NoelC

Yeah, I think it must be a latent problem in DWM itself. Nothing at all was logged in the Event Viewer this time. -Noel

By the way, I don't consider the above a particularly big problem. It happens when the monitors are off, restarts itself, and doesn't negatively affect anything I can detect. If the dwm window weren't there I'd probably not even have noticed it. I just figured you'd want to know about it, BigMuscle. -Noel

I have verified (using virtual machines) that the command I listed can be trusted to make a full and complete system image backup, which can be restored to bare metal to recover from a catastrophic failure. I did such backups with Windows 7 before, as well. That was more easily set up, right through the UI provided. I have achieved the same level of protection now with Windows 8.1 (I wouldn't have upgraded had I not been able to do that). Only thing is, with Windows 7's "Previous Versions" feature, I didn't have to think about the data on the backup at all - if I overwrote a file I could just right-click on it, choose Previous versions, and it would be listed right there, with a source of "Backup". Now, for example with Shadow Explorer, I can see the backup files. All you have to do is to select the drive from which the files were backed-up. Shadow Explorer would be a fine solution to this but for the fact that the thing has a bug in it and it retrieves the files sometimes with corruption. I have been working with the author on getting that fixed. There are other tools - e.g., Z-VSSCopy, that have a clunkier user interface but will retrieve the individual backed-up files just fine, without corruption - so I know the data is there. In a pinch I can use Z-VSSCopy today to recover files from the backup, though it's not as convenient as the full Explorer integration of Previous Versions - hence my posting. The wbadmin command uses the volume shadow copy subsystem to do the backup, but Is not all that well-documented (per the wbadmin command help): wbadmin start backup -? . . . -vssFull Performs a full backup using the Volume Shadow Copy Service (VSS). Each file's history is updated to reflect that it was backed up. If this parameter is not used WBADMIN START BACKUP makes a copy backup, but the history of files being backed up is not updated. Caution: Do not use this parameter if you are using a product other than Windows Server Backup to back up applications that are on the volumes included in the current backup. Doing so canpotentially break the incremental, differential, or other type of backups that the other backup is creating. -vssCopy Performs a copy backup using VSS. The history of the files being backed up is not updated. This is the default value. What it really does is create a full volume shadow copy that is not only complete but incremental, meaning after the first one is done, which copies everything, nightly System Image backups are incremental and complete quickly, often in well less than an hour - depending on how much you have changed on the disk. You have access to multiple different shadow copies, and these backups can as I mentioned be used to do a full system restoral, integrated with the Windows 8.1 recovery tools you can get to by booting a Windows 8.1 DVD. It's actually a great setup that really works, and it's utterly disappointing that Microsoft is turning away from something that's obviously very well thought-out. Idiots. -Noel

After nearly a week of clean operation, and well over a day of hard use of RC1, I had a DWM restart (. It happened just moments after I let the machine go dark (power saving screen saver for the monitors only) last night. When I woke up the monitors by moving the mouse this morning, this was the scene. All normal, except that dwm.exe was showing (it had been minimized). I generally leave next to nothing running, just the clock, though IrfanView happened to also be running (I use that to capture desktop images); the orange Taskbar button is a Skype chat from a friend that arrived some 6 hours later). Here's the log for the entire time of the run of the RC1 software. I haven't used RDP with it at all, though I find it interesting you've captured restarts of DWM. http://Noel.ProDigitalSoftware.com/ForumPosts/debug_dwm_Restart.log -Noel

Thanks for your thoughts. From my observations with the 3rd party tools, I *am* able to see all the files in my shadow-copy integrated backups, initiated via the following command, scheduled nightly: wbadmin start backup -allCritical -vssFull -quiet -backupTarget:G:\ Given that the information actually is available, it would be quite handy to be able to more easily access it. I imagine one of the 3rd party shadow copy access tool developers will come through sooner or later - and maybe even monetize their product, given that Windows 8 is sorely lacking the functionality. Right now, ShadowExplorer seems to have the best UI, but files recovered from shadow copies or backup are sometimes riddled with data corruption - not exactly what you want when you're recovering your critical files from backup. -Noel

Sorry about the truncated subject. It should read: What's it Going to Take to Restore Previous Versions from Shadow Copies? Microsoft removed the Previous Versions feature from File Explorer in Windows 8. I've been doing some digging, as I would like to continue to be able to access data in Shadow Copies (to restore a file or folder from a shadow copy-integrated System Image backup, for example). I've uncovered a number of half-baked tools to access shadow copy data, but none of them are currently of a quality that breeds much confidence. They're either buggy or clunky. These include ShadowExplorer, Z-VSSCopy, and Previous Version Recoverer... I'd love to hear about more if you know them. I've learned that the property page in Windows Explorer in Windows 7 that shows the Previous Versions and allows, Restore, etc. is provided by a shell extension called twext.dll, and it turns out this DLL is present and accounted for in Windows 8 as well, though notably it's a little bit smaller than the one from Windows 7. It's typically found at C:\Windows\System32\twext.dll. The fact that twext.dll is still wired in makes me wonder whether with an appropriate registry (or some other) tweak it might be possible to just restore the Previous Versions sheet to the Properties panel in File Explorer. It seems the Microsoft people haven't really deleted it outright, but may have just hidden it. Do any of you with more knowledge of how Explorer is put together have any ideas how to restore the Previous Versions property page? Knowledge online is a bit scarce and I'm just trying to get the creative juices flowing to solve yet another Windows 8 shortcoming. -Noel

Try using HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\DWM key, REG_SZ value CustomThemeAtlas to load it. Make sure your path doesn't contain any spaces. -Noel

Yes, by all means if you have the knowledge to do so, please see if you can restore glow to the titles of ribbon windows. That would add a lot of value in my opinion. I already use the title + add glow feature in ClassicShell to restore glow-backed titles to IE windows, but File Explorer and Wordpad are still dark. With File Explorer it's not so bad since the path is what I want to see and ClassicShell can configure it so that the path is shown in the address box full-time (breadcrumbs disable). But having a real title on File Explorer windows would be icing on the cake. -Noel

It seems to work quite well. I went with glow option 1, which I find ideal: Even though I keep my glass areas quite translucent and love dark (astro) backgrounds, I can still see the titles on both active and inactive windows just fine. Bravo, BigMuscle! -Noel

For what it's worth, BigMuscle, I haven't seen a single dwm.exe restart since last week, even though Monday I re-enabled Aero Glass for Win 8.1 RC0. I can't explain why I was seeing roughly one a day then none. I haven't even rebooted the system since I was seeing them (it's now been up for 13 days 7 hours). -Noel

I'm not sure what "TMT" is, and I don't have any blu-ray discs (though I have a blu-ray drive), but just playing HD digital videos with Windows Media Player doesn't yield any visible corruption of the window borders, etc. I wonder if you could be having problems with your display driver... What video card and driver version do you have? -Noel

Pretty much everyone agrees that the out-of-box Windows 8 desktop experience sucks, but Mike, try not to be so inflexible that you can't get used to some changes with a new OS. Many of us choose themes that are somewhat between what the old and new systems delivered out of the box, with enough of the "old familiar" look and feel to help us over the hump. In my case I've developed a theme atlas so that the big rounded corners are now subtle, almost imperceptible rounded corners, but which still provides drop shadows. -Noel

Mike, you should probably read the entire thread on this product, and the several related threads near the top of the MSFN Windows 8 forum. Your questions are all answered here already, many times over. Yes, there are themes available online for Windows 8.1 that ape Windows 7 and which BigMuscle's product facilitates using, and yes, you can get reflection stripes. MrGRiM has published a very nice graphic for the latter. -Noel

As a follow-up, and using the Security Event Log as a check, I have not seen any spontaneous DWM restarts in the time since I stopped Aero Glass for Win 8.1 from running. BigMuscle, if you have a debug version you'd like me to try privately I'll be happy to do so. Otherwise, let me know what else I can check/provide to you. I've gone ahead and turned it back on. Running Windows 8.1 without it was a constant reminder of how little Microsoft thinks of its users. -Noel

I don't use hibernate or sleep either, just monitor power-down on inactivity (screen save). So far no restarts without Aero Glass on the job, but we'll see... -Noel

I'm pretty sure the device messages have to do with the System Image backup unmounting and mounting my external USB drive, and they're not seen with every dwm restart, but yes, I'll be happy to leave Aero Glass for Win 8.1 disabled for the next day or so and see how it goes. -Noel

Just wanted to mention that I tried Remote Desktop (RDP, from my iPad no less) and Aero Glass for Win 8.1 worked great. It turns out the two display power settings do end up being connected (i.e., one and the same), though the way the UI is constructed that's not at all obvious. Typical Microsoft - can't even code a simple settings changing application very well. -Noel

It's possible the ATI Catalyst driver is capable of powering-down the card during periods of inactivity, I don't know. I do notice the fans seem to reach a lower level of activity when the monitors shut off. I'm running the ATI Catalyst 13.9 driver suite - the latest released version for Windows 8.1 and ATI Radeon HD 7850 video card. There doesn't seem to be any setting in the Catalyst Control Center for managing power-down states. However, in the Windows Power Options, there's a master "Turn off the display" setting, which I have set for 3 minutes, and in the Advanced settings a "Turn off display after" setting, which I have also set for 3 minutes. I always thought it was odd that there are two, and have wondered whether they are one and the same, but they're apparently not - it's possible to set the latter to "Never" even though the former is set for 3 minutes. Is it possible the one in Advanced Settings is actually powering-down the video card? I'll experiment to see if I can find out. By the way, the "PCI Express, Link State Power Management" is set to Off. Could the error be logged because DWM is trying to start back up? Notably this error is not logged every time (a dwm restart happened again since my last post, at 1:14 am, with no Application error logged - http://Noel.ProDigitalSoftware.com/ForumPosts/RC0_DWM_Restart_20131130_0114.log). It seems to be happening more often lately, though interestingly, at most only once during each screen save cycle. In this particular case my system image backup was running, but that started at 1:00 am. There seems to be no pattern or other thing I can find consistently running when it happens. -Noel

Such as... Easily restarting DWM if you have a problem or are making experimental changes to settings. Reading out one's computer code. Being reminded that you should not be running this software on a system that needs to be reliable or handle critical data. If you just can't stand the watermark or dwm.exe window, all you have to do is wait until the product is released. It really is still a beta and is being actively developed. Conditions under which you get to try out the pre-release software are not negotiable and complaining only serves to irritate the developer - do you really think that's a good idea? Everyone knows that whole lots of people are anxious for this product to be released. No one but BigMuscle can say what he will do in the future, but if the development of this version goes as the prior one did, the license you received after donation will be valid for the released version and you'll be able to run Aero Glass for Windows 8.1 nag-free and watermark-free thereafter. -Noel

Sure would be nice if I could easily paste information into this forum... Hm, seems like I can paste into a "code" block... The Desktop Window Manager has encountered a fatal error (0x8898008d)- System - Provider [ Name] Desktop Window Manager - EventID 9020 [ Qualifiers] 49152 Level 2 Task 0 Keywords 0x80000000000000 - TimeCreated [ SystemTime] 2013-11-29T18:14:59.000000000Z EventRecordID 4147 Channel Application Computer NoelC4 Security - EventData 0x8898008d It doesn't always log one of these. It restarted again this evening at 16:27 without having done so. -Noel

As a suggestion, create a folder C:\DWM and move all the files there. Then make the AppInit_DLLs string value point to C:\DWM\DWMGlass.dll. -Noel

What problem are you trying to show? It's not clear from your screen grabs. Please describe it in more detail, in multiple ways, and be specific. Use a translator program if you have to. -Noel

By the way, BigMuscle, dwm.exe has restarted on me twice now since having installed RC0. In both cases it was when the monitors were powered-down due to inactivity. Here's the log from the latest occurrence. http://Noel.ProDigitalSoftware.com/ForumPosts/RC0_DWM_Restart_2.log I don't think anything's being logged that gives a clue as to why it's happening. It just says Uninstalling... then immediately starts up again. It doesn't seem to affect any running application, and I don't guess this will be a problem or even visible when the dwm.exe window is eliminated. It doesn't happen every time the monitors are left inactive and power down. Probably only once every 10 times or so. -Noel

PandaX, I have a vague memory that the folder name where the dll and other attendant files live needs to be a short name. I hope I'm not crossing two things up. I use C:\BIN myself, as I already had the folder on my system. What registry settings did you use, specifically? -Noel

That's fine but if you do something where the theme settings affect all captions, then if by the theme settings they are all made less easy to see, I would want a way to make them more visible again. I may be able to compensate with a more opaque glow in the theme atlas, I don't know. I do know that I happen to like quite transparent glass effects with fairly significant glow effects. Pretty where it needs to be, practical where it needs to be. It seems to me you are making Windows even easier to use than Microsoft themselves did with the Windows 7 implementation. -Noel