Port Forwarding with WinXP & Westell 2200 router

[thedelraynian]

Hello all,

I can't seem to get my router (I assume it's my router configuration

giving me the trouble) to allow access from the outside to my server. I

spent most of the day yesterday at

http://www.portforward.com/ trying to follow the instructions on how to

properly forward a port. I think (there I go again) that I followed the

instructions for my specific router correctly, although the

instructions were a little incomplete. I don't have any other computers

on my network, therefore, I surmised that I didn't need to create a

static IP address. I forwarded one port to my router and that port is

attached to my internal IP address. I then call a friend and ask them

the try and connect with the address:

http://MyInternalIPaddress:ForwardedPort#.

Everytime the attempt to connect is made, my friend gets the message

"cannot connect to server". Let's say I wantd Apache to use port 7777;

in the port range of the router configuration page, I inserted:

7777-7777, and as the base port-7777. This is what the PortForward.com

suggested. Any suggestions?

[janus zeal]

Looks like your going about it right, except you need them to connect to your public ip, not your private ip. goto www.whatismyip.com to get your public ip

also make sure you allow the connection in any firewall you might have.

if your intrested, you can get a free domain that will automaticly update to your public ip. www.no-ip.com

[thedelraynian]

Thanks a lot Janus Zeal,

I did create an exception in my firewall, but for my internal IP address. That free service that you mentioned is an excellent tool!! If I weren't to use it though, I suppose that I'd have to configure a static IP address in my router, or is that used for internal (private) IPs only?

Thanks again, my friend.

Dan

[Zxian]

Moved to proper forum.

[tain]

Your friend needs to use your EXTERNAL IP, not internal.

And you do need to use a static internal IP with port forwarding. It can work with DHCP, but if you get a different IP (yes, even if you are the only client) then your ports won't be forwarded properly.

I forwarded one port to my router and that port is attached to my internal IP address.

Should be forwarded ON the router. The router gets the packets and forwards them TO your machine.

[thedelraynian]

Thanks a million TAin and JZ,

I don't think that I would have stood a chance at getting it right without ya'lls help (ya'll is a word in Winchester Virginia). I now have something that makes sense. I'm going to go and try your suggestions, have someone try and access my server and post the results.

Much thanks,

Dan

[janus zeal]

external/public ip is everyone on the internet can connect to your computer/network with.

internal/private ip is only for people on your network to connect to.

Edited June 9, 2006 by janus zeal

[thedelraynian]

Sorry that I haven't posted something earlier, but in the course of following some of the excellent suggestions given to me in this and other forums I've discovered that my newly installed IIS 6.0 and Visual Studio 2005 is getting in the way of things. It seems that IIS won't recognize (or I haven't learned how to make it do so) my Apache 2.2.2. In other words, I've gotten side tracked trying to figure out why IIS seems to concentrate entirely on ASP applications. As you all know, I'm pretty new to web applications. I've got to do a lot more research into how these apps. interact.

Thank you all for your help.

Dan

[tain]

Running two web servers is interesting. Try to avoid that if possible. I can't even begin to imagine all of the problems that could cause.

[thedelraynian]

Thanks for replying TAin,

"...interesting" you say. That sure sounds like a polite way of saying "foolish". I literally laughed out loud when I read the first sentence of your reply post. I had a strong feeling that I was once again doing what seems to be my forte--over doing it or stacking like applications on top of each other. Man...let me tell ya'...I test drive so much software that I run my registry scanning software Registry First Aid twice a day looking for dead entries. Although I run my system pretty hard, I do try to keep it clean, prevent applications from interfering with each other, maintain my hard drive (I run SpinRite 6 three or four times per week) and generally practice the duality of brutalizing and “mother henning” my machine.

I'm just an electrician who turned on his first computer two and a half years ago. I spent the first year studying the Windows file system and registry; the second year cramming Windows & Internet security and for the last six months I've been trying to figure out the best approach to gathering up the necessary tools for building a web site--a real web site that can deliver services. Along the way, I've learned all of my lessons through mistakes because, as you can imagine, not too many of my comrades are too interested in computers beyond email & porno, therefore, I've kinda' been on my own. I rely heavily on Googling my problems and reading everything that I have time to absorb. Recently, I've been utilizing forums, and this one has been the most hospitable to me; I appreciate it very much.

If you could give me another token of wisdom, I think that I can focus my energies much more efficiently. I understand that it’s difficult to impart detailed knowledge in a forum, so if you’d allow me to sputter on a bit about what I’ve got going on and give me your best “this is what I’d do if I were you” advice, I would be even more grateful. You’ve got to believe me when I say that if anything goes wrong, you’re not going to hear me attribute it to you in anyway whatsoever; I know better than that. Besides, even if I’ve got to start all over I will be successful with getting a quality web site up and running no matter what happens.

I’m running a Dell (don’t laugh) WindowsXP Pro with a small business software package (Office suite) with dual 500 Mb CPUs at 3.2 GHz with 160 Gb of storage. In terms of tools & software that I’ve installed on my computer within the last six months, I first started with installing the Apache 2.2.2.; it sits in my Program Files. Previous to installing Apache, I had already installed Perl, Python24 and Tcl from Active State and also have PHP 5.1.2, OpenSSH and OpenSSL as well; all of the latter sits in my C:\ folder. I had also previously installed Microsoft SQL 2005 Server Management Studio Express. Before I posted my inquiry about port forwarding, I had been able to experiment loading documents & images with Apache locally; all seemed to be going in the right direction. You might be wondering “…how interesting…do you know how to use any of that stuff?” Well…I can write some XHTML pages; a little PHP & Perl; a tad of SQL and haven’t started trying to learn much of the Tcl or Python, although I’ve got tons of snippet libraries and documentation for everything. I use HTMLKit with about 50 installed plugins to manage it all. Yes, my computer is a loaded shotgun with a hair trigger, I know; and no, I don’t practice my electrical trade in the same manner that I approach web development---I’d be dead by now if I did.

The real complications began when I started reading about Microsoft’s Visual Studio. I had never experimented with Visual Basic and from what I had read, VB wasn’t too daunting of a language to learn. Then I discovered all of the tools that Microsoft was willing to allow me to download for free, and away I went. I installed Visual Web Developer 2005 Express Edition. In order for the VWD to work properly, I had to install IIS 6.0 and a few other components from my original Windows installation CD. It all seemed to integrate nicely with my SQL Server Management Studio Express; they got along well with each other anyway. But immediately afterwards, whenever I attempted to access my Apache server I started getting “ASP error 201 cannot load page” errors. I got rid of them through some configuration and permission changes in the IIS configuration panel, but it still wouldn’t allow me to access Apache’s directory via my browser. The three days that I spent studying how to properly forward ports, create a static IP address and otherwise get a good feel how my router configuration was set up didn’t go to waste, but I never got a chance to implement any of the things I learned because I got side tracked with not being able to access my Apache server. Now you pretty much tell me what I suspected but didn’t have the guts to admit; I probably have to get rid of one of the web servers.

The BIG question I have for you is: what little you know of my situation, what would you do? I know it sounds like a loaded question, but when I asked a few other knowledgeable (well…fairly knowledgeable) people the same question the responses are either “Get that Windows crap off of your computer and stick with Apache”, or “dude…Microsoft rules…ditch that open source garbage and go with a proven winner.” I appreciate personal taste, but I’ve got a feeling that these guys have never used both of these applications; they started with one or the other and have become brand loyal. If you could give me nod one way or the other, it would help me out.

Thanks for your consideration,

Dan

Edited June 15, 2006 by thedelraynian

[Littlebr00k]

The reason you can not access the apache web server is because both of the web servers you have installed, are trying to serve their pages on port 80 (which is the default). If you want to run both web servers then one of them needs to have there default port changed to another number to stop the conflict.

Then you would be able to access them seperatly. Depending on the which one was changed and the port number the links to the seperate web servers would be something like

http://yourdomain.com:80

http://yourdomain.com:8080

As to which one to use, it is up to your own personal preference. I have used both in the past, but I would say for the "novice" that IIS is probably easier to use as its configuration can be changed with a few point and clicks and the rest of your MS software will intergrate with it easier.

Edited June 15, 2006 by Littlebr00k

[thedelraynian]

Thanks Littlebr00k,

I thought that I had tried that, but I can't remember if I rebooted before I tested the results. I'm pretty sure that if you modify Apache's httpd.conf file, you have to reboot before the change takes effect. I'll try it again.

Cheers,

Dan

[tain]

Thanks for replying TAin,

I, and probably some others, might be able to reply more quickly and more often if you changed your avatar. It borders on porn and so I can't read your posts at work.

"...interesting" you say. That sure sounds like a polite way of saying "foolish".

I was thinking that, but it isn't really the case. It is possible, as br00k pointed out, to run different servers on different ports. It is just a bit complex for what is most likely a personal server and if they were both commerce sites you would need to do some redirection so that your business doesn't live at yourdomain.com:8888.

(I run SpinRite 6 three or four times per week)

Watch out for Steve Gibson, his propaganda, and his software. He is dubious to say the least. I have no experience with SpinRite, though.

I've been trying to figure out the best approach to gathering up the necessary tools for building a web site--a real web site that can deliver services.

Aha! Now we are on track

I rely heavily on Googling my problems and reading everything that I have time to absorb. Recently, I've been utilizing forums, and this one has been the most hospitable to me; I appreciate it very much.

Good tactics

haven’t started trying to learn much of the Tcl or Python

If you are concentrating on web development you may not want to worry about TCL or Python for now. Both have their uses but neither is really the best for web devs...especially TCL! Stick with PHP, Ruby, *HTML, CSS, Perl and maybe even some Javascript and you should be fine. All languages have their pros and cons and there are lots of zealots out there who will sell you one way or the other. Figure out which one you like the best and are most productive with. THAT is the best language for you. (Personally, I use PHP most of the time)

Now you pretty much tell me what I suspected but didn’t have the guts to admit; I probably have to get rid of one of the web servers.

No, not according to me/us anyway. It comes down to this: what are your requirements? You sorta defined them above (deliver real services). It sounds like you aren't hampered by a boss that likes language X or an existing infrastructure/project to support so it is really up to your personal preference. For the record, most of the web runs on Apache. Not sure if that means anything to you or not.

The BIG question I have for you is: what little you know of my situation, what would you do? I know it sounds like a loaded question

In the IIS vs Apache battle you will find lots of opinions. There are lots of questions to ask: Are you more comfortable with a GUI or a text file? That is where most of the management takes place (there are kinda GUIs for Apache, though).

Have you already invested in Windows? Maybe you want to capitalize on that investment.

Do you rely on a certain brand of database? Does that affect your server choice?

What about development tools? Would those sway you?

As far as performance goes there are MANY shootouts that compare the two and you can easily find one to support whatever claims you want to make.

So it really comes back to your requirements. Decide on what you want. Is there a 'killer app' in your plan? Does that app only run on one of the platforms? Then your decision is already made for you.

, but when I asked a few other knowledgeable (well…fairly knowledgeable) people the same question the responses are either “Get that Windows crap off of your computer and stick with Apache”, or “dude…Microsoft rules…ditch that open source garbage and go with a proven winner.” I appreciate personal taste, but I’ve got a feeling that these guys have never used both of these applications; they started with one or the other and have become brand loyal. If you could give me nod one way or the other, it would help me out.

Well I have used both and I personally prefer Apache. It is elegant and reliable. I have found IIS to be convoluted and unreliable. You mileage may vary. It sounds like you have tried most of this stuff already so all of this may come down to an easy question: which one do YOU prefer?

And stop rebooting for Apache, you silly Windows user

http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/stopping.html.en

[thedelraynian]

Thanks again TAin for a thorough response.

About the avatar; I thought for sure that a moderator would have scolded me by now. I'm trying to quit smoking...whatever. I almost replaced it with the IBEW logo, but I didn't want to get in trouble for attempting to "organize" the forum so I think that I'll settle on the main IBEW graphic.

Let me soak up everything that you've told me and I'll post some more sophomoric questions later. I'll chain myself to the Apache website this weekend and get a better feel for what kind of tools they offer. Microsoft sure does dish out some really nice tools, but all in all I feel that Microsoft is rather bulky and unpredictable, therefore, my gut tells me that Apache is the better route---we'll see.

I read the source of lots of the web sites that I visit, so I'm aware that The Web seems to run on Apache.

A GUI is nice, but I'm beginning to believe that GUIs spoil me--I'll learn more managing my site via text files.

What you said about Steve Gibson is fascinating. His was one of the first web sites that I spent any considerable time gleaning when I was in my web security learning phase. I felt that he was quite philanthropic with some of the free tools and decent information he laid out. I bought the SpinRite 6 almost as a thank you to him. I'd be very interested in how you feel about him if you want to send me a personal message or email and fill me in--I heard similar scuttle butt on a different forum (Not my man Steve!!!!, I thought).

What does it mean that you're a "sponsor"? Are you a vendor?

I take it from your last comment that you're a Linux slave....please don't tell me that you're a MacinBoob. My girlfriend's a MacinBoob....she was as cocky and arrogant as The Lord himself until I, a WinWeenie, had to go over to her house and lock down her WiFi security for her---a handful of people were using her machine as an email pub.

Take care and have a good weekend, my friend.

Dan

[tain]

There is no shortage of Steve/GRC haters out there. This site is the loudest. Don't base your opinion of him on just that source, though. I've seen many respected authors write both online and in print about Steve's wandering ways.

FYI: not a single serious sysadmin/techie that I know keeps GRC tools in their toolkit.

The Sponsor tag just means that I donated $10 to this forum/site. I really wanted to donate to my favorite project, HFSLIP, but they don't have a way to donate yet.

I'm not a linux slave! I don't even use it that often, though I did in the past. I mainly work on Win2K workstations. My web server is a linux box but my favorite server OS is OpenBSD.

Don't know crap about Macs :/

Off to work I go...good luck!