Need a second opinion

[Tripredacus]

I posted this config on another forum, and people complained that I picked a bad video card. I am sold on the board and it supports ATI Crossfire technology, and I want DirectX 10 thus I must aim for a Vista system. Tell me what you think:

+++Base system+++

$202: Intel D975xbx2 motherboard

$265: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 2.4GHz retail (comes with the cpu fan)

$33: Samsung 1GB PC2-6400 240pin DDR2 800MHz

$42: Western Digital SATA 80GB Hard drive

$114: Antec P180B ATX Case

$70: Antec Neo HE 430w ATX PSU

$89: Sapphire 100207L Radeon HD 2600 PRO 512MB PCIEx16

I can use my sound card and my cd drives from my current system.

Of course this is a base system because I can add more RAM (which I plan to go up to 4GB to start) another hard drive or two and also definately get a second video card.

Also unlike my last motherboard, Intel's site did not give a recommended or minimum power supply wattage that I would need. Is the one I picked sufficient for the hardware inside? I just picked the next level up from what I have now, which is a 400w. And I know some people don't like Sapphire but I have purchased from them before and have no problem.

[nitroshift]

Just head over to Tomshardware and Anandtech and see for yourself the performance of the 2600 card. I read about it and wasn`t too impressed (it has DDR2 to start off with), so yeah, get a better card. Just my 0.02$...

[Tripredacus]

No, the 2600 Pro has DDR3, you are thinking of the 2400 maybe.

EDIT: lol I said DDR3 to myself and posted DDR2.

Edited November 2, 2007 by Tripredacus

[puntoMX]

I posted this config on another forum, and people complained that I picked a bad video card. I am sold on the board and it supports ATI Crossfire technology, and I want DirectX 10 thus I must aim for a Vista system. Tell me what you think:

You’re sold on that motherboard? You must be one of few and you are picking an outdated chipset there, even the 965 series is released after the 975, not to mention that is uses the same Southbridge (ICH7) as the 945 series. If you want to have crossfire then go with an x38 with ICH10R (yes, always the raid version) chipset and a brand like Asus or Gigabyte. But, there is No use in buying a mid-range video card and set it in Crossfire.

It could be that you don’t like nVidia, but they just released there 8800GT with 512MB, I would check that one out. If you really want to stick with ATi and you can leave directX 10.0 alone then look at the x1950 series. Also remember that soon PCI-E 2.0 and DirectX 10.1 is coming up, and soon in this case is a month or 2 . Also DO NOT get any cards with DDR2, GDDR3 and up are needed these days on video cards.

Quad core with just 1GB, just get your self 2 sticks of those to begin with. If you want to use 2 video cards then get your self a 620watt PSU from Corsair (HX620).

Any help needed on building a system, ask us… Also post were you like to buy your components…

(I think this was more then $0.02 )

[nmX.Memnoch]

I have to agree with puntoMX about the motherboard...don't get anything that's 975X based...or even 965 based (I know it's confusing but the 965 is actually newer than the 975X). Go with an X38 setup, or if you can wait a bit Intel has brought the release of the X48 forward by a couple of months. Rumor is that it will either be released later this month or sometime next month.

As for the motherboard manufacturer, if you aren't going to overclock I don't see a problem going with an Intel manufactured motherboard. They're definitely stable and fast. You'll have a little bit of overclocking options with the newer Intel motherboards, but not near to the level of tweakability from something from Asus or Gigabyte.

On to the video card...I'd have to recommend that you look at an 8800GT based card as well. NVIDIA just released that GPU and it's numbers are very promising. No, you won't be able to do SLI on an Intel chipset, but I really don't think that will matter much anyway once you see some of the numbers (both price and performance) for the 8800GT based cards.

[Tripredacus]

Well I was an avid 3DFX supporter but they got bought up by nVidia so I had switched to a GeForce. I recently got a Sapphire Radeon 6800XP so that I could at least play Oblivion. I chose that chipset based on price, ram amount and AGP 4x 1.5v availability. That card seems to work quite well. I have some reservations, however. I always use Intel boards now mostly because I 'boycott' (because hate is too strong a word) a lot of manufacturers like MSI, Acer, SIS, etc and never was sold on the idea of an AMD CPU or Chipset. I am also not really fond of VIA chipsets either.

Here was how my choice for motherboard came down. I went to Intel's site and used the configurator. I looked for 2 things.

1. Did not have built in video (would prefer not to have built in sound but I can live with that)

2. Supported a quad core

I found that the board I chose (and the DX38BT which I could not find for sale anywhere) supported Crossfire. So I checked AMD's site for cards that support Crossfire and also DirectX 10. I would not have a problem going with a low end card to start and buy two higher end cards later.

But I also admit that my hardware knowledge is severely dated. Back when I made the computer I use now, it was top of the line and I knew it was. I didn't have to ask people questions about it or anything like that. Of course I early adopted into RAMBUS first gen because I could afford it, unfortunately most people couldn't at the time (and I can't now, hence the reason for a new system) and it was a technology that only lasted 2 revs. As I understand it, RAMBUS was only surpassed about 2-3 years ago. I still pride that technology.

I know nothing about RAM nowadays, like how they figure out the PCnumber that they use.

So let me post what it is I am looking for, and perhaps suggest a good workaround for that.

1. Intel motherboard and chipset

2. Intel Quad Core CPU

3. No integrated video (and sound if possible)

4. A video card supporting DirectX 10

5. a mid-tower case

6. be able to play Fallout 3 when it comes out

7. I don't care about BioShock

So there you have it.

Edited November 2, 2007 by Tripredacus

[nmX.Memnoch]

So what exactly are you needing in the way of parts?

We know you need the motherboard and video card and I gather that you are also looking for a CPU (?), but what else do you need? RAM, SATA hard drive(s), power supply (probably so with the newer motherboard and video card), DVD burner(s), sound card, etc, etc.

If you need RAM are you looking for something with DDR2 or DDR3? DDR3 is ramping up really fast, but it's also more expensive. Of course, the X38 boards are also going to be expensive. Speaking of, give us a rough estimate on how much you're willing to spend...that actually will go a long way towards dictating what we recommend.

From what I gather, what you really care about is the Intel CPU and chipset. You can get some really good board from other manufacturers like Asus and Gigabyte. I don't typically recommend boards from MSI, DFI and abit, but some people have good luck with them.

[bonestonne]

over the Antec PSU, i'd go for Corsair VX430...nothing against Antec, but i'd prefer a VX430.

for a brand new system, why not a larger hard drive as well?

i'm not much for debating chipsets, so i'll let the more educated spins circles around heads over it.

[Tripredacus]

So what exactly are you needing in the way of parts?

We know you need the motherboard and video card and I gather that you are also looking for a CPU (?), but what else do you need? RAM, SATA hard drive(s), power supply (probably so with the newer motherboard and video card), DVD burner(s), sound card, etc, etc.

From what I gather, what you really care about is the Intel CPU and chipset. You can get some really good board from other manufacturers like Asus and Gigabyte. I don't typically recommend boards from MSI, DFI and abit, but some people have good luck with them.

I already have keyboard, mouse, monitor, sound card and speakers, dvd drive. I just can't upgrade my current computer anymore because of the cost, since it is at the max for CPU and it uses 168 pin RDRAM. Also because of the age of it, I will need new hard drives, ram, cpu motherboard, case, power supply, video card. I don't technically need a new case but I have a full tower steel case. It takes up a lot of room and is pretty heavy. I guess you could say I am bored of the case already.

over the Antec PSU, i'd go for Corsair VX430...nothing against Antec, but i'd prefer a VX430.

for a brand new system, why not a larger hard drive as well?

I use the hard drive model where the boot/c: drive is smaller than storage drives. I won't have a need for larger data drives at first, so I did not include them in my target build.

Also, as far as the Intel board selection goes, I made the selection based on the fact that the board did not have onboard video. I try to manage my resources as well as I can. Secondly, I chose Intel because it will allow me to get a Vista distro cheaper if I get an OEM version with the volume license where I work. And I won't have to worry about the issues I have with my XP computer as it has a Site License version of XP that can't do Windows update because it looks for a SUS that isn't present.

[nmX.Memnoch]

I use the hard drive model where the boot/c: drive is smaller than storage drives. I won't have a need for larger data drives at first, so I did not include them in my target build.

Still, from a performance stand point you still want a larger drive. Larger drives hold more data per platter (i.e. they have a greater aerial density). The higher the aerial density, the faster the drive performs and if you aren't putting a lot of files on the drive, then all of the files can be stored on the fastest part of the drive...giving you the best performance possible.

Also, as far as the Intel board selection goes, I made the selection based on the fact that the board did not have onboard video. I try to manage my resources as well as I can. Secondly, I chose Intel because it will allow me to get a Vista distro cheaper if I get an OEM version with the volume license where I work. And I won't have to worry about the issues I have with my XP computer as it has a Site License version of XP that can't do Windows update because it looks for a SUS that isn't present.

Something doesn't sound right about that. For starters, there's no such thing as a "site license" for Windows...of any version. Second, you can't purchase an OEM license against a volume license. You can, however, purchase an OEM license when purchasing either a complete new pre-built computer (Dell, HP, etc) or if you're purchasing a qualifying part (motherboard). It is possible that you may have an employee purchase program where you work, which would allow you to purchase Microsoft software at discounted prices.

Last, as to the SUS issue, you can fix that on your personal computer using GPEDIT.MSC. Just go in and set all of the Automatic Updates options to "Not Configured".

Here are my hardware recommendations. I'm sure others will recommend some other choices as well. Note that I left off a case recommendation.

Motherboard: (pick one depending on your budget)

1) Budget Choice: Asus P5K-E LGA775 P35 based

$144.99 + $6.61 shipping

2) Enthusiast Choice: Asus P5E LGA775 X38 based

Supports PCI Express 2.0

$234.99 + $7.14 shipping

Processor:

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 2.4GHz 2x4MB L2 Cache

$284.99

RAM:

Corsair XMS2 1066 PC8500 2GB Kit (2x1GB)

$149.00 - $30 MIR = $119.00

Video Card: (get this single card in lieue of a low end CrossFire setup)

XFX GeForce 8800GT based card

This card is PCIe 2.0 capable so you'd get the full benefit on the X38 based motherboard. However, it will work on PCIe 1.1 motherboards.

$269.99 + $6.33 shippping - BACKORDERED

Hard Drive - Operating System:

Seagate 7200.10 250GB SATA 3Gbps 16MB Cache

$69.99

Hard Drive - Storage:

Seagate 7200.10 500GB SATA 3Gbps 16MB Cache

$119.99

[Tripredacus]

Hmm that is an interesting option....

As for the different licensing, we already sell people Volume license versions of Windows Vista AND XP on the same orders. As far as the site license thing, basically the company i worked for used a version of Windows XP where they would use Altiris to install Windows with an image. And it never required a serial number. The Windows there used a site license, which btw is the IRL term for those versions of Windows that people who steal it like to call "Corporate Edition", but evidently when your company needs to build like 20,000 computers for your employees, Microsoft has additional licensing abilities for you to use. At first I got annoyed when people would talk about that but I understand now that unless you work IT in a very large company, you aren't going to realise that there are actual legit site licensed copied of Windows out there!

[nmX.Memnoch]

Trust me, there is no such thing as a Site License for Windows. I do work in IT...for a very large organization (the US Air Force). On the base I work on we have well over 15K machines...and that's just at one base. It's not called a "site license", it's called a "Volume License" and that is what people are calling the "Corporate Edition". Under the Volume License licensing you are still required to purchase a seperate license for every single workstation, laptop, tablet, etc that you are going to install Windows on.

http://download.microsoft.com/download/f/4...99_PROC_WLG.PDF

As you will note in the PDF, Volume Licenses do not cover the initial Windows license (i.e. you still have to purchase a full OEM or Retail license). Generally, companies get that initial license with the purchase of new PCs. What the Volume License provides for is upgrades and Software Assurance. It also provides for the use of a single install key that doesn't require activation.

Speaking of which, I guarantee that the install you are using at work requires a product key. There is no version of Windows that doesn't require one. However, you can integrate the product key into the media (and Volume keys don't require activation). Take a look at your install media you use at work. In the i386 directory that should be a file called WINNT.SIF. In that file will be contained settings that Windows Setup uses, including the product key.

[puntoMX]

There is no version of Windows that doesn't require one.

Just some side information, but the new licences that will come out for XP and Vista will have no "key", they generate there hardware key but you need to activate your windows. I could be wrong, just let me know if I am .

EDIT: Never mind, forget what I was posting here .

[cluberti]

No, they still use keys. It's just the activation methods that have changed (like MAK and KMS for volume license customers).

[nmX.Memnoch]

There is no version of Windows that doesn't require one.

Just some side information, but the new licences that will come out for XP and Vista will have no "key", they generate there hardware key but you need to activate your windows. I could be wrong, just let me know if I am .

As cluberti said, they still use a key...you just don't put it in during install. Instead you enter the key at the time of Activation.

EDIT: Never mind, forget what I was posting here .

OK!!