SMCorp

Thanks for the great replies, guys, and sorry for my absence. MSFN hasn't been e-mailing me replies even though the mailing address is correct and my replies are on. I just happened to check back to see why this was dead, but it was a hot topic and I appreciate it. Let me check my details and reply in detail shortly.

I've used Windows 98SE on most of my computers for 11 years but don't have any experience with the workarounds required to get 98SE installed on systems that won't work with it natively. When the installation blows up, I just abort. Before seeing this forum and similar pages in 2009, I didn't know it was possible to get around that. I paid more than $1K for an HP notebook 6 years ago, only to find that the XP Home it came with was all it would work with. The only option it had for installing software was the restore CDs, and they loaded it with the factory disk image plus all the Norton, etc. crapware/nagware. Even the XP Home OEM disk (that I think they were required by law to provide at the time) wouldn't work, because you'd have no drivers for the video, wireless G, USB, etc., etc., etc.. There was no driver CD and the online drivers were a tedious piecemeal business that still wouldn't get it 100%. It was a bummer, and since then I've stayed with sub-2ghz generic desktops and still get extremely fast performance and good security with 98SE. The problem today is with a Shuttle XPC that just came in. It is a Shuttle XPC model SN21G5 which has a 2.21ghz AMD Athlon and 2gb of RAM, and I installed a 40gb IDE HD, not attempting to use the SATA controller here. The Windows 98 installation blows up and won't continue. When it gets to around the 20 minute point in the countdown, it goes to restart itself, gets to the Windows 98 sky/clouds screen, then freezes up. After having read a lot of these nifty posts here, advising me that Windows 98 generally doesn't work with more than 1gb RAM or a CPU over 2ghz, I remembered it and removed one RAM stick to bring it back to 1gb RAM. It did exactly the same thing. Or so I thought. I noticed that the lower 1cm of the Windows 98 sky/clouds screen had that little moving band, which appeared to be frozen, but it was actually moving to the right very, very slowly. I decided to let it hang there for a few hours just to see if it timed out or what, but when I came back, I found the installation had completed successfully! It just took about two hours instead of 25 minutes. Then, I went back in and replaced the second 1gb of RAM, so that I could retry the Windows 98 installation with 2gb RAM on another 40gb IDE HD. Well, that was worse. It would get to the Windows protection error, and would keep powering off the computer. If I pulled that second RAM stick out, it would finish that bugged up installation without problems. With either drive, the same thing happens. They will both start up and appear to run normally, but it takes about 20 minutes to start the computer! It hangs on that Windows 98 sky/clouds screen for approximately 18 minutes each time. My questions for you guys: 1) What is the simplest hack to get around this, so it will start up in 1-2 minutes as it normally would? 2) Out of curiosity, what is it doing in that 18 minutes hanging on the Windows 98 sky/clouds screen? Except for the 2000 version of Apple OSX which would seem to hang and freeze for several minutes on startup, I have no experience with computers that appear to crash but actually come out of it. It sort of defies logic that a computer could spend 20 minutes on a 20 second process. Thanks for the help.

Tihiy, thanks for the reply. The subject title here is wrong, KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1 was a total waste, and I did a clean install on a fresh drive with KernelEx 4.0 Final2. It had most of the same problems, and that is what this string describes. What is the full name of the software version you are talking about and where do I get it? Thanks.

Anyone? Anything?

A postnote: Just for fun, before wiping this burner drive, I installed FF 3.6 on top of the existing 3. There was no change at all, same problems.

Okay, I just used the KernelEx final 2 with Firefox 3. It is the same as the last with 3.5.7: Photoshop 5.0 works and I can scan. I tested Firefox 3 by itself, and it seemed to be working fine and have my profile and all that. I then opened Thunderbird and tried to click hyperlinks in various messages, no good, they don't link me to anything. I then went through some folders, and clicked on various .html documents I have, no good, they won't open. I can click on a Wordpad file and open that, or click a .jpg and see it in ACDSee, but the computer is broken for .html file linking. In this regard, it is exactly the same as KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1. The only difference I noticed this time, maybe I didn't acknowledge it the last time, is that when I first started FF 3, it said it was not my default browser and asked if I wanted it to be. I clicked yes, browsed, and restarted the PC. I opened FF 3 again, and it asked me the same thing. That time I said yes, but I unchecked the box to ask every time. Also, I was unable to click the dropdown history urls from this msfn forum, but that might be a forum problem. So, suffice to say, this is a KernelEx problem, not a Firefox problem, other than that I am using FF 3 on an unsupported system (98SE). The KernelEx community needs to stop denying this problem. I have trebly confirmed it with multiple hard drives and various versions of Firefox from the oldest non-98 version (FF 3) to the newest non-98 version (3.5.7 and also 3.6). Can someone let me know when this is fixed? I am using a browser that is a year old, and it crashes like crazy on all the junk code on CNN and all video and social networking sites. Thank you.

Hi loblo, thanks for the input. Sorry to take so long, but I had some hosting problems to deal with. You had said: What you should do next is fix it. Do you have a registry backup prior to the problem occuring (in the C:/Windows/SYSBCKUP folder)? I can't do that at the moment, as my drive was totally screwed, it doesn't even boot up right without "fixing" a whole bunch of registry errors it finds. I cloned my current drive twice today (one to save as a backup and one to use as a burner drive to try KernelEx a third time). One time I had major data loss after a Firefox upgrade. I had skipped a few upgrades (in fear they would suck and a lot of them had), then upgraded 3-4 versions in one leap, and the guys on the Mozillazine forum criticized me for not backing up my profile first, and for making such a big upgrade in one step. With that in mind, I must consider the possibility that this upgrade from Firefox 2.0.0.20 to 3.5.7 is too great a jump, jumping 25 versions in one throw, and that this alone would cause problems. So, I am going to take my fresh clone, add KernelEx, version 4.0 Final2, and do the smallest Firefox upgrade possible, from Firefox 2.0.0.20 to the very next one, Firefox 3.5.7. Then I will report back. One other note, you had said: It's not KernelEx who broke your html file associations and default browser integration. You certainly did it messing with installing Firefox 3.5. That is possibly true, but that wouldn't be my first guess. I have used many browsers in 11 years (Netscape, IE, Opera, Fastbrowser, Firebird, Mozilla Suite, Sea Monkey, not to mention more for Macs), and have never, ever had a problem where the PC doesn't know what the default browser is, and this is the only time I have ever seen an .html file that won't open. I've been through dozens of Firefox updates without that. Since KernelEx is major brain surgery that I have seen to cause massive problems throughout the computing universe, I have to suspect this early version of KernelEx as the likely culprit. I lost a day and a half of company time trying to rebuild my data onto an earlier backup clone hard drive after KernelEx wrecked the test drive. I understand this is the nature of such an adventurous software project that aims to make the impossible possible, but I also have to have some sense and do this with a burner clone drive when I can, seeing as how I have already seen KernelEx destroy two drives before my own eyes.

Hi, I got my drives cloned so I could have a burner drive here to test again. And burned it did... First, a possibly relevant side note. I'm not sure how you are tracking bugs in this project. On 1/22/2010, you said, " I have tested Photoshop 5.0 and didn't find any problems with it and KernelEx 4.5. Could be your/98 system specific.", but 22 hours later you said, "This bug was reproduced and will be fixed in 4.5 beta 2." That's a pretty big leap from it works to we're going to fix it. Starting with a working 98SE drive with all my stuff that has never had any trace of Firefox 3.5.7 or KernelEx on it, I went ahead and installed the older version of KernelEx, version 4.0 Final2. I then downloaded and installed Firefox 3.5.7, and followed the prompt to install a newer Fireftp. I tested Firefox 3.5.7 by itself, and it seemed to be working fine and have my profile and all that. I then opened Thunderbird and tried to click hyperlinks in various messages, no good, they don't link me to anything. The first try makes the cursor spin a bit like it is processing something, but it never does anything. I then went through some folders, and clicked on various .html documents I have, no good, they won't open. I can click on a Wordpad file and open that, or click a .jpg and see it in ACDSee, but the computer is broken for .html file linking. In this regard, it is exactly the same as KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1. I then went to scan a document in Photoshop 5.0, and it worked fine. It did not crash when opening as before. In summation, the Photoshop problem is limited to KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1 and is not in the older version. The problem with hyperlinking between folders and applications is present in both. What should I try next? I can save this burner drive for a few days in case you have a fix for it, but I will return to my original drive to work with for now.

Thanks for the reply. I'm not sure what you mean by "this bug" (the one that blows up my computer, killing Photoshop and the ability to open .html files?). What's my next move? Installing the older version you suggested? Or waiting for the next one you are talking about? Thanks.

Hi, I have Dr. Watson running in the lower right corner, but clicking Dr. Watson, file, save, doesn't offer me text. Sorry, I have no prior experience. Isn't there anything a little more direct that can list the programs? If not, please explain how to get this text list. Thanks.

No, I didn't even attempt to downgrade, I learned ten years ago that doing that on any program can wreck your hard drive. What I did was go back to my last clone backup drive from 18 hours before, then copy over all the stuff that had changed, like documents and sent/received mail. It was less than 2gb, but even that was very hard to do, as KernelEx had screwed up the hard drive with registry errors and everything else so badly that it would fail on most any operation. Now I am back to FF 2.0.0.20 and no KernelEx, and neither KernelEx nor Firefox 3 have ever been on this drive. To list programs, how do I do it? I just downloaded or ran two programs I'd never heard of (Autoruns and Dr. Watson), and neither has shown me an obvious way to do this. Is there a quick way?

Thanks for the reply, Tihiy. A few quick questions: 1) Try removing KernelEx 4.5 and installing 4.0 Final 2. Okay, I can do that, that was my last ditch plan for the next time I was to try this. I have spent a half a day repairing my data back to what it was with Firefox 2.0.0.20, I will clone that drive and use that for the experiment. Unfortunately, that is what I did the first time, when I was just testing it, but "just testing it" I didn't want to change any documents or download any mail, that is how I never found the problems in my test, browsing was great on Firefox 3.5.7, just a little slower. 2) Remove Norton/Symantec apps. Swear to god I don't have any. Norton 2005 was my last one, it was almost as bad as this bad trip with KernelEx. Consider Norton permanently uninstalled. I presently have a hopelessly out of date AVG Free, which was great until they kicked 98SE users to the curb. Was going to switch to Avast! but haven't because I didn't have time to risk my data. List other resident apps you have. Is there an expedient way to do this, by cutting and pasting from somewhere? 3) If you want proper shell integration, you need to install Firefox 2, Already had it, 2.0.0.20. make it default Always was for five years. and then upgrade it. Not sure about that. I just downloaded 3.5.7 and clicked install. I already had 2 and didn't remove it first or anything. Was this correct? Also, can you try Photoshop 5.0 in windows safe mode? Not sure. I know how to boot in safe mode by holding CNTRL or tapping F8. Do I do that until it shows safe mode in crappy 640 x 480 8-bit video, then just click the icon to start photoshop? Let me know so I am clear, and I'll get right to it. Thanks.

Hi, I am a new user of KernelEx. I am using 98SE, Firefox 3.5.7, and KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1. It has two problems so far. 1) The main problem is that it has broken a program that was already running on 98SE, Adobe Photoshop 5.0. After using this for a day, I went to scan a document and when I opened Photoshop, it immediately blew up with an illegal operation: PHOTOSHP caused an invalid page fault in module PHOTOSHP.EXE at 01a7:0076fb80. Registers: EAX=80040154 CS=01a7 EIP=0076fb80 EFLGS=00010282 EBX=00000000 SS=01af ESP=00cdd970 EBP=00cddcc8 ECX=00cddcc4 DS=01af ESI=00cde00c FS=64ef EDX=00000000 ES=01af EDI=bff772f8 GS=0000 Bytes at CS:EIP: 8b 02 8b 4d fc 51 ff 50 08 8b 45 f8 8b e5 5d c3 Stack dump: 505c302e 4f544f48 2e313053 004c4c44 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 I restarted, no good, uninstalled and reinstalled, same thing. It won't work. I did some research and found the compatibility tab for Photoshop.exe, nothing was checked, I checked "Disable KernelEx extensions", same thing. I unchecked it, same thing. I checked to "Use specific compatibility mode: Windows 98 SE", same thing. I also set it to "Windows XP SP2", same thing. It blows up no matter what so I can't edit photos or use my scanner. 2) The second problem is that the hyperlinks from my mail browser are broken. Please read my thread on that in the Mozilla forum and reply to it there if you have suggestions. It is "Clicked Thunderbird links open in IE, not Firefox 3.5.7": http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.ph...8&t=1705495 Please help, I am stuck with a useless computer and will have to rebuild my drive to another drive with Firefox 2.0.0.20 and ditch KernelEx for now, at least until it works with the main application that people would use it for (Firefox 3). Thank you.

(Note that I have updated and edited this post.) Hi, I am a new user of KernelEx. I am using 98SE, Firefox 3.5.7, and KernelEx 4.5 Beta 1. It has three problems so far. 1) The main problem is that it has broken a program that was already running on 98SE, Adobe Photoshop 5.0. After using this for a day, I went to scan a document and when I opened Photoshop, it immediately blew up with an illegal operation: PHOTOSHP caused an invalid page fault in module PHOTOSHP.EXE at 01a7:0076fb80. Registers: EAX=80040154 CS=01a7 EIP=0076fb80 EFLGS=00010282 EBX=00000000 SS=01af ESP=00cdd970 EBP=00cddcc8 ECX=00cddcc4 DS=01af ESI=00cde00c FS=64ef EDX=00000000 ES=01af EDI=bff772f8 GS=0000 Bytes at CS:EIP: 8b 02 8b 4d fc 51 ff 50 08 8b 45 f8 8b e5 5d c3 Stack dump: 505c302e 4f544f48 2e313053 004c4c44 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 I restarted, no good, uninstalled and reinstalled, same thing. It won't work. I did some research and found the compatibility tab for Photoshop.exe, nothing was checked, I checked "Disable KernelEx extensions", same thing. I unchecked it, same thing. I checked to "Use specific compatibility mode: Windows 98 SE", same thing. I also set it to "Windows XP SP2", same thing. It blows up no matter what so I can't edit photos or use my scanner. 2) The second problem I noticed is that the hyperlinks from my mail browser are broken. Please read my thread on that in the Mozilla forum and reply to it there if you have suggestions. It is "Clicked Thunderbird links open in IE, not Firefox 3.5.7": http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.ph...8&t=1705495 3) The third problem is just that the computer is broken. It isn't just hyperlinks, but if I click on an .html file on my local box, instead of opening it in Firefox, it doesn't do anything. I can not open an .html file without opening a new Firefox window first, then using the file menu>Open File to open it.