ShadeTreeLee

You really may not want to rid yourself of the 'Shut Down Windows' box only available from the Start Menu's Shut Down choice. It's only when that box shows itself that the ShellIconCache file builds/re-builds itself. Why the two functions are made that way escapes me but that's how it is. Perhaps a better approach to running a batch file at shut down would be to alter msdos.sys line BootGUI=1 to a zero and then add Win line to rear end of Autoexec.bat followed by the batch text you wanted to run in the first place. I have never used this approach but always wondered about it. A lot would depend on just what you wanted to do in batch at shut down too, you might get whacked by wanting to run a 32 bit long filename process but be stuck in 16 bit DOS as Windows has just shut down. More info might help.

The use of the word 'shell' needs to defined here I believe, and then you may both be right? Erpdude8 is technically right to start with, perhaps win 3.1 could run without a shell but no other Windows can. What you call a shell does not come solely from the shell32.dll file, so swapping shell files, which I assume you mean to be swapping shells, is in fact only swapping shell files. I am considering explorer.exe to be a part of swapping shell files here just for the sake of the argument. When you swap shell files, you also swap some shell behaviors (imagine that!), but the actual shell remains a core of the version of Windows you are running and that can't be swapped as far as I know. Unless you want to consider a reboot to a different OS the same thing as a swap, which I don't. It doesn't help when MS themselves freely drop the name shell at such a rate, no one can know what they really mean by the term exactly. Since PageFault mentions 3 files of which 2 are connected directly to the Windows DeskTop Update (also confused with the 'shell') which is exclusive to Win95 and NT4 but at the same time included by default in all higher versions of Windows, I'm wondering if maybe PageFault is looking to have 95's Windows DeskTop Update installed right out of the box so to speak. This can be done several different ways, the easiest is to just reinstall IE which causes the Windows DeskTop Update to be installed automatically provided the IE4SHL95.CAB file is in the IE installation folder. If it's not, then the IE installation wizard will go online and look for it. If it's not found then you don't get the update installed. That file is still 'up there' on MS servers and available if only the IE installation wizard knew where to look for it these days, which is doubtful for an out of the box installtion of Win95 with an add-on ie4.01 SP2 or somesuch. Even IE 5 would need an updated IEBATCH.TXT showing the proper download locations in order for the wizard to find the file needed. To wit: Downloadsitelist=http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com/iesites/ie55sp2/ie5sites.dat DownloadLocation=http://www.download.windowsupdate.com/msdownload/update/v3/static/ie55sp2/x86/en Or you can invoke it directly with a switch such as this: ie5setup.exe /Q:A /C:"ie5wzd /E:IE4Shell_Win" Internet Explorer Batch Mode Setup Switches But that's redundant since if you just reinstall IE, the 'shell' is installed automatically so you can assume the above to be the default switch for ie5setup.exe at all times anyway. Odd how it doesn't work for the very first time IE is installed on Win95/NT4 though... Or if you want to take a chance, you might extract the contents of IE4SHL95.CAB and install the inf contained within it like so: rundll32.exe advpack.dll,LaunchINFSection ie4shell.inf,DefaultInstall and that would more in line with a hands off, MSBATCH.INF type of Windows installation if that is what PageFault was looking for to start with. I doubt we will ever know, he seems to have abandonded the message at the first request for more info. IE 5 and 6 use the same cab files for the two versions of shells, 95 and NT4. IE 4 seems to use a different pair of shell cab files for every single subversion ever produced. Since the 'shell' is a part of all Windows by default since 95 and NT4, these cab files are only for use in 95 or NT4. IE4SHL95.CAB IE4SHLNT.CAB There is a KB article which states that the only way to install the Windows Desktop Update with Win95 is to revert back to IE4 and choose to install it there and then go back to IE 5 - it's pure hooey, so don't believe it. Anybody interested in a one size fits all IE installation CD from IE 4.01 thru IE 6.00 SP1? If there is sufficient interest I can cook one up fairly quick, I was going to sell them on ebay for $3 or so, but never thought there was enough of a market to make it worthwhile.

Problem with WinUP's Administrator's only page is a different issue than actual Administrator permision levels as message suggests that you have issues with. They are real issues even with 98. You ARE on a Network because you can log off of it, see the 2nd item above the START button. Also look in Control Panel for Network applet and notice that you must have at least a Windows Login entry, and often even more 'network' stuff installed to have desired services. Once you have a network, you also have an administrator and poledit.exe or some other app to modify administrator/user privileges. And of course, NT administrator permissons were done much better than on the 9x platform. The above is 'standard' diatribe - I do not claim to understand it. THAT's how confusing the 98 permissions issue is for me. But it's still not your fault that MS decides to then use a default error web page that claims you need 'special' permissions from somebody else who shall forever remain unknown. That blame belongs solely to MS, sorry you ever had to see it. WinUP site for 98 is resolutely broken and has been since 02/22/07 at 5 PM or some such (same date/time as broken redirect.js file. {I'm a WinUp tech and I'd like to buy a clue now, can I?}). Sometimes you get in, sometimes you don't. Since it IS broken, you must not believe anything you see while you attempt to use it like the administrator's only page. It's just a generic error page, falsely representing much more intelligence/logic than is actually used to generate the page itself. There is no real logic or 'test' going on behind that page showing up, although there COULD be according to this: Administrators only That page is also well known to show up until you have installed the WinUP ActiveX Controls and are running at least IE 5.01 as well. As I've said, most of the time when you see that page, it's just a generic error indicator.

Before you give up and quit the issue, please remember that there are a couple of places to change your power settings first. The Control Panel settings, and the BIOS settings, after which one should remove all and ANY power control devices from the Device Mangler and reboot to allow Windows to detect the new settings and reinstall these devices with the appropriate drivers which then MAY give you the desired shutdown option choice. Stranger things have actually been known to happen once officially approved methods for dealing with Device Mangler issues are employed.

I don't believe you will be able to edit the boot menu contents but with the BootMenuDefault option outlined in the KB article below, you might boot the machine in a way that gets you where you wanted to go? More info on exactly what you want to do, when, and why, of course will allow us to help more. Contents of the Windows Msdos.sys File Only way I can see to run custom config.sys and autoexec.bat files as you seem to want is to control current system methods and replace those files just prior to a forced reboot. Quite a bit of info at http://users.iafrica.com/c/cq/cquirke/startup.htm Safe Mode is such a specialized booting mode I wouldn't attempt to alter it, I'd try for another that I could 'take over' for my own purposes. I'm thinking specifically of 'reboot to MSDOS mode'.

I have a Boot Up System Speed selection in my BIOS which makes all the difference in the world when booting CDs. Set to High, sometimes it don't work and if Low then it almost always attempts to boot bootable CDs. According to the BIOS manual, this setting slows the CPU while in non-protected DOS mode for better compatiblity with DOS games. OEM 98 CDs were bootable, retail never were. It is not Gold VS. SE that marks a 98CD as bootable, it's OEM VS. Retail. Upgrade or full version didn't matter either, just OEM VS. Retail. My full Retail 98SE is not bootable nor does it have the Powertoys folder.

On my real computer I found out the hard way that if I don't first give the computer a DMA buffer to work with disaster is sure to follow soon when then adjusting DMA checkboxes in the Device Mangler proper. Seems to be an academic point really but somehow later machines than mine DON'T need the buffer set to exist first - but mine DOES or Windows dies a horrible death. Mine also needs the following debug script method each time it boots in order to have and enjoy DMA speeds and later machines may need it but ONCE if EVER. I have no explaination for these discrepancies but they are real. DMA Check Box Does Not Remain Checked http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=159560 Further info - substitue 2x (DMA) modes as follows UDMA mode 0 is 40 UDMA mode 1 is 41, etc. Setting up a DMA buffer is as simple as adding this line to the [386Enh] section of the System.ini file. DMABufferSize=64 That would set up the maximum size (64k) DMA buffer using a tiny snippet of ram for that. My installed 128 Megs of ram shows as 127.0MB when pressing Win and Pause Key together. The buffer can also be set by using the Device Mangler|system devices|direct memory access controller settings applet which actually does the very same thing to the System.ini file. Although mine is not the oldest motherboard to run 98se, it's old enough. It is a 1430TX el cheapo chaintech 5ttm1 with a BIOS date of 4/13/98. The 1430TX in particular had problems allocating large memory properly according to some web sites, perhaps that explains my unique DMA situation? Unless one a third drive on either the primary or secondary channels exists the entry under IDEDMADRIVE2 is superfluous as there is only drive 0 (1st) and drive 1 (2nd) on either/both the primary and/or secondary IDE channels - at least that's the way it was the the last time I looked. Or did I miss another memo or something? Someone somewhere is using three drives on each IDE channel? At any rate, here is my attempt at doing the same thing via an inf file which has the advantanage of being able to directly write the required string to the system.ini file with no more hassle than adding three lines to the inf file, the updateinis line and the Getmeabuf section of two lines total. This file calls itself after copying itself to the Windows\INF folder. There is no real advantage to doing it this way except for taking use of the reboot features of the 2nd time around advpack call denoted by the trailing 'A' which stands for Always reboot. The Reboot=1 line under the defaultinstall section only works when the inf file is 'install'ed by using iexpress.exe or NT5's right click 'Active Install' method which also uses advpack.dll file. The standard 9x right click 'Install' method uses setupx.dll file and as such has no extra reboot mode modifiers like advpack does. In other words - reboot=1 don't work if right clicked and 'Install'ed. But you will reboot twice if you have NT5's Active Install right click choice, once right now and once again at the next reboot. Reboot=1 causes the reboot right now and the hdc registry info is written at the next boot just before you are asked to reboot again before even getting to your desktop. The reason for why I set it up like this is a bit complex but it turns around a problem using the standard right click setupx.dll method of inf file installations. Setupx.dll method will always run the RunOnce key just before it closes thus clearing the key and the advpack.dll method does NOT. Reboot modifier strings like SmartReboot = A and Reboot=1 only work with advpack method. Since standalone inf files are the most likely to be right clicked and 'Install'ed with that method and there is no way to make the file then reboot, I had to invoke advpack in it's Always reboot mode so when setupx.dll clears the RunOnce key, Advpack also runs and we get the reboot box in spite of setupx.dll's shortcomings. A fair question might be then 'why include the reboot=1 line?' - to diseminate gathered info on what works, when and why. Here is a harmless example to play around with, learn about reboot=1 and setupx method. The standard 9x right click install option for inf files comes from this key: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\CLASSES\inffile\shell\install] @="&Install" [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\CLASSES\inffile\shell\install\command] @="C:\\WINDOWS\\rundll.exe setupx.dll,InstallHinfSection DefaultInstall 132 %1" The 'NT5 Active Install' right click install option comes from this key: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\CLASSES\inffile\shell\APInst] @="Active I&nstall" [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\CLASSES\inffile\shell\APInst\command] @="rundll32.exe advpack.dll,LaunchINFSection %1, DefaultInstall" I seem to have lost the source for this last registry entry and I can't find out where I got it from. Which is another reason to post it before it's lost for good completely. For more info on inf files see WillyPad's help file and get WillyPad here: http://snoopy81.ifrance.com/snoopy81/download.htm My comment on your method used is *brilliant* considering it's all done with batch files, but my inf file is shorter and marginally does more. But that's only true because the inf file method was made for this kind of work specifically, so it's very easy to be ahead of the game when using inf files for installations, registry work and piddling around with ini file sections. Feel free to use as much or as little of my code as you care to in this or any future project - I wouldn't have posted it if I didn't want people to use it. Erpdude8 The IDEDMADRIVE registry values added by Soporific's batch file and my inf file ARE the DMA checkboxes for both hard drives and CDROM/DVD drives as near as I can tell. I do know that there are similar entries and values from previous setups where I had other hard drives hooked up but have since been removed and yet their values remain in the registry so I don't think it hurts anything to have excess info in the registry other than the obvious bloat issue. Dmainf.zip

ZwQueryInformationProcess is a function that would be written into the proper version of ntdll.dll file for use with your un-named little program. And since that function is NOT in the win98se version ntdll.dll, I would suggest that your un-named little program was not meant to be run on the 9x platform at all, and there is no way to fix that situation that I know of especially with no more info to go on. Were we to know the name of the 'little program' perhaps someone with experiance in that direction could then suggest an alternative program/method that does work for 98 boxes. Use http://www.dependencywalker.com/ program to investigate the functions available in your dll and exe files.

Type regedit into the Run Box and navigate to that key, then in the right panel right click the offending data and choose modify. Change the data to 4.10.2222 and OK your way out. Or spend some time at http://www.winguides.com/registry/ to learn how to make the changed data into a .reg file to then right click the .reg file and merge it. Sorry about the delay - I'm not an everyday user.

You are 98se with the wrong data in the registry under this key: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion] "VersionNumber"="4.10.2222" The question remains 'how did your registry get the wrong data in it'? I have no answer for that one, but it's good question just the same.

Thanks for the kind words, I understand your hesitation to do a thing with WinUP/QFECheck alignment. It's a hassle all the way but at least now you know exactly where to look. If it were me doing it, I'm thinking I would make one reg file or inf file that writes that key after everything else gets done, a sort of a patch to the patch approach. And even that is problematic depending on what actually ran. -------------------- SoftPedia site is not going to work for me. I had the same confusion as dondwsmith in that I did get 1.92 file with no problems but the text on the 1.8 link is misleading enough that I didn't know it was THE link I was looking for. BOTH files are on the same page, guys! http://www.softpedia.com/progDownload/Auto...load-64269.html SP Mirror (US) - Update (v1.92 <<<<< click here and SP Mirror (RO) - Update (v1.92 Softpedia Secure Download (US) (v1.8 <<<<< here Softpedia Secure Download (RO) (v1.8 But even with that snafu ironed out, I go to resume my 2 megs downloaded from last night of the 1.8 file this morning and because SoftPedia is offline or some other reason (needs cookies?), Download Express pukes, destroys what I did get and can't even start over. This is not going to work for me at 14.4 dial up fellas, sorry - I've got a life too. As is, I'm looking at several days to get the 220 meg downloaded with no phone for all that time. And the last time this happened, my sister called the cops out on us for fear that we were all dead out here, thankfully they couldn't be bothered enough to drive out and check on us. Or maybe that's a bad thing?

Eck nailed it. "No Microsoft Windows Updates change the version number of Windows with the exception of the long discontinued Microsoft Security Updates Cd. " So your only excuse is a corrupted registry since this version info is just a simple value in the registry here? REGEDIT4 [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion] "VersionNumber"="4.10.2222" "SubVersionNumber"="B" And this is the same text displayed by pressing Winkey and Pause. It is NOT used for much version testing and it doesn't alter the DOS ver report at all. Your HPJOBBER may be one of the very rare ones that actually does look at (/alter?) this key's value. 98 Gold gets an 'A' for a SubversionNumber after running the Security CD, just to add confusion to the issue I believe, unless anybody else really does know why? Before the Security CD is run, there is no SubVersionNumber entry or value at all. ------------------ soporific Your trials at WinUP site are due to the erasing of the below key's value by the reinstallation of IE. I really don't know why they do it that way but the iewizard does it every time it fires up. This is the text one sees when clicking on Help/About in IE but with the title 'Update Versions:' instead of the key's name of 'MinorVersion'. REGEDIT4 [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Internet Settings] "MinorVersion"=";SP2;Q890923;Q837009;q313829;Q891781;Q832894;Q823353;Q903235;" This entry is from my 98se IE 5.50 SP2 machine, your mileage will vary of course. Most of the more recent updates used a custom update engine which directly writes the update's ID number to this key thus providing a record of it for the V4 WinUP scan. If the WinUp scan can't find the number in this key, then you get bugged to reinstall the update even when file version protection inherent in inf files has prevented your higher versioned files from being overwritten during the IE reinstall in the first place and your really don't need the f@#$n update at ALL. To WinUP's credit though, there is also a version test done on the critical update's files themselves so one should not be able to 'fake' their way out of a legitimate WinUP scan of their system by cheating in the registry by manually setting it with values similar to those shown above. But that's one way you can avoid the nag at WinUP site given the proper files are in place, even MS recommended doing just that in one or two cases very early in the V4 WinUP site's life. The other way is to use the custom update engine with the proper inf file 'strings' section as per each update and let the original engine write the key as it is supposed to. You can spot these updates with Resource Hacker in the RCData section under RunProgram - "OEUPDATE.EXE" Q837009 for example, means that OEUPDATE.EXE is the install engine and a batch file can launch it just fine, I would extend the quotes past the Inf file number Q837009 in this case and also include the full drive and path in the quotes for good measure. This 'Original' method would then also pass the QFE test (maybe?) - which is, go to the Windows folder and double click on QFECheck.exe. Read it's report to find all manner of missing/wrong versioned files. Running updates can be a headache at times as even done fully and properly, QFECheck will show some bad files when they are OK. This was a recent reg 'fix file' posted in Computing.net forum, and it works good. MS needs better logic/script to scan with at WinUP site and they need to write these updates correctly in the first place, as this stuff below attests to, original update data is just plain wrong. REGEDIT4 [-HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup\Updates\W98\UPD908519] [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup\Updates\W98\UPD908519] @="Windows 98 KB908519 Update" "C:\\WINDOWS\\SYSTEM\\t2embed.dll"="5.0.2195.7073" [-HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup\Updates\W98\UPD918547] [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup\Updates\W98\UPD918547] @="Windows 98 KB918547 Update" "C:\\WINDOWS\\SYSTEM\\KB918547\\KB918547.EXE"="4.10.0.2224" "C:\\WINDOWS\\SYSTEM\\KB918547\\Q918547.dll"="4.10.0.2224" Keep up the good work! Lee

I don't know where I picked this up at but if you will merge the following reg file it will turn on Advpack logging in Win98se. The log file itself will land in the Windows folder the next time advpack.dll is used. The file gets appended to each time, so eventually can grow quite big. REGEDIT4 [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Advanced INF Setup] "AdvpackLogFile"="AdvPack.log" The same type of thing gets done with SetupAPI.log file if one substitutes ME's setupapi.dll for win98's. I didn't notice that any registry entries had any effect, but they may well as per NT5's verbosity settings. I really need to see what the ME registry shows in the following location or thereabouts: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup] "LogLevel"=dword:2000ffff The above value was suggested by an MS document on the verbosity settings for setupAPI.log, if the key/value doesn't exist in ME then I guess I really don't need it after all with my 98se? --------------------- Question on Custom Destination flags is somewhat answered in WillPad's help file with a 34 flag example where a Path key is set and then if the installation package has run again the second attempt is aborted which answers in a round about manner another question in this very thread. Trouble is WillyPad help file is not very clear at times like this one, nor is this section complete as to all possible flag uses. WillyPad --------------------- 2,N flags for invoked advpack.dll are obscure at best. So I loaded advpack.dll using Dependency walker, then highlighted LaunchINFSectionEx, then right clicked something IIRC and a web search at msdm occured which got some of this text: NOTE that the 2 flag is still not described by MS at this detailed level!!! LaunchINFSectionEx Function Internet Development Index Launches a section of an information (INF) file. Syntax HRESULT WINAPI LaunchINFSectionEx( HWND hwnd, HINSTANCE hInst, PSTR pszParams, INT nShow ); Parameters hwnd HWND that specifies the owner window on which to display error messages. This parameter is typically NULL, which causes the Desktop to be the owner window. hInst Handle to the instance of the program. This parameter is typically NULL. pszParams Comma-delimited string that specifies the INF file, the section of the INF file to launch, the fully qualified path of the cabinet file (CAB) that contains the INF file, and the flags that specify the installation mode, in that order. If you do not specify the fully qualified path of the INF file, the INF file is extracted from the specified CAB file. If you do not specify a section, that is, if the section portion of the pszParams string is an empty string or is set to NULL, then the DefaultInstall section of the INF file is launched. The following flags are used to specify the installation mode. 4 Quiet mode, no UI 8 Don't run GrpConv 16 Force self-updating on user's system 32 Backup data before install 64 Rollback to previous state 128 Validate the backup data 256 Complete rollback to previous state 512 Force delay of OCX registration nShow Variable of type INT that specifies whether to reboot the user's machine upon completion. Can be one of the following values. A Always reboot. I Default. Reboot if needed. N No reboot. Return Value Returns one of the following values. S_OK The section launched successfully. E_FAIL The section failed to launch. Remarks You can call this function using Rundll32.exe from the command line. Note Using an entry point function with Rundll32.exe does not resemble a normal function call. The function name and the name of the .dll file where it is stored are used only as command line parameters. The function definition shown in the Syntax section of this topic is only a standard prototype for all functions that you can call using Rundll32. The specific values for hwnd and hInst are not provided by the user, but are handled behind the scenes by Rundll32. Examples The following examples demonstrate how to call the LaunchINFSectionEx function using Rundll32. This example demonstrates how to extract the myinf.inf INF file from the c:\temp\mydata.cab CAB file in Quiet|Backup mode, and reboot if needed. rundll32.exe advpack.dll,LaunchINFSectionEx myinf.inf,,c:\temp\mydata.cab,36 This example demonstrates how to roll back to the state before the myinf.inf INF file was installed. rundll32.exe advpack.dll,LaunchINFSectionEx c:\windows\inf\myinf.inf,,,256,a Function Information Stock Implementation advpack.dll Custom Implementation No Import library None Minimum availability Internet Explorer 5.01 Minimum operating systems Windows 2000 See Also About INF File Architecture, Using INF Files ---------------------- As to how combined updates work - your guess is much better than mine and even sounds plausible. But for most of them, I seem to recall there being also custom executables in the package(s) which might do just about what ever they want as far as OS testing and running of named inf files go, so I never bothered to put much brain time onto the problem.