[RESOVLED] USB devices not installing properly

[Tripredacus]

We've been having this problem off and on. Its when you unplug a mouse from the USB port it is in, and plug it into a different USB port, it gets flagged in device manager and you have to manually install the drivers for it. Of course I just let Windows find the drivers and its fine. This happens mainly on boards with Intel chipsets or Intel board with other (ie SIS) chipsets. It doesn't appear to be an issue with an image (which we use a lot of). Take the following two scenarios:

10 computers, all hand-loaded with XP using a CD. After they are done, swap the mice around. Say 3 work fine and 7 do not. All systems set up with the same drivers, and all latest drivers and Windows Updates (minus WGA and MSRT).

Take those same 10 computers, and drop an image on them, and they can all work, or perhaps 4 work and 6 do not, and those six that do not work may or may not be part of the 3 that did work previously.

Typically this only causes a problem if you switch which ports the keyboard or mouse are plugged into. Its becoming more of a problem on USB only boards, like the Intel DQ35JO and any of the AOpen MODT boards. In a recent case with the MODT boards, when they are rebooted after imaging, their keyboard or mouse will not work in ANY port, thus giving us a system that is in Windows where no input works. Our work-around for these extreme cases are to RDP into them and install the drivers. This recent case is fortunate that Remote Desktop is enabled on the image, other ones in the future may not be!

Does anyone have any ideas about this behaviour? Here are the details:

XP Pro/Home SP2 (no SP3 except in rare circumstances)

All either Microsoft or Logitech USB Optical Mice.

Keyboards range from Microsoft Multimedia to Logitech or KeyTronic basic 101

All USB drivers are in Windows, no discs are needed to install them, but you have to manually update the driver in Device Manager.

Edited September 25, 2008 by Tripredacus

[GrofLuigi]

Excellent resource on USB drives (and much more). Read your heart out! B)

GL

[Tripredacus]

This is only happening with keyboards and mice.

[GrofLuigi]

This is only happening with keyboards and mice.

That's what the (and much more) part was about. For example, on the Troubleshooting for USB drives page, there are several topics that might be of interest to you:

- Filter Drivers (although not mentioned on the page, in your case, kbdhid and mouhid; possibly other services with HID in their name)

- USB devices detected as 'unknown device'

- XP asks for drivers

- You must be a member of the administrators group

- USB drive not working stable

- USB serial number

My bet is on power management and serial number.

GL

[jaclaz]

If I may go off a little off topic :

Why the heck do you remove and insert mice (in different USB ports) instead of working?

Seriously, I mean I have inserted the mouse on my desktops some two or three years ago and never felt the urge to disconnect and reconnect them, and however, not on a different port.

On Laptops, I never had this problem, but anyway I always use the same port.

jaclaz

[TheReasonIFail]

Trip, do all the PC's have the same USB settings in the BIOS?

[Tripredacus]

If I may go off a little off topic :

Why the heck do you remove and insert mice (in different USB ports) instead of working?

Seriously, I mean I have inserted the mouse on my desktops some two or three years ago and never felt the urge to disconnect and reconnect them, and however, not on a different port.

On Laptops, I never had this problem, but anyway I always use the same port.

jaclaz

I work for an OEM, like Dell or HP. All of the computers we build get shipped to other companies. After I am done with them, they go into a QC Phase where all the USB Ports are tested. Typically I am not the one to run into this particular problem, except this time the USB isn't working after I put the image on them.

Trip, do all the PC's have the same USB settings in the BIOS?

Yes, they all have USB enabled by the 'Optimal Defaults' which are loaded before the date and time are set. There are other annoyances with these motherboards, however, such as their inability to boot off a USB CD-Drive. I am convinced that this is a problem with the XP Image, which was created by our customer. Its just annoying because of the ten or so that we have done, there are two left that refuse to work. They also have Remote Desktop enabled on them, but I can't connect to these last two. There were originally four that had this issue, but I resolved two of them already by using RDP on them to install the drivers.

[TheReasonIFail]

Same BIOS version?

I remember having an issue with certain motherboards similar to this and I resolved this issue by plugging in the usb mouse and keyboard on the same two usb ports which were at the very top the first time Windows started.

Are you initially plugging all the devices into the same usb ports?

Also, are these OEM PC's or custom builds?

Edited September 23, 2008 by TheReasonIFail

[Tripredacus]

Same BIOS version?

I remember having an issue with certain motherboards similar to this and I resolved this issue by plugging in the usb mouse and keyboard on the same two usb ports which were at the very top the first time Windows started.

Are you initially plugging all the devices into the same usb ports?

Also, are these OEM PC's or custom builds?

OK I just tried to boot to the Recovery Console using a CD Drive. Mind you, this is a notebook CD drive and using USB Floppy drive, but Windows Setup does not see the USB Floppy.... I checked the BIOS and you cannot enable or disable USB. I guess it makes sense because there are no PS2 ports on the thing, so if you were to disable the USB ports you'd have some problems! The only USB option is in Power Management, which is Allow Resume from USB Keyboard.

Yes these are all the same BIOS version. Although we have encountered this issue before with other motherboards, this particular model is causing me the problem right now. It is the AOpen DE965-HG.

http://vip.aopen.com/products_DE_DE965HG.htm

As far as keyboard/mouse goes, we always plug in the keyboard into the bottom port, and mouse into the top port on the back. We only use the front USB Ports for licensing and additional software via UFD. The actual use upon delivery is inputless. Their software searches for a server on the network, and once it finds it, it downloads and runs the applications that the servers sends to it. We've worked with these types of machines before, but this is a newer model. We did not have these problems with the older Digital Engine products.

[GrofLuigi]

Did you try GlobalDisableSerNumGen?

I don't know if it's because of windows updates or my tweaks (this or others), but computers I'm working on stop doing that* after a while.

Seriously, I think I read somewhere (can't remember where, maybe somewhere on the page I pointed) that the behavior has changed with XP SP3 (and/or few updates before).

* that = do "new hardware found"/"installing device" if I plug the same USB device into another port. And no, the device hasn't been plugged in the second port ever before.

GL

[Tripredacus]

Did you try GlobalDisableSerNumGen?

I don't know if it's because of windows updates or my tweaks (this or others), but computers I'm working on stop doing that* after a while.

Seriously, I think I read somewhere (can't remember where, maybe somewhere on the page I pointed) that the behavior has changed with XP SP3 (and/or few updates before).

* that = do "new hardware found"/"installing device" if I plug the same USB device into another port. And no, the device hasn't been plugged in the second port ever before.

GL

I will note that if I have to rebuild the image. Right now the two remaining machines are inaccessible. Right now I am looking for causes to the issue so I can hopefully correct them when I make new XP images.

[Tripredacus]

OK I wasn't 100% accurate when I said they are inaccesable. We can access the HDD in offline mode using NTFSDOS.

I have been given a lead regarding this issue, a file called INFCACHE.1. It is also covered here:

http://www.msfn.org/board/Can-I-safely-del...he1-t39966.html

I did a search and found this file in two locations:

c:\pnpdrivers\net

c:\windows\inf

The first folder is created by our autounattend, it is a legacy feature that wasn't removed from our media when SP2 came out.

I tried deleting the file in both places (probably shouldn't have) and it did not resolve the issue.

I will continue digging.

[TheReasonIFail]

What does the HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Current Version\Device Path entry look like?

Edited September 24, 2008 by TheReasonIFail

[Tripredacus]

OK I edited the offline registry via a WinPE boot CD.

HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DevicePath = %SystemRoot\inf

No FactoryPreInstallInProgress or AuditInProgress listed in HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Factory

They were listed in HKLM\System\Setup and were set to 01 (Binary). I set them to 00 (Binary).

I also changed the GlobalDisableSerNumGen to 0 in each of the CCS listed.

On the reboot I chose last known good, but it didn't seem to allow the keyboard to work. I tried both the mouse and keyboard in new ports, or boot up without them connected and plug in after Windows loads but no good. ***

Since those two "InProgress" keys were present in System\Setup, is this to say that Sysprep did not run correctly? Shouldn't they be at 0 if Sysprep was run? There is no Sysprep folder on the C drive either...

*** I didn't give it enough time lol. It works now... It took like 5 minutes to install the drivers. Since I can't see what Windows is doing (explorer isn't the default shell) I couldn't see that it was actually doing something. After about 5 minutes the "Your hardware has finished installing, would you like to reboot the computer" message came up and the keyboard (and Serial Mouse we connected) were working. I said no, replugged the USB Mouse and that installed properly as well. As a final test I am rebooting the thing to make sure it will still work.

Since editing the registry worked, this confirms it to be the customer's image, which I am going to recommend they rebuild. It adds way too much time on a build to take the thing apart and boot from CDs and whatnot.

The final question about the InProgress keys still stands, however.

Edited September 25, 2008 by Tripredacus