Win2003 RIS installing WinXP SP2

[verneir]

I've read through a lot of information at http://unattended.msfn.org/unattended.xp/ as well as in a book I purchased: "Managing Microsoft's Remote Installation Services" and I have a few questions before I even really get started.

1) Why edit images on the RIS server? Why not just create your own custom Windows installation source BEFORE creating a RIS "image" from it? I understand the use of editing after the fact as the hardware changes.

2) Why use the $OEM folder to include drivers or anything for that matter? Why not just include your drivers in the same location where Microsoft puts the drivers they include with Windows to begin with, replacing as necessary? Would this not circumvent the issue of copying unnecessary data to the client machines?

3) If you RipPrep an installed machine, is the result an 'image' in the same sense as Ghost for example? Meaning, is it a sector imaging technology and will this ripprepped image install in minutes just like my Ghost images?

4) Is it really true that you can not install and/or use RIS on a multi-home machine? What if I just disable the second NIC, will that work?

5) As this book I have describes the "one-images-fits-all" logitistal approach meaning they suggest creating subfolders underneath $OEM within the WinXP source, but instead of creating subfolders for each machine type instead just create them for each hardware type: i.e. SoundBlaster Live!, SoundBlaster AWE64, etc. That would be opposed to creating folders for an HP NC6230 and an HP NC6000 with all their drivers underneath each respective subfolder, thereby potentially creating a lot of duplicate files and even more unnecessary data. So my question: don't some drivers provided by OEMs differ from those Microsoft makes available or even the hardware manufacturer itself? For example if you buy an HP machine with an ATI video card HP may potentially have a different driver than that which you would download directlry from ATI or from Windows Update. Therefore, wouldn't it be a really BAD idea to just dump drivers into general folders for "Audio" even if it is more specific like "SoundBlaster" or "Sound Blaster Live!"? I've personally witnessed on a few occassions where drivers from MS DID NOT work for NICs, but the OEM driver worked just fine. It is rare in my experience, but it does happen.

6) Does the SIS Groveler even work? Taking into account point 2 and 5 above I don't understand what the big deal is if Groveler actually works. If it works it is supposed to generate single software instances. Am I misunderstanding something? We're not supposed to install RIS images to a partition with any other data because the SIS Groveler may cause problems as a result of the way it works. Well, I have it running on a file server with hundreds of gigs of data and I don't see a problem. Is groveler even doing anything?

Edited April 25, 2006 by verneir

[cluberti]

1) Why edit images on the RIS server? Why not just create your own custom Windows installation source BEFORE creating a RIS "image" from it? I understand the use of editing after the fact as the hardware changes.

It depends on the type of install, as there are two - one is risetup, which is the "flat-file" type install, and is NOT an image. This you can modify at any time (and sometimes should, to add drivers, scripts, etc to your RIS install). The second is a riprep image, and once made, you really can't modify it (it is an image, after all, in the true sense of the word). Watch out for definitions in RIS - a risetup "image" isn't an image at all, but a riprep image is.

2) Why use the $OEM folder to include drivers or anything for that matter? Why not just include your drivers in the same location where Microsoft puts the drivers they include with Windows to begin with, replacing as necessary? Would this not circumvent the issue of copying unnecessary data to the client machines?

Because technically, this is unsupported. Yes, you can do it, but there is a supported (and well-documented) method - the $OEM$ folder. Why reinvent the wheel, when there are no obvious benefits?

3) If you RipPrep an installed machine, is the result an 'image' in the same sense as Ghost for example? Meaning, is it a sector imaging technology and will this ripprepped image install in minutes just like my Ghost images?

It's not quite the same as a sector copy ala Ghost, but it is a snapshot image in that vein, and has the same benefits and drawbacks as a Ghost image.

4) Is it really true that you can not install and/or use RIS on a multi-home machine? What if I just disable the second NIC, will that work?

RIS can be made to work on a multi-homed machine, but it can be a bit of a PITA. Disabling the second NIC, or using NIC Teaming (if your hardware and network devices support it) is a better option than fighting the multi-homed battle with RIS.

5) As this book I have describes the "one-images-fits-all" logitistal approach meaning they suggest creating subfolders underneath $OEM within the WinXP source, but instead of creating subfolders for each machine type instead just create them for each hardware type: i.e. SoundBlaster Live!, SoundBlaster AWE64, etc. That would be opposed to creating folders for an HP NC6230 and an HP NC6000 with all their drivers underneath each respective subfolder, thereby potentially creating a lot of duplicate files and even more unnecessary data. So my question: don't some drivers provided by OEMs differ from those Microsoft makes available or even the hardware manufacturer itself? For example if you buy an HP machine with an ATI video card HP may potentially have a different driver than that which you would download directlry from ATI or from Windows Update. Therefore, wouldn't it be a really BAD idea to just dump drivers into general folders for "Audio" even if it is more specific like "SoundBlaster" or "Sound Blaster Live!"? I've personally witnessed on a few occassions where drivers from MS DID NOT work for NICs, but the OEM driver worked just fine. It is rare in my experience, but it does happen.

To answer your question, this is where multiple flat-file images, or intelligent scripts to copy the "right" drivers from the installation source come in handy. Either works, with the former being easier but more disk-consuming, and the latter being more difficult but with the "cleaner" filesystem benefits. As to hardware vendor devices working with only vendor drivers and not proper inbox drivers, that's usually the case when the hardware vendor doesn't follow the device manufacturer's reference design, meaning their drivers will be the only ones that'll work properly with the "modified" hardware.

6) Does the SIS Groveler even work? Taking into account point 2 and 5 above I don't understand what the big deal is if Groveler actually works. If it works it is supposed to generate single software instances. Am I misunderstanding something? We're not supposed to install RIS images to a partition with any other data because the SIS Groveler may cause problems as a result of the way it works. Well, I have it running on a file server with hundreds of gigs of data and I don't see a problem. Is groveler even doing anything?

Yes, it works, but you have to understand it's purpose before you understand how it works. It's really only for drives with multiple riprep or risetup images, meaning lots and lots of similar files. If disk space begins to get low, the groveler service starts to make file links to one particular of the similar files, and then links all other of the same file to that original file rather than having multiple versions of the same file in multiple location (it'll look like all those other files exist, but they'll really just be links to one file). However, you won't really see any benefits of this service unless you start to consume serious disk space, due to the nature of the groveler.

You might want to troll around the unattended setup and unattended RIS setup forums for more information, rather than the XP forum.

[verneir]

Okay thanks. I still have some questions and apparently I didn't look at the forum names very well because I didn't even realize there was an unattended forum. Wasn't sure to post in XP or Win2003 for this.

Thanks!

-Vern