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Windows 10 Sun Valley thoughts and opinions


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On 3/11/2021 at 3:53 PM, ceo54 said:

I'm thinking if all the garbage is still there, the S mode won't do any good. The lite version is not lite by any means unless it occupies less and less HDD  space, that's how it boots fast and runs fast. Better to employ NTLite than to depend on Microsoft for anything these days.

Can run on my old XP era laptop from 2006 without lag. 

I want to like 10 but I just can't. The horrendous updates, general design choices and just things that don't make sense push me away. My PC can't even stay asleep on 10.

Edited by Tripredacus
removed mention of warez developer
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On 3/11/2021 at 4:37 PM, Tonny52 said:

I want to like 10 but I just can't. The horrendous updates, general design choices and just things that don't make sense push me away. My PC can't even stay asleep on 10.

I assure you the feeling is mutual and like you I'm anticipating the changes in 21H2 so that I can finally upgrade. Hopefully, fingers crossed.

Edited by Tripredacus
removed mention of warez developer
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And yes, I want to like 10 because a lot of people use it, but I just can't with where it is. I am just hoping that 21H2 brings me back. 21H1 is an enablement package; no big features being added. 

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I want to get onto Windows 10 because I want to take advantage of the improvements in the technology and innovation, things that Windows 7 and 8.1 no longer receive but as we agreed before, there's too much wrong with Windows 10 at this moment. Maybe 21H2 can chnage things a bit but I don't have high hopes, as noted earlier, policies are not going to change. Telemetry, forced updates etc will always be there. That's why if I ever use Windows 10, it will most certainly be the customized Lite edition with as much as telemetry and updates removed.

I have long held this belief that compression is not a good idea, only consumes time and unnecessary system resources but if it can cut down on the space usage considerably, maybe it's worth using. Remember what I said about OS performing faster ? the less disk space it takes, the faster it will perform. What's your take on this ?  And thanks for the conversation. Your words give me hope, no matter how 21H2 turns out to be, I'll give Enterprise edition a try nonetheless.

 

21H2 Insider builds are out

upload-2021-3-12-20-12-20.png

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On 3/12/2021 at 7:29 PM, ceo54 said:

I have long held this belief that compression is not a good idea, 

Compression is actually used a lot, and if your processor is powerful enough and the software using the compression is optimized enough, you won't really notice a difference. Modern smartphones nowadays are encrypted out of the box, which would have a larger effect on performance than compression. The more its compressed, the longer it will take to access those files.

On 3/12/2021 at 7:29 PM, ceo54 said:

the less disk space it takes, the faster it will perform. What's your take on this ?  

Not really. The disk space doesn't really have any connectable dots to speed of the system. It more is what services have to load, drivers that have to wait for their device to respond, waiting for network link and other timeouts such as clearing pagefile for security purposes, and also just waiting for the IO of the drive, as well as if it is a solid-state or a mechanical drive. What you can do to make the system perform faster is to remove components that don't matter (I don't use ntlite, I use WinReducerEx, gives me more options) and/or disabling / removing unused drivers and services. The biggest slowdown 10 has though is that most of the UI elements are UWP now (Start, context menus, volume, network and clock) so you would have to switch them over to the classic versions, but as time goes on this will be less "able".

The thing that everyone should know that I do realize is that UWP is definitely here to stay, as well as telemetry and less control of the user, and there really isn't much we can do about it. What is nice is that Linux as the days go by is becoming a more viable option, but even then still has a long way to go, even if it does start making a dent in the desktop consumer marketshare. Linux is mainly known for its server enterprise marketshare because of how versatile it is, as well as IoT devices.

The thing I really hate to admit and what people here may get upset about is that as much as I love older windows such as 2K, XP, Vista, 7, 8.1, they are over time slowly fading away. I'm not sure if 2000 would be usable in 2030 or 2040. Hardware manufacturers are learning how to drop operating systems and with the introduction of DCH 10 drivers, it makes it even harder to port drivers. At that point you would have to completely write your own drivers. You can't really run MS-DOS 2.0 comfortably on an 11th gen Intel desktop, can you.

I have no hate towards older operating systems, I love them more than ever. But what I do know myself is that it will physically become impossible one day. We are already seeing this with modern desktops and laptops which can't run anything older than 10. Then, you could just say to use older hardware. That still has time, but time that is running out fast.

Hardware breaks. Over time components stop working. Eventually, the first components to fail will most likely be capacitors and transistors, which with them failing could destroy other components, especially if the failure was in the power supply. You can repair them and keep it going, but eventually the processors and graphics cards may start failing.

Older hardware will become more rare as the years go by as more of them break. You don't see as many 1920s cars around on the road anymore because they are being held in garages to keep in good condition because they are vulnerable due to lack of easy-to-find replacement parts. As I said, I am not against older hardware, but if I can predict the amount of time until people will legitimately be forced to use Linux or Windows 10, I would put it at 10-20 years. Windows 10 is here to stay, and we will eventually in a decade or two have to leave what we love.

On 3/12/2021 at 7:50 PM, ceo54 said:

21H2 Insider builds are out

That should be Server 2022 Insider. This build would of been released last year. The latest insider is 21332.

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On 3/12/2021 at 7:51 PM, Tonny52 said:

Compression is actually used a lot, and if your processor is powerful enough and the software using the compression is optimized enough, you won't really notice a difference. Modern smartphones nowadays are encrypted out of the box, which would have a larger effect on performance than compression. The more its compressed, the longer it will take to access those files.

Dism++ has Windows 10 like CompactOS feature which can be applied to 8.1 or Windows 7. The author says it doesn't effect the performance while reducing the disk footprint, he's certainly more knowledgeable than me. But you're absolutely spot on, the more compressed a file is, the more time it will take to access it unless there's some new tech unheard of.

On 3/12/2021 at 7:55 PM, Tonny52 said:

That should be Server 2022 Insider. This build would of been released last year. The latest insider is 21332.

It says under Edition: Windows 10 Enterprise and build 21H2 20303.1

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  • 2 weeks later...

An interesting thing that I learned is that Microsoft didn't remove the QA team, they moved it. They now rely on AI to find and report the bugs. In all the cases they test, they never upgrade the testing containers. This is why 1809 never had that file deletion bug fixed in the betas; because the bots never found it. Even when it existed in the feedback hub, they never look there. The insider program is a joke. You aren't helping shape Windows, you are just making it harder on yourself on an already hard operating system.

AI can work if you shape it enough, but it will never be able to replace human intelligence. 

Anyway, 21H2 development hasn't changed much. In my opinion now I am hopeful, but also a little upset because they aren't focusing on what Windows was good at. Windows 7 and such worked well because it was simple. All Sun Valley may be doing now is just overcomplicating it more. We had hope for when 10 came out that it would fix the "disaster" that 8.1 was. I use quotes on that because 8.0 really ruined the reputation. 8.1 is awesome. 

What recently came to realization is how much MSFT is changing in only half a year of development. That itself is a little worrying.

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On 3/22/2021 at 3:35 AM, Tonny52 said:

An interesting thing that I learned is that Microsoft didn't remove the QA team, they moved it. They now rely on AI to find and report the bugs. In all the cases they test, they never upgrade the testing containers. This is why 1809 never had that file deletion bug fixed in the betas; because the bots never found it. Even when it existed in the feedback hub, they never look there. The insider program is a joke. You aren't helping shape Windows, you are just making it harder on yourself on an already hard operating system.

AI can work if you shape it enough, but it will never be able to replace human intelligence. 

Anyway, 21H2 development hasn't changed much. In my opinion now I am hopeful, but also a little upset because they aren't focusing on what Windows was good at. Windows 7 and such worked well because it was simple. All Sun Valley may be doing now is just overcomplicating it more. We had hope for when 10 came out that it would fix the "disaster" that 8.1 was. I use quotes on that because 8.0 really ruined the reputation. 8.1 is awesome. 

What recently came to realization is how much MSFT is changing in only half a year of development. That itself is a little worrying.

 

I have said this before and gonna say this again, when things are broken at the root they can't be corrected up top. The very idea Windows 10 is built upon is flawed and no amount of improvements are going to fix it. The worst part in Microsoft forcing the vendors to remove the support for Windows 7 and 8.1 I already can't find the 8.1 drivers for my 7th gen notebook. Microsoft is also forcing the game makers to abandon Windows 7 and 8.1 Lot's of newer games only available on Windows 10. Current system will live for who knows what but eventually I'll have to move too. But having said that let's hope they can at least get those basics right with telemetry, forced updates etc but that's too much to ask as well. Never gonna happen.

Best bet, heavily customized Windows 10 build over whatever the improvements Microsoft can introduce. Completely remove the updates, component store, catroot, Microsoft account, XBox related binaries and services, UWP apps, store, BITS etc then tweak it the way we use to tweak 7 and 8.1 and as a last step just compromise with what you have.

Bottom line is Windows 10 is never going to be Windows 7. Bitter fact and may humanity never forgives Microsoft for doing this and Google for giving all the ideas and paving the way for it.

Microsoft had to kill Goggle before it becomes a serious competition on computer OS's is why Windows 10 is like what's it like. 

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On 3/11/2021 at 4:37 PM, Tonny52 said:

I want to like 10 but I just can't. The horrendous updates, general design choices and just things that don't make sense push me away. My PC can't even stay asleep on 10.

Same here. I seldom even boot up into it except to install their usual buggy updates.

Some really annoying changes are probably small potatoes to a lot of people, but they add up.

For instance, when switching accounts without logging off if the current account has music playing it stops when you log into the other account. To me that is just stupid, it never did that in prior OSs but if Microsoft thinks that it should then why not provide the user with an option?

Another one is the ability to place icons in the order you want in the folder, they are alphabetical, take it or leave it. In Win7 you could apply a hack to overcome the limitation but no longer. So I find myself numbering the icons so they stay where I want them. 

When booting into Win10 it goes to the account you shut down in. The option to boot into a preferred account is gone. Very. Stupid.

Not to mention the lack of native classic theme.

Now I don't know if these changes were made prior to Win10 and after Win7 since I've never used Win8 but for some reason all of these software companies regress when it comes to options. Mozilla and Google, same thing. For now I'm happily on Win7 most of the time.      

 

 

Edited by DanR20
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On 3/11/2021 at 4:46 PM, Sergiaws said:

I'm more fan of the Classic Windows XP start menu.

Classic Shell, now Open Shell is the first program that gets installed, just hope that it keeps working with 21H2. Not the least bit interested in Microsoft's modern start menus.

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On 3/21/2021 at 11:05 PM, Tonny52 said:

What recently came to realization is how much MSFT is changing in only half a year of development. That itself is a little worrying.

 

it became worrying as soon they revealed dual behaviour (starting with windows 8)

after 12 years nothing has changed = MS is garbage company with garbage products

Edited by vinifera
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  • 1 month later...

So the rounded corners design has been leaked and so far, It looks fine other than the enormous title bar text, and why is the button not rounded either?

Honestly, I kind of miss Metro from seeing this design. It's not really as exciting as I thought, and it honestly seemed like Metro was just so much more colorful, better for tablets and such.

So far sun valley is, okay I guess? 

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