my new barebones kit wont post or beep

[ceez]

Hello msfn-ers!

I purchased the following barebones kit from tiger:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/se...52&csid=_22

I added my br player + video card and cpu fan to complete the system

finished the build in 1 hour, all excited and then I get that dreaded black screen, no video, post or beeps letting you know the board is alive, yet everything else spins up

after troubleshooting by swapping out memory modules onto the different banks I was able to get a post and a beep about 6 different times between power off/on and then it just stopped working. I cant get the post or even a beep out of this darn thing again.

if I place the pair of rams on channel A dimm 0 and B dimm 0 I get power, fans spin up, power to hd and player but no post or beeps. If I leave one of the modules on A-0 the same happens. If I replace that module with the other I get the 3 beeps.

The funny thing is, that when I got it to post I did it with only a single dim on A-0 (and could even boot by placing on A-1, B-0 or B-1), placing the 2nd one would give me the same no post results. BUT NOW the one that was working beeps on me and the one that wasnt wont beep but get the no post results....confused.

So I am either thinking it's the board or the ram, but since I got it working with 1 stick it was probably a faulty pack in which the other one worked just for those 6 few times.

Also, when you press the power button I see the cpu fan and psu spin up, stop and then eventually kick in. Never seen such thing? Should I be concerned or are these systems built that way.

I am at a loss.

Thanks,

ceez

ps- and I've tried different vid cards, 2 pci cards and 2 pcie cards. I was only able to get it working those 6 times using one of the pci cards.

Edited December 30, 2008 by ceez

[puntoMX]

Also, when you press the power button I see the cpu fan and psu spin up, stop and then eventually kick in. Never seen such thing? Should I be concerned or are these systems built that way.

That´s normal Ceez, so don´t worry about that. Is there a way to return the whole pile and can you pick something else? They sold it as a bare bone so I would say they tested it before shipping? Was it already build or they send it to you in separated boxes?

[ceez]

puntomx, I put the **** thing together. I honestly didnt want to spend any extra money and it sounded like a good deal. I am not an overclocker or a pc gamer so what I purchased is enough for my needs.

It sucks to have to take the whole thing apart and have to ship it back after waiting anxiosly for it for 9 days!

After less panic/frustration and more time to research I found that some people are having problems with that OCZ ram at 1.7v and OCZ is giving people RMAs. Yet that would not be my problem.

I also found out that Intel released a bios update on 12.10.08 whic adds better support for OCZ memory *AND* also for 1.7v memory.

But now for the kicker.... I took the system to Tiger and amazingly enough a nice tech guy listened to me and noticed that I am also in the IT field and he tried different brand ram (corsair I believe) at 1.5v, also swapped cpu with an intel q6600 and finally with a single DDR3 1.5v OCZ stick. Same freaking results!!!!

I dont know how that **** board booted those 6 or so times, but if I would of found out about the bios update beforehand I would of definitely applied it.

he also told me that he's noticed that most mobo manufacturers are having problems with the dd3 and that he gets a handful of customers with similar dd3 issues, incompatability and such.

tomorrow I am contacting intel directly to see if they can provide me with a mobo swap that includes their new 12.10 bios update since I doubt that this one has it. God knows how long tiger has had this mobo sitting in a shelf somewhere.

so I dont think I can blame tiger for the bundle since it is compatible memory, YET they should be aware of the bios upgrade issue and make sure that they have a fresh updated stack of mobos to ship.

for now, I am leaving the pc at the office with the cmos battery disconnected (intels site says to leave unplugged for an hour to clear, ha, never heard that one) but I am leaving it over nite to see if I can get lucky and troubleshoot some more tomorrow *disappointed*

thanks

ceez

ps- so it is normal to push button, fan spins and slows down (quick on/off) and then startup?!?! weird.

[ripken204]

bring it back to tiger, tell them to put in a crappy dual core and normal speed ram and hopefully it boots up so that u can flash it.

the bios update was the first thing that i was going to say.

as for your ps question, it happens to me everytime that i turn the power supply power from off to on and then try to start up.

this should not happend at every boot though.

[puntoMX]

bring it back to tiger, tell them to put in a crappy dual core and normal speed ram and hopefully it boots up so that u can flash it.

Or just let them deal with the problem, tjeez, what a mess they make and how could they sell it like that as a "kit"...

Ask them to swap it for a DDR2 board from Gigabyte or so and with normal voltage DDR2 RAM or just plain ask your cash back and buy something else there as I don´t think they will give your whole paid price back (don´t know about restocking, but it´s not your fault is theirs...)...

Man this p***es me off... Finally you got to build your new PC and they sell you crap...

[CoffeeFiend]

or just plain ask your cash back and buy something else there as I don´t think they will give your whole paid price back

Man this p***es me off... Finally you got to build your new PC and they sell you crap...

That would be my option too... It's not really an incredible deal in the first place, not so much hardware I would have chosen (Intel brand board, not much RAM and DDR3, etc). And seemingly it comes with its share of problems.

[ceez]

yeah i would have to return the entire thing to them, I cant just swap out the board for another one since it's part of their "kit" and they would send me a replacement board...I actually could directly at the store but I might have to pay a difference and go directly to the store and not via cust serv RMA dept....wait, now that I think about it, the ONLY dd3 board per the tech there is a tripple SLI enabled board that was 239....I dont think so

If I cant get that bios flashed tomorrow after the cmos gets cleared overnight it will be fight time with their RMA department.

and back to that power on question, yet it happens every time, either when I click the switch on the PSU or if it's just on and I use the power button on the front panel. Every boot, quick spin, stop, power on. Could be that whole RAM issue.

[CoffeeFiend]

it will be fight time with their RMA department.

Well, if all else fails, and that you also paid with your credit card, you can call your credit card company and explain them it doesn't work at all, many problems, definitely not what you'd expect for your money/you're dissatisfied, and that you're not willing to pay for it.

It may not so much a "nice" thing to do, but as a last resort, it does the trick. The credit card company will tell tiger they won't give them the money for it basically (i.e. a chargeback), so they'll be forced to take it back. Honestly, I don't think I ever had this many hardware issues with a computer, and when it's sold as a kit, it's expected that the parts should work together (been tested), otherwise it shouldn't be sold like that! (nevermind again the super slow hard drive and all)

Out of $500, what would I get?

First attempt, right from newegg.com (picking parts based on price pretty much, as you want a "deal")

GIGABYTE GA-EP45-DS3L $80.99 (after MIR though, but it's only $15, and the only MIR -- still better than the tiger MIR); nicer all-around IMO, and importantly, still uses inexpensive yet fast DDR2

There's a fair number of 2x2GB kits of PC6400 CL5 (various brands) $40 and under... pick one -- this is significantly better/faster than only 2GB! Nothing will make your computer slower than not having enough RAM.

Intel E5200 CPU, $82.99 -- still more than enough for HD and all (the quad core mostly "goes to waste" here), especially with a good vid card...

Sapphire Radeon HD 3450 512MB, $36.99 -- yes, this one even comes with a vid card! And it does 1080p H.264 decoding in hardware too... Passively cooled too (no fan, no noise!)

WD Caviar 640GB AAKS series, $64.99, MUCH, MUCH faster, more space and all... (no point in having a quad core if it'll spend half its time waiting on the hard disk either)

Antec 300 case $59.95, 'nuff said

PSU wise, there's some Seasonics, Antec Earthwatts and what not between $40 and $50 that are more than sufficient for such a basic rig

tons of good DVD writers around $30, pick one...

Total? $450 or so. That includes a better case, a better PSU, better motherboard, twice as much RAM, a vid card (the other didn't), a DVD writer (the other didn't), a bigger and more importantly WAY faster hard drive, and better motherboard, along with a still plenty fast CPU, for about $50 less. And no hardware issues or any of that. That $50 extra can go towards a overly fancy PSU, or an extra 2x2GB kit of DDR2 to bump it to 8GB and make it really scream, or an extra nice motherboard... And you can still get a quad core if you really insist, for not too much more.

Edited December 31, 2008 by crahak

[ceez]

well I very surprised that all went well with tiger. mentioned the opened items, non compatible components and all I got was 2 mins hold time and got an RMA. Now for the bad part of taking it all apart and putting them back in their packages

crahak, followed your lead and this is what my newegg cart looks like:

Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD6400AAKS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

Item #: N82E16822136218

$74.99

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ - Retail

Item #: N82E16820231122

$39.99

GIGABYTE GA-EP45-DS3L LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

Item #: N82E16813128345

$95.99

Intel Pentium E5200 Wolfdale 2.5GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80571E5200 - Retail

Item #: N82E16819116072

$82.99

Combo Deal (save 10 bucks)

Antec earthwatts EA430 430W ATX12V v2.0 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply - Retail

Item #: N82E16817371006

&

Antec Three Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail

Item #: N82E16811129042

$89.94

Subtotal: $383.90

I'll be damned, cheaper afterall. I'll be keeping my pci 512 HIS HD Radeon 2400 card and obviously will be adding my BR player, yet it's a dual core and not even a core duo....might be feeling obsolete in a year

Might have to play around with the mobo a bit to see what it supports.

Thanks again for all the help.

Ceez

[CoffeeFiend]

I'll be keeping my pci 512 HIS HD Radeon 2400 card

any particular reason? The other card is much nicer, especially for HD content.

it's a dual core and not even a core duo....might be feeling obsolete in a year

Nah, it really is a Core 2 Duo in everything but name. Same Wolfdale core and all, it's just not *marketed* as a C2D...

Also, you'd be surprised how easy it is to overclock those things... On the stock cooler, stock voltages and all... You can easily make it 50% faster (my puny E2160 has been running OC'ed by 85% since day 1, no problems whatsoever)

Most software can't make use of 4 cores yet... The main uses right now would be things like running a lot of virtual machines at once (with a fair amount of load on each), doing some fairly AV encoding (with the few tools that support it), and stuff like that. For everyday tasks, 4 cores just means your CPU sits even more idle.

[ceez]

If I do an RMA they will charge me that stupid stocking fee which is 17 bucks UNLESS I replace the item with another of equal or greater value, in this case that $37 card would end up costing $54, no biggie though and I am still saving some money in the long run.

BUT looking at the comparison it seems like not much of a difference, the fan of the one i currently own is super silent and it comes with that dvi -> hdmi adapter!! oh the little things in life.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Productcompa...N82E16814102757

The only difference would be the obvious speed increase in bus speed of 2.5gps per lane of the pciex16 VS the single 1.06gps of a pci bus. And then why would this saphire be so much cheaper than the HIS when it's using much newer/faster technology?

[Zxian]

The price is purely a matter of supply and demand. The need for PCI video cards has dropped like a stone, so all the production is in the newer, better technologies. Therefore, the price drops and you get the better deal. Just because something is more expensive does not mean that it's better - especially in the computer market.

Long story short - just go with the PCIe card - not the PCI.

[ceez]

zxian....obviously the concept of supply & demand did not kick in. but yes, you're correct.

I'll end up getting that pcie instead and pay that restocking fee.