Jaqie Fox Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 I'll give you links which explain it then try once more to explain why it is a performance bottleneck to you since you asked so nicely http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR2DDR2, DDR, and SDR have a dedicated bus at a set rate for their memory. It is not a peer bus, it is a point to point bus. There is a set amount of bandwidth available between the memory chips and the memory controller (built into the CPU core nowadays). The highest bandwidth officially available for DDR2 AFAIK is PC2-6400 meaning 6.4GB/s. Dual channel can double this, but there is no commonly implemented solution to increasing it further in a DDR2 based system.This is critical to my point.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCIEPCIE x16 has a theoretical max bandwidth of 4GiB/s (4000MB/s). Any single video card that is on this bus is limited to that speed of transferring data between it's ram and the system ram.http://www.nvidia.com/page/geforce_8800.htmlThe onboard bandwidth of the flagship video card from nVidia is 86.4GB/s.In order for video data (any GPU accelerated video) to be rendered, the raw data has to first be transferred from system RAM to video RAM through the PCIE bus to the video card RAM, then the GPU can render the data. Rendering is a VERY GPU <-> GPUmemory intensive task, this is the very reason there is such a high bandwidth bus between the GPU and it's dedicated ram. In a shared ram situation, the comparatively very limited RAM <-> GPU bandwidth is going to be saturated when doing intensive video tasks, even when doing less intensive tasks, the bandwidth available between the CPU and system ram will be lessened. The extent of this depends entirely on the amount of bandwidth the GPU is using it's allocated system memory for rendering tasks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puntoMX Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 Nice info, but that I already knew.Now explain me why an onboard VGA chip differs from a PCI-E add-on card.Also the add-on card will have more buffers, any thing on that?I’m not asking you nicely, I just got a bit tempered back there. If you think I’m wrong then proof it this time to me. I know that you know a lot of things but I think you are wrong on this one . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqie Fox Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 I just said it several times over. Re-read my posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puntoMX Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 That won´t do it, you need to give me some proof now .One thing more: You know you can throw RAM into the PCI-E bus (not directly, but with a circuit)? And what will be the difference then? Why not use the RAM the in the DIMM slots? You know why dedicated video cards have it? They have there own RAM because the system RAM isn’t fast enough... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqie Fox Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 Now I know you are trolling me. Please go check the rules, trolling is against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripken204 Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 well how about both of you guys stop fighting then and wer wont have any problems. jaqie-if u dont want onboard then dont get it. punto will fight forever, ill promise you that so no point in continuing this on until some major consequences are given.and my opinion is that of coarse onboard will lower your bandwith, but hardly enough to be noticeable unless you are doing intensive video applications which means that you would want a video card anyways.. so just pick whatever you think is right, if you think that you are correct then just go with it as im sure that arguing will not change ur mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcarle Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 Now c'mon ripken, there ain't anyone is this thread who's stubborn enough to argue, now is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripken204 Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 lol. but at least i can admit when ive gone to far, and i'll even apologize if i think that ive been offensive to someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqie Fox Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 well how about both of you guys stop fighting then and wer wont have any problems.I wasn't attempting to fight, I was attempting to help someone learn how something really worked...jaqie-if u dont want onboard then dont get it. punto will fight forever, ill promise you that so no point in continuing this on until some major consequences are given.It wasn't about what I like or don't like, it was about how stuff works and trying to help someone learn. I actually do use onboard video in light load systems.and my opinion is that of coarse onboard will lower your bandwith, but hardly enough to be noticeable unless you are doing intensive video applications which means that you would want a video card anyways.. so just pick whatever you think is right, if you think that you are correct then just go with it as im sure that arguing will not change ur mind.My point was that it will lower performance and may have not been the best thing to reccomend, also that Memtest86 cannot show the bandwidth loss of a shared memory video card configuration.I was done with the whole bit as soon as I saw for certain that the other poster was not simply mistaken but was attempting to troll. Once I realized that, I was done with the whole exchange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puntoMX Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 It is never my attention to troll some one.jaqie,If I made you feel like that then I’m sorry. But when there is a point then please respond to it. I know you did with all the Wikipedia.org links but that wasn’t what I was asking for, although a lot of people would find it informative. I send you a PM, no to bug you but to talk with you without posting here... o well; I didn’t know that you were getting angry...ripken204,No one is fighting here, well at least not me. I know I’m a hardhead but certain not new with computer hardware...jcarle,Look who’s talking , some day I think it’s also better to argue true MSN. I know Zxian is one of your best computer buds and I already have him in my list...NOW ALL HUG AND KISS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 PuntoMX is pretty much what I'd call an expert. He should be a SMod of this subforum. He doesn't need help learning anything, really... it's just that English isn't his first language and he knows all this stuff in his head so he usually fails to go into a lot of detail when defending his knowledge against others effectively. I sometimes proofread things for him. PuntoMX helped me make very wise financial choices that ended me up with very reliable, stable and compatible parts for the system I'm running right now.Now... how's that for covering your 6, eh Punto? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqie Fox Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 It is never my attention to troll some one.jaqie,If I made you feel like that then I’m sorryAccepted. If you feel I wronged you in some way, I apologize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maleko Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 Anyway!Back to hardware suggestions! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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