JorgeA

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/15/surface_lawsuit/ Get in on this, if you feel you were wronged. For some reason I feel it will be a very small class. Is that because there will be so many delighted Surface customers that few will want to sue, or because there'll be so few Surface buyers that there won't be all that many eligible to sue? --JorgeA

This is fantastic! It'll be interesting to see if other major PC manufacturers come out with their own versions of the Start Menu + Button. Anybody who has a non-HP computer and tries this one, let us know if it worked for you. --JorgeA

Steve Sinchak is a known quantity -- I have a book by him. This little service could be put to work together with his Start for Windows 8 button for a complete experience. Thanks very much for digging some more! --JorgeA

Wow, another great excuse to spend an afternoon not getting work done. Here's my favorite comment from that blog post: That'd be great -- it would complete the cleanout of the Three Stooges who gave us that Windows 8 abomination. --JorgeA

Good find, thanks very much. I'll add it to the list. --JorgeA

I, for one, don't mind these bunches of links as they neatly collect a ton of information. The least plausible-sounding theory for Sinofsky's departure is the one that has to do with his having finished a project and it being a good time to leave. Huh? Why would you want to leave just as your prescience and genius are about to be demonstrated (with explosive, worldwide Win8 acceptance)? Maybe going on a long relaxing vacation, but not quitting just BEFORE achieving the (presumed) vindication. It doesn't make sense to me. And, as they say, you can't argue with success. If Win8 sales were going through the roof, whatever internal opposition there might be to Sinofsky would hardly be in a position to speak up. So I'm betting on a mix of both internal politics and less-than-stellar early sales figures for Windows 8 and/or the Surface, where the latter weakened Sinofsky's standing and emboldened his opposition. --JorgeA

I'm with you on every count. Sales (or the lack thereof) are the ultimate judge and determinant. I am tempted to walk into a computer store, stand in front of the Windows 8 screens, and get big eyes of (mock) wonder and really loudly say something like, "Wow, I feel like I'm in kindergarten again!!" --JorgeA

I guess the problem is that there AREN'T all that many productivity tools for Metro (not yet, anyway). The idea of Metro isn't to make you more productive, it's to make it easier to waste your time monitoring the weather, following your friends on Facebook -- and shopping. But MagicAndre has discovered something that could really save Windows 8 from itself, if the productivity applications ever materialize. It'll be like Windows 2.0... ...only less flexible than Win2, as the tiles can't overlap. In that sense, Windows 8, once enhanced by Andre's "Toolbox," approaches Windows 1.0 in screen functionality. (Note BTW the remarkable similarity in the selection of certain applications to show on the images for the Toolbox and for Windows 2.0.) --JorgeA

OK, if there are no objections outstanding, then I'll put the Viva Start Menu on the list. --JorgeA

And that's the core problem -- the fact that something like that can be patented. --JorgeA

One down, two to go... --JorgeA

Here's a perceptive commentary on the idea that we are entering a "post-PC era" supposedly heralded by the rise of tablets: (Comment by "HydrantHunter") --JorgeA

I see in both of those EULAs, they are written by the same person! Why have competing products like that? I think what's happening is that both Win8 StartButton and the Viva Start Menu are based on Classic Shell by Ivo Beltchev. The EULA for the Win8 StartButton gives complete, unqualified credit to Ivo, while the EULA for the Viva Start Menu (see my reply to xpclient just above) says that "portions are created" by Ivo, which makes it sound like they took Classic Shell and then modified it in some way. The Win8 StartButton doesn't seem to offer anything new or different, so there's no reason to add it to the list. But for the Viva Start Menu, for the purposes of our thread the question becomes whether they modified it enough to warrant a listing of their own. --JorgeA

Then you haven't been customizing Classic Shell to see how much it can be customized. Anyways, here's the EULA for Viva and here's the one for Win8 Start Button. The Win8 StartButton that you linked to, doesn't appear to be the same product as the Win8StartButton that's on the list. Different website, different people (Torch Media vs. Quadsoft), different look, even a different language (!). There's just a slight difference in the spacing within the name. Given the outrages of Windows 8, I guess it was inevitable that we'd end up with a naming conflict like this sooner or later. There's only so many ways to refer to the same thing. I won't be listing Win8 StartButton, as it seems to be a straight, unmodified borrowing of Classic Shell, nothing new. What's different is that they package a browser and media player along with Classic Shell, but we're not interested in those applications here. Regarding the Viva Start Menu, the EULA says that ...which leaves open the possibility that they have "built upon" Classic Shell rather than adopting it intact like the Win8 StartButton folks apparently did. The question would then be, how much did they change it, and are the changes enough for us to be able to treat it as a different product? --JorgeA

Hmm, maybe you can add one of the many Start Menu+Button replacements to your service's "bag of tricks." --JorgeA

Hear, hear! Although, I'm a little more hopeful than that. It remains to be seen just how well Windows 8 sells, and how the broader computing public receives it. It's interesting that Hewlett-Packard, one of the biggest PC vendors, already felt compelled to announce that it would tolerate but not support UPgrades to Win7. --JorgeA P.S. I noticed the message in your signature. How can anybody do that in 2012? And wouldn't MSFT frown on it?

Thanks very much, we're taking a look. With your help and that of other MSFN members, we'll find out how many more there are! --JorgeA

I'm looking into this. Viva Start Menu: I dunno, to me it looks different enough from Classic Shell: Which "Win8 Start Button" do you have in mind? The one that we have listed doesn't look anything like Classic Shell: If you found a different one with the same name, can you post the link? Thanks! --JorgeA

And now for a post PRAISING Neowin for a good critique of Windows 8 usability: Editorial: Things that suck about Windows 8 on a desktop The writer begins (and ends) by establishing his bona fides as a Win8 fan, but the meat of the article consists of a detailed list of annoyances and frustrations with various functions and settings in the new OS, including (among other things) the app switcher, the search function, the Charms bar, and the tutorial. Well worth reading, especially for those who are on the fence thinking about buying Windows 8. (the caption reads: "Go ahead and try to do that...") I can think of two possible explanations for this head-scratcher, neither of which is very encouraging: it reveals either (1) incompetence, or (2) an intention/projection that real PCs will go away entirely and eventually the computing public will be left with nothing but toy devices. The OS is so bad that the writer felt compelled to add this at the end... ...but of course, for serious PC users it's very difficult not to bash Windows 8 for its annoyances and limitations. --JorgeA

Two additions to he list: RetroUI (thanks @CharlotteThe Harlot) and a Task Scheduler method to boot straight to the Desktop. --JorgeA

The puff pieces at Neowin continue: Windows 8 defeated 85% of malware out of the box The spin doctors hard at work. The piece misleads the casual reader into thinking that Windows 8 is somehow inherently more secure than Windows 7, when in fact what's happening is that Win8 comes with a full-featured antivirus program, whereas Win7 ships with only an anti-malware application. Tack full-featured AV to Win7, as MS could well do if it chose to, and you're good to go. In any case, as a Win8 purchaser you'd better think seriously about buying a real AV solution anyway -- MSE's 85% detection rate is pretty crummy these days; most reputable security suites will catch upwards of 95% of threats. So in that sense the inexpert user could be lulled into a false sense of safety, and come to regret it before long. --JorgeA

Done, thank you! Looks like a pretty strong, versatile candidate. OMG, what a horrible fate it was that the Start Menu managed to make it all the way to Win7!! What's the deal with these eStalins who can't bear the thought of us doing things OUR way -- don't they understand the concept of choice? --JorgeA

I noticed in ZDNet's Win8 security flaws post, that Of course this continues the campaign to get people off XP, but the way the post is written, it's not entirely clear whether the lack of a fix for IE8 will also apply to non-XP users. For example, me on Vista and IE8. Digging further, a check of the security bulletin indicates that the fix will not be offered for IE8. This s*cks. IE8 was the last browser version with a fully functional (informative) status bar, which sadly not even the Classic Shell folks have been able to restore completely. Not that Firefox is any better in that regard -- I kept version 3.6 until Norton stopped supporting it. The mind-boggling trend is toward giving the user LESS information. --JorgeA

I have to say, that's one impressive compilation you've put together there. It reminds me of the saying that expertise lies not necessarily so much in knowing information, as in knowing where to look for it. Wow. --JorgeA

Remember me to file this under "News" jaclaz LOL, I'm sure that if the sales figures were good he would have given them in the interview. --JorgeA