Dogway

When I run QFECheck I get these HF as needed to be reinstalled. I install them as normal (not slipstreamed). 2868626 2876331 (Graphics Device Interface) November: IE8-2888505 2849470 (remote procedure) 2864063 (theme) 2876217 (ole) http://imageshack.us/a/img30/6793/wu0i.png http://imageshack.us/a/img707/5586/j7we.png Also a question, is it possible to "install" .cab hotfixes manually? for example, placing the dll and cat files on their folder, and adding the registry entries?

I see, so the "Performance Optimizations" actually "do things" that either XP or 7 don't. So at practice using XP or 7 is indifferent for the end user. This SSD technology seems rather immature still, nobody knows what really is what and what should be done, actually I could say the same about computers. It looks like a giant mess of great and sometimes not so great ideas that somewhat made their way to surprisingly function together and not break apart. You said that what Performance Optimizations does is run some minutes being TRIM aware, so it's more a kind of prevention than say "fixing". But the next quote says that after applying Performance Optimizations the SSD runs 30%-40% better, kinda fixing past degradation.

But if TRIM is a real time task (ie. when files are handled), what is an on demand TRIM supposed to do? It is passive (real time at background) or active (on demand). If you can execute TRIM on demand through software, it would well accomplish the same goal through 7's internal (and automatic/passive) TRIM, don't you think?

The interesting thing is that what the Magician Software seems to do is an on demand TRIM, if that is so, then TRIM is not a real time thing at all, and the data to be trimmed must be hold somewhere (SSD?) meanwhile, in that case my theory would apply.

I thought it would have been kind of defragmenting. Whatever OS can access the "fragmented" table and thus execute TRIM on that. A passive process. So XP is only able to allow the SSD to do GC, which this time indeed is a passive process... Still, if 7 doesn't see the XP partition will it be able to do the GC? meaning does GC only requires the SSD to be turned on or needs the intervention of an OS?

Windows 7 TRIM the windows 7 partition. It won't TRIM the XP partition automatically.TRIM informs the SSD firmware a storage space is deleted. If you intent to TRIM the XP partition at Windows 7, use the Magican software too. By that standard a data SSD will never be object of TRIM? that sounds strange. I would say 7 uses TRIM on all SSD volumes it sees, but correct me if I'm wrong. Do this from the installed Windows 7.If it's hidden, you can't assign a letter. I see, so diskpart "inside" 7, from a cmd box. I found all key drivers for XP on my hardware, I did a research before buying everything. Hope everything is fine. I would believe I included all driver packs except storage in driverspack, so that should be fine.

No, live running TRIM is not possible, on demand TRIM is but using the software, since TRIM ability is not originally included in XP it is performed through a hack, through the ATA interface (ATA PASS command?) or something, can't tell you exactly how, I'm looking for the page I read that but can't find. That's why although it is not critical, I chose to let 7 do some trimming while I'm booted into this OS. It seems the SSD itself does some GC on its own, is not as fast as TRIM, but it's something. Thanks for fernando's modded drivers, I already had everything downloaded for XP, I guess 7 doesn't need the drivers to be slipstreamed right? Another thing I wondered last night is if I need to start from scratch. I ask because before I could just drop my past nlite image and use it as a base for including some drivers in nlite, that's possible, but maybe that was before including the driverspack, which uses another software and is advised to be used at the end, it seems to intercept the nlite chain. It adds some files to the OEM folder. There's also a file on $OEM$ folder called cmdlines.txt with "rundll32 advpack.dll,LaunchINFSection nLite.inf,U". I'm not sure if I need to rebuild the driverspack as well. I might do it as well while updating some packs. At windows 7 diskpart: set the XP partition ID 7 to unhide this partition. Is that before or after I (unhide) assign letter to XP partition? I say because if I do that previous to boot, XP partition can be auto-assigned a letter which is undesirable, specially before 7 install (and where by all means 7 should only see one partition to avoid the creation of the 100Mb partition). If later I can give a letter with diskpart though, not sure what to do here.

sorry, not "must", technically speaking, I was obeying to my above setup diagram. I want it hidden at OS level since I don't want to bother with the other OS partition at any time.

Ah thank you, that's what I initially had on mind, so it's fine. I also was struggling about if I had to enable back XP partition (1st partition which remained hidden while installed 7 on 2nd partition) at the end of my procedure or not. Later I unhide XP partition from inside 7, but I'm not sure if that has any correlation with ID's. Ultimately both partitions need to be unhidden at boot level so they can be accessed indistinctly, only that the 2nd partition (7's) must be hidden (without letter) at OS level in XP.

I recall reading that XP only supports TRIM through a hack (using the software though) *and* on demand. Meaning that I should execute the TRIM command quite oftenly and still wonder if the hack worked. I'm not sure if XP can do background GC, but I guess not, that's why I let 7 see XP partition, so it can take its idle time to do background GC. I use a Z87 chipset. If I'm on AHCI I don't need that hotfix right? The SSD is a samsung 840 Pro 128Gb so it's smaller than 137Gb. I will use 7's bootmgr, that's how jaclaz explained it (drop the XP boot files previously to 7's partition, then bootmgr imports settings). You said; "Not the best idea at a SSD at each boot. How often do you reboot to other OS?", so I thought that at each boot (reboot to other OS on daily use) I had to change the ID's or hide/unhide. My intention was to find a (safe) replacement for grub4dos hide/unhide commands, so I don't need to switch constantly between the 7 and grub4dos CD at install, a real pain.

yes, I bought a samsung 840 for the same reason, the software, but that only solves half the equation for SSD on XP, so I leave the XP partition visible to 7 so it can do the trimming, etc in background. I meant that for the installation, I would like to use the diskpart hide/unhide "commands" so I don't have to reboot, insert grub4dos, and all everytime I need it on my above procedure. I would think this is only necessary at install? For daily use, boot to 7, etc I don't need to hide or unhide anything, or set IDs right? I will start booting to 7 like 3 or 4 times a week, and more often over time I hope, as it will serve as my transition until XP dies.

thanks cdob, SSD is indeed a game changer, so many things need to be known... Yes, it looks like I should use 17. Also read it here. I looked for that list for a while, probably not enough so thank you. I'm not entirely sure I should use 07 either, or look for the disk/partition inherent ID and set to that. Switching constantly to grub4dos can be tiresome.

Thanks cdbob, huge help, I guess that diskpart is doing already everything I had planned for grub4dos... I wasn't sure so I explicitly added the align flag to the command, my question is how I create the second partition from the unpartitioned space, I set it as if "create partition primary" will create a partition of all available space minus hidden ID=27 space. I also wonder if it's not better full instead of quick format in a SSD. This is how it should end, D: is a second logical drive HDD: on XP: C: (SSD 1st partition) D: (2nd Drive) (for "Documents and Settings XPx86") on 7 (boot manager): C: (SSD 2nd Partition) D: (2nd Drive) (for "Documents and Settings 7x64") M: (SSD 1st Partition) boot to 7 CDdiskpartsel disk 0convert basiccreate partition primary size=65560 align=1024format fs ntfssel par 1set ID=27 overridecreate partition primary align=1024format fs ntfssel par 1set ID=07 overrideactivesel par 2set ID=27 overridelist parexitInstall XP, and inside XP in Disk Management unhide partition 2, copy there the XP boot files (NTLDR, boot.ini, NTDETECT.COM), and hide again.boot to 7 CD againsel disk 0sel par 1detail partitionset ID=27 overridesel par 2set ID=07 overrideactiveexitInstall 7 (because there is only one partition previously created it won't create the System Reserved Partition of 100Mb)Enter 7 and unhide XP partition from inside 7, assign a late (ie M:) letter.1. Boot to 7 CD Diskpart and create both partitions with correct SSD alignment and format them.2. Hide 2nd partition and install XP on 1st partition. 3. On XP Disk Management unhide 2nd partition (assign letter), copy boot files to it, and hide again (since I won't be able later due to it being a "boot" partition). 4. Boot to 7 CD Diskpart again, hide XP partition, check partition 2 is unhidden, make active and install 7. 5. Enter 7 (now default boot loader) and unhide XP partition (by assigning letter). I think this is how I will proceed if nobody warns me of something wrong. I'm sorry this dragged to a somewhat extension of my last thread but that rendered as a lost cause.

So diskpart will manage SSD alignment just fine right? Will D: be safe from 7? Also is XP own partitioner ok for a SSD (I will first install XP on it). PD: I think I will first boot to 7 CD, do all the partitioning there (7's diskpart should be aware of SSD), then install XP, and after the rest with the 7 CD back again.

1.I read that in order to prevent 7's additional 100mb partition you need to feed 7 with a previously partitioned "single" partition, that is, if 7 sees another partition around it will try to install bootloader and all that jazz there. Is this true? 2.I ask because additionally I need to supply 7 with a D: drive in which it will install the Windows user profile (Documents and Settings, etc) by means of unattended CD, since well I will be using a SSD as my system drive. What can I do to circumvent both requirements? 3.I also have another question, the SSD needs pre-partitioning for avoiding the 7's unneeded 100mb partition. What tool can I use to partition the SSD that at the same time doesn't screw with the SSD's alignment? Thank you!

quote day? did you even click the link? hahaha good one.

oh "Douglas Adams"! Now I see how I didn't know him!! Let me add a quote myself:

Yep jaclaz Your quote balloon is missing, but at any rate some people don't even get to learn. Dogway

There's another option indeed, install OS, let it grow mold and when you take it back in 5 years time it will be as shiny as new. You never pass one day without learning something new, don't ya?

I think that for some reason you are taking my words too personal, trying to cause a stir or something. I think that you feel stupid or angry yourself after making or trying to make fun of me in the first post thinking I was asking the same thing all over and then realising that there were 2 new things that would make the set up harder and different, a new OS 7, and a fixed "D:" drive for the user profile folders. Maybe I took some of your posts lightly after you tried to lecture me on unattended (something done or not worried about and not asked) or unrelated things, which I might welcome but not as much under lack of help on the main issue. If you are worried about my memory retention on the old dual boot thread, don't worry, I made myself an useful txt explaining myself everything in my own words. I don't forget what I deem worth remembering. I make unattendeds because it's less of a pain to reinstall OS that way, I have windows very customized and at the same time I reinstall almost once per year due to using many programs (OS reinstall is actually recommended every 1 or 2 years). Hidden drives is important if you want to fully isolate systems (think of virus), I also find C: for OS and D: for data more convenient, I can picture myself messing things up installing programs in C: while on Win7 (D:), you can't judge people by your own standards. I just have one PC now, all the rest died this year so I want it fine and working, I don't game on them, just study and work so I need to feel comfortable since I deal many hours with a lot of files and numerous programs, etc. If you don't need to know anything else, and seemingly have nothing more to add just let it go so somebody can come to help (unlikely here since you already took over). I might ask at another place, who knows.

I don't know why you hand pick every other thing that makes up for an argument that I'm not calling out, instead of helping me to set up a dual boot. They guy you insist to quote to me is doing things very distinctly. I don't want to know-it-all, nor pretend to take a PhD on computer systems. That user "BrianWilder" starts with a SSD clean of partitions in which he will create the dumb 100mb partition (contrary to what you suggests), and an unmodified 7, and then upon install goes to 7's audit mode to make an unattended file (something I will already had done on Win Toolkit previously on my unattended ISO). The installation of my unattended OS's are FULLY unattended, my grub4dos dual boot set up is FULLY attended. Let me remark that again, from the point I click on "install XP" I can decide to go watch a movie, and when I'm back I have my system running with hotfixes, programs, custom theme, and some drivers as well. But from that point then I have to reboot and to attend grub4dos to set up for a dual boot. What else is that you need to know?

I never used the word "move", I guess that's why I never hit that page. Anyways I didn't come here to learn how to make unattendeds, with the premise that both unattended OS's (XP's and 7's) are set to place user folders in D: from installation what else do you need to know that changes the dual boot configuration mechanism? That link explains nothing different from what I do with nlite or later with Win Toolkit or whatever application, is just another "unattended".

Ok, I will make the partitions on the SSD later today or tomorrow using XP. For the D&S folder on D: I will use nlite's last session ini file, there's a section for it. [Options]CABNoHighDisableFreereqDisableMinMemProfilesDir = "D:\Documents and Settings (XP)"TargetPath = "WINDOWS"temp_dir = "D:\Documents and Settings\Administrator\Configuración local\Temp"AdvTweaksI don't know if there are other or better ways for it, for Win7 I still have to do the research but I guess something similar is possible. In principle method02 should work if I don't do the dumb test, and I'm PRETTY SURE that I did everything correct when changing the boot.ini.

Thanks for input. I'm not whining about it, I'm excusing the creation of a new thread. Anyway your response on that link is unrelated here, not because an SSD is any different than a HDD, but because my approach changes when I put an SSD in between, mainly because I will place "Documents and Settings" on D: at boot. That changes the whole thing and I'm not sure you took that into account on your 2 methods. What I extract from your methods is next: Method 01: -Make partitions (question: where, what tools, ie. as I exposed above gparted creates issues) -Install 7 normally on 1st partition. Now this will make 7 partition to be named C: (question; what letter will the 2nd partition be assigned? I need it to be other than D: because this one needs to be my HDD drive.) -Now I hide 1st partition (7's) and install XP on 2nd's, therefore now HDD drive will be assigned D: and D&S will be placed there. -Boot to Win7, and access my 2nd (XP's) partition (D: letter? read my above question) now I can change the letter to M: for example, and copy the boot files to 1st partition (7's). -Then correct the path of XP's location (2nd partition instead of 1st, see below) on boot.ini placed in 1st partition. -change from: multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(0)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP... to: multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP... -change my 7 boot settings to add XP -the boot loader will be 7's, so I change there my default boot system. Method 02: -Make partitions (question: where, what tools, ie. as I exposed above gparted creates issues) -1st partition is nonexistent when XP is installed so XP has HDD drive as D:, so it installs D&S there. -recreate 1st partition and make active from XP and copy to it the XP's boot files, then correct the boot.ini path to the new XP location. -change from: multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(0)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP... to: multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP... -test that the machine boots (reads 1st partition boot.ini correctly). Now question: once entered on XP recreated 1st partition has what letter? -hide 2nd (XP's) partition (so HDD drive gets D: on 7) and install Win7 on 1st partition. 7 will import "XP"'s boot settings therefore I will use 7 boot manager. I change on 7 boot options the default boot system (XP on my case) -unhide 2nd partition (XP's) so I can use trim on it from 7.

OK, I'm just one week away of doing the real thing, so I'm going to review the process. It's the continuation of this thread but my last post was ignored, so I will start with a clean sheet now. I will use one SSD on MBR (UEFI on BIOS mode) with 2 partitions, XP on first, and 7 on second partition (that is, no 100Mb partition from 7). This is what I want: on XP: C: (SSD 1st partition) D: (2nd Drive) (for "Documents and Settings") on 7: C: (SSD 2nd Partition) D: (2nd Drive) (for "Documents and Settings") M: (SSD 1st Partition) I need 7 to watch XP partition for the SSD Trim, which XP can't do alone. Yet, I don't want it to override the default D: partition letter which will be used for Data on both OS, and both XP and 7 "Documents and Settings" folders. My questions are next, I pretend to use grub4dos as explained here, is that possible? I mean I will use UEFI in BIOS mode, and MBR type partitions. Also, what OS should I install first, maybe this question is linked to: what boot manager is recommended? (XP, 7, or 3rd party's). Then I also wonder what to do to avoid the 100mb partition Win7 creates. I have read that for that you better create partitions beforehand, that's fine. My question is, can I then format it to NTFS? My intention is to plug the SSD to my current XP, and partition and format to NTFS, the problem is that giving partitioning or formatting to a drive also "creates a proper boot sector on the drive", and that can cause issues. To make myself clear on a question I had on the previous thread I guess this guy had problems installing Win7 over MBR because he was on EFI mode (instead of BIOS compatibility mode), is that correct? This would be my grub4dos procedure, in the case of using 7's bootmanager: -make XP partition the root partition with:root (hd0,0)ls-check is the correct partition and make it active (as in C:), while hiding second partition (7's partition)makeactive (hd0,0)hide (hd0,1)-reboot, and install XP (7's "second" partition will now have a random letter and show as inactive), let it do the unattended, etc. reboot and load again grub4dos from CD to unhide 7 partition, make it active (default OS) by typing:unhide (hd0,1)makeactive (hd0,1)-Install Windows7, now Windows7 will install its boot sector on the XP partition (unhidden), so the 7's boot manager will recognize it and allow it to boot under the bootmanager. So in this case the Win7 boot manager will be used. Then you can go back to grub to set the XP partition active to make it the default OS.makeactive (hd0,0)The big problem here is the last step installing Windows7. I need the first (XP) partition (hd0,0) unhidden so 7 can install its boot sector on it, yet I want it hidden so in fact my Data drive which will be my default drive for "Document and Settings" is assigned the D: letter. I don't know how to make XP partition unhidden and at the same time not being D: (just a random late letter is ok).