[Windows 95 2.1GHz CPU Limit BROKEN!]

I've uploaded the file here [2.78 MB]:

http://www.mdgx.com/spx/FIX95CPU.ZIP

[re-ZIPped using 7-zip, "shaved off" a few more bytes = smaller file size. ]

HTH

Thanks MDGx

@everyone else:

I'm open to suggestions on how this "patch" might be improved, If some of you get to test it, please give me some feedback.

Good Luck!

[Windows 95 2.1GHz CPU Limit BROKEN!]

Can you just copy ndis.vxd at the same time the files from the K6-2 patch are copied over?

I'd test it, but I don't have access to a PC with a CPU over 2.1 GHz to run in Virtual PC.

**EDIT 2-10-2010**

Incorrect information removed.

This is possible if you allow the IOS error to be displayed and allow VMM32.VXD to be compressed before copying the K62 patch + NIDS.VXD. (See instructions above.)

I strongly recommend installing DUN14-95.EXE normally when Setup is complete however, it contains several other updated system files related to Networking, whether you use Dial-Up Internet or not.

Great work, LoneCrusader!

This thread is now added to the Important "Stickified" [Pinned] 95/98/98 SE/ME Topics.

Wow

I never thought I would be worthy of that list. Thanks guys!

[Windows 95 2.1GHz CPU Limit BROKEN!]

Nice. But why are you installing the AMDK6 patch twice? (once manually, once automatically)

**EDIT 2-10-2010**

It does not appear to be necessary to do this. I have changed the instructions to reflect that.

win95 working fine!

AMD Atlhon 64 processor 4000+ 2.40 ghz

mobo asus av8

512 ram

thanks LoneCrusader

BeatZero

Congrats, I'm glad someone else is interested and can confirm my results.

I might have to try my hand at making a "patch" that would automate some of this if people are interested.

Now if only RLoew's RAM patch worked in 95

[Windows 95 2.1GHz CPU Limit BROKEN!]

***UPDATED 06-10-2013***

I have managed to fix the 2.1GHz CPU limit of Windows 95.

Completely with updates from Microsoft... when they claimed there was no fix for this.

Here's a link to the MSKB article on this issue.

Q312108 - Windows Protection Error in NDIS With a CPU That Is Faster Than 2.1 GHz

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Version 3.0 Released 06-10-2013

New or otherwise significant in this version:

- Version 3.0 can be used on all Windows 95 versions. (RTM\OSR2) (95\95A\95B\95C)

- Version 3.0 addresses specific issues with and better supports Windows 95 RTM. (95\95A)

- Version 3.0 makes the proper registry entries that would be made if AMDK6UPD.EXE and the other updates were installed under Windows 95.

- Version 3.0 includes a Processor-specific HotFix for Windows 95B OSR2. It is not needed on other versions of 95.

- Version 3.0 no longer includes or mandates the installation of DUN14-95.EXE. Still "recommended."

- Version 3.0 can be installed before or after the "Windows Protection Error in IOS" has been displayed. (Before is still the preferred method.)

- Version 3.0 can patch a Windows 95 installation in directories other than C:\WINDOWS.

- Version 3.0 includes further updated versions of some system files contained in the AMDK6UPD.EXE patch, rendering AMDK6UPD.EXE obsolete.

- Version 3.0 includes PTCHCDFS, a free update by Rudolph Loew that corrects the displayed size of DVD media.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The README.TXT from FIX95CPU_V3_FINAL.ZIP, provides a detailed overview of this project, this issues it addresses, and the instructions for getting it to work. I will post it here:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Windows 95 High-Speed Processor Support v. 3.0 By LoneCrusader

CONTENTS OF THIS PACKAGE:

README.TXT - Self Explanatory.

FIX95CPU.EXE - Self-Extracting Bootable Floppy Disk image.

FIX95CPU.IMA - A standard image of the Bootable Floppy.

(For Virtual Machines.)

FIX95CPU.ISO - A standard Bootable CD image.

(For Virtual Machines, or systems without a floppy drive.)

VMM2XUPD.EXE - HotFix with updated VMM.VXD's for Windows 95 B OSR2.

(Install in Windows 95 B OSR2 after Setup has completed.)

-----------------------------------

NOTE:

The first section of this README will explain the issues addressed

by this patch. If you are familiar with these issues, you may skip to

the second section for step-by-step instructions.

SECTION ONE:

Windows 95 has two specific errors when dealing with processors

with speeds higher than 350 MHz. With a little patience however,

both of these errors are fixable.

The first error occurs with processors greater than 350 MHz.

Microsoft released a patch for this error, AMDK6UPD.EXE. This

patch IS NOT just for AMD processors. It will work for Intel

Pentium 4 processors as well. The problem with Microsoft's patch

is that it must be run from within Windows. When your system

encounters this error, you will not be able to boot into Windows.

This error will be displayed on the first reboot during the

installation process.

Here is the text of the error:

While initializing device IOS:

Windows Protection Error. You need to restart your computer.

The only way to fix this error is to manually install the files

contained in the Microsoft AMDK6UPD.EXE patch. This package automates

the process for you, so I will not go into further detail on that

issue here.

The second error occurs with processors greater than 2.1 GHz.

This problem also affected Windows 98 (First Edition), and Microsoft

issued a HotFix for Windows 98, but not for Windows 95. According to

Microsoft, there is no fix for this problem in Windows 95... WRONG!

This error is very similar to the previous one, and it will also be

displayed on the first reboot of the install process, after you have

fixed the previous error.

Here is the text of the error:

While initializing device NDIS:

Windows Protection Error. You need to restart your computer.

This error is corrected by an updated file contained in the DUN14-95.EXE

Dial-Up Networking 1.4 Update for Windows 95. This package automates

the process for you, so I will not go into further detail on that

issue here.

NOTE:

This update renders the AMDK6UPD.EXE patch OBSOLETE, as it

installs newer versions of some system files contained within

AMDK6UPD.EXE. While the main purpose of this update is to

enable the use of High-Speed Processors, I decided to include

any available newer versions of the system files already

contained in this patch.

List of Issues (MSKB Articles) FIXED by this update:

Q192841 - Difficulties Using AMD K6-2 or Athlon Central Processing Unit

Q234259 - Revision to AMD K6-2/350 Central Processing Unit Update

Q312108 - Windows Protection Error in NDIS with CPU Faster Than 2.1 GHz

Q231942 - Cannot Undock Notebook Computer with LS-120 Removable Drive

Q175629 - Large IDE Hard Disk May Run In Compatibility Mode

Q274175 - Error Opening/Copying File/Folder Eight Levels Deep on CD-ROM

Q159153 - Error Messages While Backing Up to Some Floppy Disk Drives

This update also includes a patched version of CDFS.VXD using PTCHCDFS,

a free update by Rudolph Loew (rloew) to fix the incorrect size value

(1.99GB) reported by Windows 9X for DVD's.

A separate bug exists in Windows 95 RTM/A that causes DVD sizes over

4GB to not have their byte counts displayed properly, showing "---"

instead, but the correct total size of the DVD will still be displayed.

Installing other update packages for Windows 95 RTM/A may yield a

solution to this, but has not been tested.

Also included in this version is a HotFix, VMM2XUPD.EXE, which installs

the latest version of VMM.VXD for Windows 95 B OSR2. This package should

be installed when Windows 95 B OSR2 Setup has completed. This update will

not run on Windows 95 RTM/A and is not required on Windows 95 C OSR2.5.

Credits & Other Information:

Rudolph Loew has also created a free UDF filesystem driver for reading

UDF formatted CD's/DVD's in Windows 95. It can be obtained from his site

at: http://rloew1.no-ip.com or mirror at: http://rloew.limewebs.com

Many thanks go out to Rudolph Loew for his assistance with this project!

Credit also goes to Petr at MSFN for providing patched files for 95 RTM.

And finally credit to Queue at MSFN for creating the ANSI Windows Logo.

For further information and updates, visit this topic at MSFN Forums:

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=141402

This package makes use of the General Replace (GR) text replace utility

created by Andrew Sharrad, which can be found at:

http://www.sharradsoftware.co.uk

SECTION TWO:

Follow these Instructions to get Windows 95 up and running.

You Will Need:

Blank Floppy Disk or Blank CD

Files Contained In FIX95CPU.ZIP

NOTE:

If your system does not have a floppy drive, the FIX95CPU.ISO

Bootable CD image in this package can be used (with Nero or

a similar CD burning program) to create a bootable CD that can

be used instead of a floppy.

NOTE:

These instructions and the FIX95CPU installer assume that

you are installing Windows 95 to C:\ Drive, however you can

use a directory other than C:\WINDOWS.

1. On another computer, use the self-extracting Floppy Disk image

(FIX95CPU.EXE) or the Bootable CD image (FIX95CPU.ISO)

provided in FIX95CPU.ZIP to create a custom Boot Disk

that will contain this patch.

2. Prepare your system and run Windows 95 Setup.

3. When Windows 95 asks you to Restart, insert the Boot Disk or

Boot CD that you created with the enclosed image, and click

Finish. You should have the Boot Disk or Boot CD inserted

BEFORE Windows Setup continues and the IOS error is displayed

in order to speed up the boot process by combining .VXD's

with WININIT.EXE, but this version allows for installation

after the IOS error has been displayed.

4. The Boot Disk will start your computer in DOS mode. Press SPACE and

you will be given an opportunity to view this README file.

Choose Y or N, and then all you need to do is press SPACE again

to bring up the next page of the README, or to apply the patch.

The program will output its actions to the screen so you can see

what is being done.

Pressing CTRL-C at any time will terminate the FIX95CPU program.

5. When finished, press SPACE to reboot your system, then remove the

Boot Disk or Boot CD so Windows 95 Setup can continue normally.

If you are installing Windows 95 RTM/A or C OSR2.5, you are finished.

For Windows 95 B OSR2 ONLY:

6. When Setup is complete and your Windows Desktop loads, run

VMM2XUPD.EXE to update VMM.VXD to the latest version, and you

will be prompted to restart.

This update is not necessary on Windows 95 C OSR2.5.

If you have Windows 95 RTM/A or C OSR2.5, skip this step.

The VMM2XUPD.EXE will not install on Windows 95 RTM/A.

The VMM2XUPD.EXE update addresses the following issue:

Q179897 - Memory Management Problems with Pentium Processors

You have successfully completed all steps.

Install the drivers for your hardware and your programs.

Have Fun!

-----------------------------------

KNOWN ISSUES:

1. If you plan to install the Microsoft USB Supplement to Windows

95 OSR2 (USBSUPP.EXE), be aware that this update will sometimes

overwrite the file C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\VMM32\NTKERN.VXD without

prompting you to keep the newer file already installed by this

patch. If this occurs, the following error will be displayed:

While initializing device NTKERN:

Windows Protection Error. You need to restart your computer.

This can be corrected by recopying the NTKERN.VXD contained in

this patch to your system.

-----------------------------------

LEGAL INFO:

THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED FREE OF CHARGE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTIES

OR GUARANTEES.

BY USING THIS SOFTWARE, YOU AGREE THAT YOU USE IT AT YOUR OWN RISK AND

OF YOUR OWN FREE WILL.

THE AUTHOR(S) OF THIS SOFTWARE SHALL NOT BE HELD LIABLE FOR ANYTHING

RESULTING FROM THE USE OR MISUSE OF THIS SOFTWARE.

IF YOU MODIFY THIS SOFTWARE, PLEASE REMEMBER TO CREDIT THE ORIGINAL

AUTHOR(S) FOR THE ORIGINAL CONCEPT(S).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

This software brought to you by Conner McCoy (LoneCrusader) with

assistance from Rudolph Loew (rloew).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

***UPDATE 12-18-2010***

Slipstreaming instructions added Here.

Microsoft issued a Hotfix for this problem in Windows 98 FE. It contains an updated version of NDIS.VXD

that only works in 98. Apparently they forgot (intentionally? ) or never realized that the

updated version of NDIS.VXD in the DUN14-95 update solves this problem as well.

Of course this isn't going to do you much good if Windows 95 drivers do not exist for your hardware. If

you have version 3.40.1001 of the Intel Chipset INF Installation Utility, it still contains 95 Drivers

covering the 845 chipset, which I know was used on motherboards supporting up to 3.06GHz processors.

The system used for this test:

--------------------------------------

Motherboard: Soyo SY-P4I845PE

Processor: 3.06GHz Intel Pentium 4 w/ Hyper Threading

Memory: 512MB Kingston DDR 333

Video Card: ATI Radeon 8500 LE 128MB

Audio & LAN: Onboard

[Windows 95C OSR 2.5 MSBATCH.INF]

Maybe the problem derives by using the win98 tool to create a win95 file?

I actually assumed this would be an issue from the start. So while I created the initial file with 98, I hand-edited it for 95 and ME. The main differences are the Optional Components, and 95 uses "ProductID" instead of "ProductKey."

I ran the 95 version of BATCH, and it created a file named BSETUP.INF which SHOULD have worked, but it doesn't, even when called specifically as an option. ( SETUP -s BSETUP.INF ) The 95 Setup program crashes with an error saying "Unable to find section" or something like that. I looked over the contents of the file, and it seemed to contain everything that was relevant.

I actually had already checked out those pages except for the netsetup one, Ill have to look into it.

[Windows 95C OSR 2.5 MSBATCH.INF]

I'm no expert at this, but did you edit layout.inf to reflect the correct file size of msbatch.inf?

If I remember correctly, the Windows 95 setups will reject any setup information file as corrupt if it's actual file size did not match what was stated in layout.inf.

I extracted layout.inf from precopy2.cab and took a look at it, there is no listing in it for msbatch.inf. Some Google searches regarding this returned a lot of irrelevant data, mostly dealing with using a 95B/C disk to upgrade 95A. Do you remember how it was supposed to be referenced?

I have noticed a small inconsistency between the sample .inf files provided on the 95 CD (95 Resource Kit) and the msbatch.inf that I generated with Batch98 (on the 98SE CD, which worked for 98/ME). I've not had time to investigate further, but Ill post the results as soon as I can.

A bit off topic, but for the record, I once managed to get 95 running on a 3.06 GHz P4 machine. Used the AMDK6UPD patch to get by the 350MHz+ processor bug, and then deleting 2 files will get you around the 2.1 GHz processor limit that's referenced at the Microsoft KB. I haven't played around with it in a long time, I might have to try it again just for the heck of it.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

@rloew, jaclaz, dencorso:

Are there any more tests that we need to run on the 8GB drive, or any other information to be gathered from it for future reference?

If not, I think I will repartition and reformat it using the method that dencorso suggested, I prefer the idea of having a DOS type boot sector instead of a NTLDR one, and this will hopefully also correct the odd CHS/LBA values. I've Hex-Edited maybe 2 files, so I don't quite trust myself yet to try fixing the partition that way.

IMHO, Considering the odd partition values exhibited by both of my Kingstons, I believe that we should recommend repartitioning & reformatting new flash drives somewhere in the threads dealing with NUSB and/or other USB driver stacks. I know this is not really an option for those who already have data on their flash drives, but it might save some people with new ones from the problems that have been documented here. What are your thoughts?

[Guide to running Me above RAM memory limit?]

Having stumbled upon this forum & specifically this thread:

Day-to-day running Win 9x/ME...

Is there a "How-to" guide to doing this somewhere? I've searched & cannot find one. And is this something a semi-novice can do (safely!) ?

I've been crawling along w/ 384MB of RAM & it's driving me nuts lately.

Thanks

If you don't mind spending $20, I recommend RLoew's patch. I've been using it for over a year now, never had the first single problem with it.

Supposedly there are other ways of doing it, and others on this forum apparently have done so, but I never managed to get any of them to work.

Good to see another 9X/ME user

[Windows 95C OSR 2.5 MSBATCH.INF]

if u have windows 98 why bother with windows 95 man? Windows 98 beta was much better than crappy '95

You can't be serious.

First, if you didn't have some information relevant to my question, why did you post in my thread?

Second, Windows 95 is not and never has been "crappy." 95C is so far ahead of 98FE it's not even funny.

Third, whether you or the idiots at Microsoft like it or not, Windows 95 put Microsoft at the top of the OS market. They owe a lot of the success they have to the Windows 9X family. They'd like to forget that Windows 95/98/ME ever existed, because they were more popular and generated more success for them than their pet Windows NT.

Windows 95, like it or not, is a very important piece of computer history, and deserves a LOT of respect.

So, unless you have some information relevant to my question, blunder back to the XP\Vista\7 forums.

[Windows 95C OSR 2.5 MSBATCH.INF]

Ive been trying to make a MSBATCH.INF file for Win 95C OSR 2.5, and not having any luck. I have successfully created them for 98SE and ME, but Win95 setup seems to completely ignore my file.

I've read the articles in the Microsoft TechNet Library on automating Windows 95 installs, searched several pages on the net, and I searched 25+ pages deep in these forums for msbatch.inf "Windows 95"

So I thought I would see if anyone here knows what the problem is, or has a working msbatch.inf for 95 that they wouldn't mind to let me take a look at.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

I accidentally gave the number of sectors in hex. It should have been 30784 or a little less than 16MB.

....

Try SCANDISK again. If you don't want to make changes, use "ignore" to go to the next step after each error.

Ran ScanDisk again, got same error, chose to Ignore. After that, ScanDisk finishes normally:

It seems that ScanDisk is seeing the correct amount of used space, however, the exact same incorrect value is still displayed in the "Properties" tab in Explorer.

Do you need me to image the first 16mb of the disk?

I can't advice to do that. See my exeperience at the beginning of this thread. Now I can't access my pendrive anymore !

Roger

Don't worry, the drive we're working on now is brand new and blank. This one's all for science, haha

So maybe we can get to the bottom of these bizarre flash drive errors. I'm beginning to think that the first thing to do after buying a new one is to repartition it and reformat it, so that way you know it will have "normal" settings

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

No, sorry! It was a good idea but didn't work quite right. I think you can do it easily with MBRFix.

Ok, how's this?

K8GB8192.7z

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

If you can grab 7840 Sectors starting from the MBR, you should have all of the relevant data.

Yes, please do it and attach it as a compressed archive. And since 7840 is almost 4 MiB, while you're at it, grab instead 8192 sectors, so that we can look a little beyond, just in case.

Partition Saving didn't let me choose a sector count, so I set the split file size to 4mb and stopped it after the first one. If this doesn't work, or isn't what you need, Ill try something different.

EDIT: Bad file removed.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

Ok, a couple of new developments.

I ran ScanDisk on the drive, and got this error:

I don't know what's with this image, it didn't look that way when I saved it

Test was run on another Win98 System, that's why the drive letter different in pic.

Since the error stated that the boot area was damaged or invalid, (and remembering what happened with the drive that started this thread), I canceled ScanDisk so we can investigate further before it gets modified.

I tried some of the tools jaclaz listed, I was able to make an image of the drive, broken into 1999MB blocks with Partition Saving. It should be noted that Roadkil's Diskimage cannot break the image up into <4GB parts, it appeared to run normally, and claimed the image was complete, but it only created a 3.99GB file and apparently did not realize it had stopped writing. Haven't done anything else with the images as yet.

As above, remembering the problems with the first drive, and the steps we took then, I put the drive back in XP and ran HDHacker on it. Here's the MBR and PBR output.

KDT8GB_MBRPBR.zip

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

Try repeating the two tests. Windows may have added a hidden file or folder in between the first two tests.

Checked them again, same result. I have both 98 and XP set to show all hidden/system files.

Also the numbers seem too perfect... 4096 and 8192...

I'm not up on this, but its almost like each OS is trying to use a different cluster size or sector size to read the filesystem.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

"Curioser and curioser", as Alice would put it!

... Knowledge is sure worth the wait

Yes. I plan to get to the bottom of this somehow, these things are driving me crazy.

(Off Topic Rant)

I've always hated USB devices. I used Windows 95 forever, and loved it, and I hated anything that would not work in it. My little Windows 95 desktop ran anything and everything I wanted it to back in the day. I once bought an external CD burner that connected to the parallel printer port to avoid having to upgrade to 98 to use a USB one. Haha!

Even after later having to upgrade to 98SE, I avoided buying ANY device that required USB up until about 8 months ago, when I discovered NUSB on here. And since then, with these weird problems, my opinion of USB devices has not improved much!

(/Off Topic Rant)

4) Can you create a full-disk,blind sector-by-sector image of it? As it's new, most of it probably is already zeroes, so it ought to compress nicely, for us to be able to peruse its internals... What imaging software do you have at hand? And, last, but not least, what, if any, hexeditor do you have at hand?

I've not done a lot of work with imaging other than what has been discussed here in the other threads. I'm all ears though. It might take me some time, just tell me what I need to do.

I have PowerQuest DriveImage 2002, and I'm most familiar with it. I also have Partimage which I have used a little. Beyond that, I have a Clonezilla CD somewhere that I haven't used. I'll have a look around and see if there's anything else I haven't thought of. If you guys need me to use a specific program for anything, just say so.

I have basically zero experience with Hex Editing. Not that I wouldn't like to learn. But I have UltraEdit-32 v11.20b and a very basic program called HexEdit on hand.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

Before anything, apply KB240075 UHCD.SYS hotfix ...

Did that back at the beginning of the thread.

I have version 4.10.2223 of UHCD.SYS. The drive is recognized properly - no yellow exclamations or anything. Just a different space count than XP.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

oh, oh....

blatant breaking of "Rules" #2 and, much worse, #4 detected :

jaclaz

Ok, Ok, I won't give up on it yet. Time to test other tools I suppose.

The good ol' way (DOS), though accessing USB through DOS ... in Win 98 SE with NUSB 3.3 providing the disk access.

I think I'll probably use this method whenever I've tried out some more of jaclaz's recovery tools.

Of course.. now I have another flash drive "problem" for you guys

Just bought a new pair of Kingston 8GB Data Travelers. Ive been using one of them in an XP environment at college with no data problems so far. I decided I would insert the other (still blank) one to have a look at it and make sure that it was recognized properly. It was, and it shows up in both 98 & XP. However.... I happened to notice that they show a different "Used space" count in their General Properties tab in each OS. (Screenshots below)

Could something like this be responsible for the problems that I had with the original 16GB drive? If so, what do I do to correct it before I lose more data?

[Cannot create a good disk image from a.gho file]

Well, I have been called names before, but it's the first time I've been tagged (indirectly) as "bizarre".

...

ME is ALWAYS in the trashbin .

BTW I agree on the ME thing, was just using it as an example.

4) Always visible boot partition

With System Commander whatever non-boot code is on the boot partition C: is (probably) always shared between all operating systems, even if they are on partitions hidden from each other. This shared boot drive might lead to some minor interference, but never posed a serious problem to me.

Example: One Windows (e.g. on E:) crashed or hung. Windows or an application in it then wrote some stuff on the boot drive C: or C:\Temp\ If I would then immediately boot into another similar Windows (e.g. on F:), that Windows or the same application in it would process the crash logs etc on boot drive C:

But this would happen also if Windows 1 and Windows 2 were installed on partitions hidden from each another.

If one created a special always visible boot partition for System Commander, (as you said^) this is completely true.

For the record though, you could have System Commander hide it's own partition whenever you choose one of your OS'es from the menu, thereby allowing each Windows to see its system partition as C: on boot. This would eliminate having to install System Commander to one of the Windows partitions (I know you mentioned you preferred installing from/to DOS) and also possibly eliminate some of the quirky errors/problems that have been mentioned about System Commander (especially when making backup images and/or cloning drives/partitions, because each Windows install would be "standard" so to speak). The only thing you would be giving up is one primary partition, which isn't a big issue if you're using several logicals.

[Cannot create a good disk image from a.gho file]

I do it too. I first setup my 4 HDD machine with the slave IDE as the boot device and true DOS 7.10 boots from its 1st (primary) partition, and lauches Win 98SE or GRUB4DOS. If GRUB4DOS is launched then it'll let me boot XP SP3, from the 1st (primary) partition of the master IDE ..... all partitions are FAT-32 and all OSses see every one of them. And no file from one OS is in the partiton belonging to the other, so even if I remove one of the bootable HDDs, the other continues able to boot as it is. In my eyes, its also quite straightforward...

But, in any case, as always, YMMV, of course!

Although arranged differently, your setup still retains (IMO) the most important things. No files from one OS in the partition of another, and each OS is independent and does not require another OS or the partition/boot sector thereof to run.

I prefer putting the systems in partitions in chronological order (except I would install ME before 2K), and I don't like giving in to 2K/XP demanding to take over the first primary partition, whether installed there or putting their boot files there. I guess I have a touch of OCD haha

[Cannot create a good disk image from a.gho file]

I'll be very interested to hear about your experience, especially if you restore from a disk image file..

Ok, I just successfully finished restoring my Windows 98 (w/ System Commander) partition to another hard drive with Partimage on the SystemRescueCD. While successful, it was a bit tricky. Here's the process and my results/conclusions:

1. I do not recommend the SystemRescueCD / Partimage method if you do not have some basic Linux experience, because you must be familiar with using the command line to mount the partition/device where your image is stored so that Partimage can see it.

2. Partimage was unable to see the HDD I was attempting to restore the image to until I created a partition on it - Partimage apparently does not restore to unallocated space like DriveImage. However, once I created a partition for it to restore to, the process started successfully.

3. During the process, Partimage displayed several CRC errors, but when told to continue anyway, it finished the operation.

4. Upon completion by Partimage, an error symbol was displayed beside the partition in GParted (Which I had used to create the blank partition to restore to.) I used GParted to scan the partition for errors, and to expand the file system to fit the partition (which was slightly larger than the original imaged partition.) This did not eliminate the error symbol, but I exited the SystemRescueCD and restarted with my System Commander CD.

5. Using the System Commander CD, I had to manually set the partition where the image was restored as active, and while there I used the Verify Partition tool, and it returned no errors. Upon reboot, the System Commander boot menu did not appear, but Windows 98 loaded normally.

6. Windows 98 functioned normally, however I had to reinstall System Commander. I told it to transfer the settings from the previous install to the new one, and upon reboot I got a notice about updating saved boot sectors. I clicked OK, and then everything was back to normal.

So the process was successful, but as you can see it was a little tricky and required some patience.

I don't know what went wrong. On my laptop I have a primary boot partition C:, and an extended partition which includes a logical partition for Win2k and another logical partition for WinXP, they are all visible and coexist nicely. ....

I must say that I find your system of allowing all the operating systems to see one another and having all these partitions visible at once very bizarre.

I begin to wonder if allowing all of these systems to see one another and access each other's partitions is not contributing in some way to the problems you were experiencing, i.e., back to what jaclaz was talking about with different programs making different assumptions, in this case different operating systems making different assumptions and possibly modifying the boot area of another OS's partition. Different versions of Windows do not play nicely together, each newer version assumes that it is better than an older version and will sometimes try to "improve" it.

For example, if you had a HDD with 2 primary partitions (1)C and (2)D, and you had Windows 98 installed on C, and then installed XP into D, allowing it to see Windows 98's partition as C, and to place its boot.ini, ntldr, and so forth in C, then it's possible that when you restore an image of C, the imaging program or System Commander may make the wrong assumptions about the operating system in that partition. The partition would contain the Windows 98 system, but have an XP style boot sector.

Here is a link to the best multibooting information resource I ever found on the net, and I use most of these principles in setting up my systems. Understanding Multibooting by Dan Goodell. And here is a quote from the Principles page of that site illustrating what I was saying above:

"...let's consider an example of installing Windows XP to a computer that already has Windows 98 installed. The computer already has an active boot partition (C:) that includes a Win98 partition boot sector and the Win98 system files. The XP-Setup routine copies the existing Win98 partition boot sector into a file, bootsect.dos, and replaces the partition boot sector with a XP version. The XP boot sector expects to find the XP startup files (ntldr, ntdetect.com and boot.ini) in the root directory of the same partition, so XP-Setup puts the startup files in C:\. Note this is the partition the Win98 system is already in, but it now has a XP boot sector and XP startup files. XP-Setup then installs the rest of the XP operating system itself to the new partition and giving it some other drive letter--let's say, D:, for example. Boot.ini will be configured with two entries, one for Win98 on C: and the other for WinXP on D:.

The C: partition will now have the Win98 startup files, the WinXP startup files, a XP boot sector, and a file (bootsect.dos) containing the old Win98 boot sector. The rest of the Win98 operating system is in a directory on the C: partition (usually C:\Windows), while the rest of the XP operating system is in D:\Windows. At boot time the MBR passes control to the partition boot sector--which, remember, is now a XP boot sector. Boot code in the XP boot sector takes control and a menu is displayed from boot.ini to choose which OS to continue booting: 98 or XP. If we choose XP, the XP boot files on C: load the XP operating system from drive D:. But if we choose 98, the XP boot files recall the 98 boot record from the saved file..."

IMHO, it is far far simpler to hide each system from one another and have a shared partition for data that does not contain an OS. If you need to work on the files of one system with another, you can always manually unhide the partition you need to work on from the OS you want to work with using System Commander. Make sure 98 is in the first partition and use 98 for this as it assigns drive letters on each boot and won't get confused like XP. If you don't like this, or need to work on 98 from another system, try using a Linux Live CD like Knoppix, or maybe even loading a system from a flash drive if that's your thing.

But it's whatever works for you.

[Boot Sector Problems When Creating Backup Image]

BTW, which version of System Commander are you using?

V 8.11

Up to now (5+ years) WinXP has never interfered with Win98 on my system, but again, I use WinXP not that much, maybe 10% of my time, for tasks which Win98 can't do.

Same here, I mainly only use XP for some games that require it.

Also posted a minute ago in your other thread.

____________________________________________________________________

EDIT 1-14-10:

Thanks to all those who replied to this thread.

I have determined that the problem seems to be something internal with DriveImage and not with the Windows XP partition. Successfully imaged the partition with another program. For reference, I will link to the related thread for the process I used.

[Cannot create a good disk image from a.gho file]

Most of this discussion has gone beyond my experience, however I believe jaclaz is on the right track when he said most of this problem is caused by the assumptions of all the different programs involved.

I saw that you tested Clonezilla, recommended in the other thread. If I remember correctly, I think it is based on Partimage, the program that I used on the SystemRescueCd to create images of my partitions. If I get an opportunity, I will try restoring my Windows 98 (System Commander) partition to another hard drive and see if it works.

Eventually I'll try to install Vista and Win7 again, but this time into LOGICAL FAT32 partitions on the 1st HDD. There is a good chance that System Commander, R.I.P., will be able to do it.

You probably saw where I mentioned this on the other thread, but the only problem that I ever had with System Commander was that it could not hide logical partitions from one another. I had a situation where I had an extended partition with two logicals in it, one for Win2K and the other for WinXP. System Commander was unable to hide the 1st logical partition from Windows XP, so XP assigned the Win2K partition drive letter C and then failed to finish booting. I solved this by using BootIt NG, which can hide logicals. I ended up with 24 operating systems on that machine

There seem to be a lot of bizarre problems mentioned here involving errors/quirks with System Commander. Other than the one mentioned above, I have never had a problem with it. However, I probably should note that I only use System Commander for three things:

1. To manually create & format partitions

2. To hide each OS from one another (at least during each install process, can always unhide later if necessary)

3. As a boot loader.

I do not use any of it's "wizards" etc. Using version 8.11.

[Can't read dvd drive in DOS mode]

When I restart in DOS mode I can't access dvd's in the dvd drive.

example:

dir g:

invalid drive specification

I ran an experiment and got the same result.

However, you do not need special software to read a DVD in DOS, everything you need is on the Windows 98 Boot Disk. I can use my Windows 98 Boot Disk, choose "Start computer with CDROM support," and whenever it loads the drivers I can read a DVD with no problems.

But I'm not sure how to get Windows to load the same things whenever you restart in DOS mode.

[Strange Problems with Pendrives]

Ok, time to return to this problem...

After losing power for 10 days throughout Christmas, and twice going through ~12GB of data recovered from the disk in search of less than ~10MB of data (including over 3,000 text files!)

PhotoRec managed to find most of the files that I needed back, but I lost my edited scripts for KDE and such. At least it recovered the graphics, text files can be rewritten.

I think I have recovered everything I can from the drive, so now it's time to repartition and reformat. jaclaz, I remember you posted a link earlier to some tools for achieving this, just wondered if anyone had a specific recommendation. I'd prefer something that runs in 98 if possible, but I can use XP if I must.

Also.. is there a way to do a thorough "test" on a flash drive? I took a look at some of the reviews on this drive at Newegg where I ordered it from, and it seems that this particular model of Data Traveler seems to have more problems than others. (I know reviews can be subjective, but it's got me wondering.)

@jaclaz

A special thanks for sending me to the PhotoRec/TestDisk site, because it's been more useful than I ever imagined (I think you saw my post in the Windows XP forum)