question or to the intended question. Just like Call Center support people do, and this is also derived by the "form based" approach, they completely miss the sensibility to understand (between the lines or downright asking) "who" (in the sense of "at which knowledge level he/she is") is on the other end. I claim that one thing is providing support to "average Joe's" (or Mary's) and another thing is giving support to someone that possibly (excluded the specific question) may know more (often much more) than you do. Additionally, there is a profound difference in how in the typical call center support the situation is one-to-one, i.e. a customer calls to have from the specific guy/gal that answers the call a solution, a forum is different, you post there a question, and another user feels like wanting to help AND thinks to have a good suggestions, posts it. If you don't have (what you think is) a good suggestion you don't really-really have to reply. Now if you peek on (say) https://social.technet.microsoft.com/ you will find hundreds or thousands of replies by MVP's (or whatever badge they got) that are simply answering *something else*, surely not the asked question nor anything actually related to the issue of the OP or suggesting as a one-cure-for-all-illnesses a drive format and re-install of the OS. As long as this kind of non-replies come on a voluntary basis from some enthusiast, good-willing people (who, even if "badged", are "unofficial"), it is OK and part of the game, when the same non-reply comes from an official Microsoft representative which is actually paid for this, it is is IMHO more disturbing. Or maybe the scope (i.e. what these otherwise good guys/gals are paid for) is not that of helping the actual posters with the issue at hand but rather to be a sort of MS evangelist :http://microsoftjobsblog.com/what-is-a-technical-evangelist/i.e. an essentially marketing/promoting one. (as a side note, IF I had any influence in the Vatican the Apple guys that invented this - appalling - use of the word and the MS guys that still insist on using it would have been excommunicated in NO time) jaclaz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeA Posted October 7, 2014 Share Posted October 7, 2014 (as a side note, IF I had any influence in the Vatican the Apple guys that invented this - appalling - use of the word and the MS guys that still insist on using it would have been excommunicated in NO time) An argument could be made that, in this increasingly secularized culture, religion is being (has been?) replaced by a variety of "cults" of various degrees of importance and longevity. We've certainly heard of the Apple cult, but there are also Microsoft cultists (we've seen them) and Linux cultists, etc. Having excluded the transcendent, people seek out ever more trivial idols to worship and argue over. --JorgeA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted October 8, 2014 Author Share Posted October 8, 2014 False idols... Is it time for biblical pestilence and floods? But wait, threats of that are not literal, though... Are they? -Noel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osRe Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 (edited) suggesting as a one-cure-for-all-illnesses a drive format and re-install of the OS.But isn't that the best solution to OS problems? Recently, I was actually close to doing that for the first time ever (minus the format). Edited October 8, 2014 by shae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 But isn't that the best solution to OS problems? Define "best". It is the most radical one, hardly the most convenient one, rarely the fastest one, and never the most proper solution, fundamentally it is not a solution at all, but rather a work-around to delay the re-occurrence of the same issue, before or later. Which does not mean that in some situations can actually represent a valid choice. jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osRe Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 It was a joke, see line 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 It was a joke, see line 2. I know , but someone may have taken that as serious . jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 Microsoft took it seriously. Refresh and Reset capabilities in Windows 8. "We know you'll never be able to keep this system running because there's only one guy we've ever heard of who's done it, so for the rest of you here's a couple of giant Panic Buttons." -Noel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osRe Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Maybe it's a step in the right direction? What I want to see next: efficient core system snapshotting/backup, per-program sandboxing/virtualization with user control over where to store files/registry. Since there's already native VHD boot support, and some level of virtualization for legacy 32-bit or in the compatibility modes, it's halfway there. Now that I think of that, maybe I should check what Sandboxie's been up to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 (edited) what I want to see next: efficient core system snapshotting/backup Good goal. We had a functional and mature ability to do volume snapshots and to schedule VSS backups with Win 7. It was deprecated in Win 8, though still accessible through command line machinations. The recent trend is, unfortunately, in the opposite direction. I don't see a sparkling new Windows Backup interface in the pre-release software. There IS, however the appearance of the "Previous Versions" tab. I can't help but think that's something that slipped through the cracks, though... It's been there all along, just actively disabled. I'd bet that it's going to go away again. I hope they listen, and restore some of these serious computing features. Unfortunately, it's going to take a LOT of time to get back on the straight and narrow. Keep in mind what we will see many months from now already has to be designed and for the most part implemented. They can't just change the system overnight, after sending out the TP. -Noel Edited October 9, 2014 by NoelC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midnight rambler Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 If m$ does not want to compete in the desktop/laptop market that's there problem not ours - or it could be ours as well when the choice is Mac which is costly or open source less secure. If they don't want to compete in the tablet/phone market? If they don't know the difference between a desktop and a tablet then they're retarded. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoelC Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 they're retarded. That's the conclusion I keep coming to as well. At least the decision-makers. However, I'm starting to worry about the technical people as well. -Noel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 An image is worth a thousand words. jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralcool Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 Long story cut very short. My father, approaching 70. Was demanding a Windows 7 disc to rebuild his new/spare laptop my brother gave him months ago. He already had one, but somehow he couldn't make it happen. I gave him the link to the Windows 10 Preview blah. He burnt the iso, installed a fresh system.... Then moaned since last friday. (This is the simplified version) "Why did they rearrange the deckchairs, I can't find my files... etc" Today i logged in with TeamViewer, installed ClassicShell. Showed that really nothing has changed, other than some weird deletions and new menus. Now he is convinced his Win7 hybrid is workable, but not convinced. Truth is, this is just the kind of market Microsoft are missing out of. If you or I buy our parents (if you can) a new laptop/tablet for christmas... How intuitive is it that they can navigate around without assistance. My father (bless him) failed when he called to ask how to turn it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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