Windows 98se reinstall

[Eck]

Hey, eidenk!

Heh, you remind me of my days hanging out at a bar with close friends. Brutally honest exchanges can occur. Quite fun (unless drunk to the point of stupidity). Say something that isn't quite kosher and one of the guys will call you on it.

Yep. I'm a bit inconsistent in my poordum (guess that's not a word but appropriate). Got lot's of time to explain. I've got no justification for spending money on computer parts and software, at least none that says I've acted in a financially responsible way. My justification is just to excuse myself by telling myself that's all I've got. So I'll squeeze a bit here and there to get most of what I want done happening.

I do this in cost cutting ways though. My hardware is never state of the art for this moment. I do wait until so many things in a system that is based upon discontinued stuff have worn out before deciding not to replace the individual components as the cost/value wouldn't jive.

My day to day system is always built from the technology that is being sold at going out of business prices because folks have moved on to newer and better things. My building a Socket A board when it was getting hard to find the parts is an example. The advantage, besides saving money, is that the bugs have been worked out and if something is able to be fixed it already has been. Just install the latest Bios, drivers, software for it and it all will work without waiting for new problems to be fixed.

Since I've got so much software already, just major stuff needs an upgrade occasionally in that department. No need to look for the latest recompilation of the same stuff I've already got. And we got to wait for, what, 6 years before the new Windows came out. Well, once in 6 years I can even financially justify purchasing a new Windows operating system.

So the hardware swapping I talk about is mostly just playing with installing different pieces of stuff I've gathered through the years. It's almost never something new I bought, just popping in a different piece of the puzzle that I might miss using. And the rest is only paper, blank cdr/dvdr and cd holders, and ink. Oh yeah, and internet access.

There you go! I might spend what I shouldn't but I do it with a plan. I'm quite satisfied with the performance of my probably 3 generations ago Socket A system. I'm not a fragger. I like older games and music and educational stuff. But occasionally I enjoy being wowed by cool looking desktop stuff, so Vista is nice. And Linux, with that Beryl desktop, is awesome too.

[Eck]

Evanhoe,

Yeah, I run on a bit. Didn't mean to complicate stuff for you. Just be sure to get your updates, fixes, etc installed by using your favorite package. I like the Unofficial Auto-Patcher for Windows 98SE but it's your choice.

98 First Edition had a known problem with some of the stuff you're mentioning appearing in System File Checker when they really had no problems. I don't recall whether Second Edition suffered a similar cosmetic defect.

If you got your system installed and you update it and all your stuff works, don't worry about it.

That other stuff I talked about was for problems that occured during Windows installation on certain systems. I wasn't sure from what you wrote whether you had these file problems hanging up startup or whether they were just reports by System File Checker. So I gave you more than you probably wanted to know!

Eidenk is one of the experienced guru's here, although I try to pitch in where I think I experienced something similar. Hopefully you can make good use of the knowledge so you can eliminate some of the bumpyness that Windows can give you occasionally.

[eidenk]

Eck, I certainly not deserve the label of guru which I believe some other desserve far more than I do. Thanks for the compliment anyway.

Maybe you are a better guru than me so I submit a little problem I have at the moment and that eludes me quite badly : The 3D Maze screensaver crashes in kernel32.dll. If I remove the space in it's name, it does not crash anymore. It should work the same whatever the name is. Any idea ?

Edited April 16, 2007 by eidenk

[Eck]

Hmm, well at least you got it to work. Does it come by default with a space in the filename? If so you'd think it would work as designed. We know 16 bit programs often balk at long file names or ones with spaces in them without that _ between the spaces.

9x is designed to get around that by detecting when quotation marks are needed around the filename, such as when there are spaces or the name is greater than the MS-DOS 8.3 filename design. In fact I think it actually includes two FAT's for files, one with long file names and the other with the same file with an 8.3 style MS-DOS file name.

Have you tried some other programs that have spaces in the filename recently?

Something else that could have occurred is if you applied one of the patches for Kernel32.dll that are unofficial fixes for certain 9x bugs. Perhaps the small change in the Kernel32.dll file unknowingly changed its behavior in more ways than was intended by the patch. One of LLXX's patches used to get rid of the nice GUI button effect on the Close Program box's buttons. After using her patch the buttons would be the flat Windows 3.1 style. When I asked about it she said she built that into the patch because she preferred that button appearance. Not me though, so I used the MDGx version from that anonymous author instead. It's unlikely that anyone would purposely mess with filename handling, to the point of partially breaking it, though.

Another thing to make sure of is that no nasties invaded either that screensaver file (they love screensaver files) or that Kernel32.dll file, so a virus scanner check on those files and a scan for virus's and another one for spyware on the whole system wouldn't hurt, just to be sure it's nothing like that going on.

[eidenk]

I think I found out what the problem is : This file apparently uses opengl when it has it's original filename and does not use opengl when it has another filename. This I observed by loading this screensaver in an application that runs screensavers in a window and looking at the loaded modules with a process viewer. When it has it's original filename (with a space) it loads the opengl subsystem and crash. When the filename is modified it does not load opengl and does not crash. It turns out that all the third party opengl screensavers I have are also crashing, but those ones whatever the filename is.

As for why my opengl ss are all crashing, it is probably because there is an incompatibility with the Universal Adobe Postscript Printer driver I have recently installed. According to Dr Watson, this driver patches GDI.exe in memory. I still have to uninstall this driver to confirm that.

I have no unofficial patches installed besides LLXX's esdi_506.pdr.

Edited April 17, 2007 by eidenk

[Eck]

I guess that some checking of Adobe Postscript problems with OpenGL would be helpful then. Maybe there's a way to work around the problem without needing to stop using the Postscript driver.

It's interesting that the name of the screensaver itself effects whether its OpenGL properties are invoked.

No other unofficial patches? Wow. So you just use official updates then? What about the ones that were found to not install correctly and so not have the effect intended? Weren't a great deal of these fixed by unofficial versions of the Windows Updates? And what do you do with updates that occurred after Microsoft stopped doing 9x versions and have been patched with unofficial installers to work with 9x? That's certainly a different approach than what I've seen from most folks around here.

[eidenk]

Not sure it is the Adobe Type Manager the problem, but I don't see what else it could be. I haven't tried to remove it yet. If it's that, no one is going to fix it I guess. And not sure it would happen on any system as the video drivers might also come into the mix, nvopengl (nVidia) being also loaded.

As for the screensaver itself, using or not using opengl, depending on how it is named, it has been quite a surprise. I guess the ss checks it's own name before choosing a rendering mode.

When I said unofficial patches I meant patched files, not updated files gathered in official updates for other oses, etc... and put together by MDGx or others. Those ones I install most if not all of them.

And, like many I think, I don't run KB891711 nor any of its unofficial variants. Maybe that's as risky as having casual sex with total strangers without a condom. Anyway no browser or operating system is immune from a nasty zero day exploit, so...

I had ShellMe by anonymous but I removed it because, albeit it protects from the explorer copy freeze in most circumstances, it appears it has some side effects I do not like.

[Eck]

Ah! That I can understand. Heh, nice 891711 analogy. Sheesh, when I was growing up we didn't need those yucky things anyway. Well, not if the other party took care of things anyway.

I used to use the Adobe Photo Deluxe 2.0 which also installed that Adobe Type Manager. I do remember some unwanted effects which caused me to use other programs instead. I just don't remember what the unwanted effects were.

[eidenk]

I have looked much more thoroughly in the screensaveer prob I have and I correct errors in reporting :

Opengl screensavers are using opengl whether they crash or not. (I must have compared the container application with the screensaver by mistake in my first test)

All opengl screensavers I have tested are affected similarly.

They crash according to the length of their name/path.

Example : If I put an opengl screensaver in the root drive and give it a name of 1 or 2 characters long it does not crash. It then crashes if it has a name that is 3 or 4 characters long. Does not crash if the name is 5 or 6 characters long. Crashes if the name is 7 or 8 characters long. Does not crash if the name is 9 or 10 characters long. Crashes if the name is 11 or 12 characters long. Etc... along that progression.

The Adobe Type Manager has nothing to do with the problem as I have uninstalled it and the problem persist.

Dr Watson crash logs seem to indicate it is nvopengl that could be responsible. (I have the latest nVidia display drivers which have been reinstalled)

No application using opengl seems affected besides screensavers.

Anyway any opengl ss that crashes on me can be fixed by either adding or removing 1 or 2 characters from it's name so that it falls at a proper place in the above progression.

Sorry Evanhoe to go off-topic in your thread.

Edited April 18, 2007 by eidenk

[Evanhoe]

Windows 98SE does not copy the install cabs on the HDD as far as I know (WinME does). They are on the Install CD (in the win98 folder on my 98SE CDs) but you can copy that folder onto your HDD if you want to.

The benefits of doing so are that you don't need the CD if you (or the system) want to extract a file from them and that a reinstall is much faster from the HDD than from the CD. Of course it uses some disk space.

As you've got NDN, you could use it now under windows for searching in which cab is this setupx.dll and extract it to the system dir with it.

Navigate with NDN to the directory where your install cabs are. Once you are there, use the search function : File/Find or alt+F7, fill the filemask field with the filename, tick the "search in archives" option, press enter and the file will soon be displayed if it is in one of the cabs. Then copy it wherever you want (File/Copy or F5).

Let me know if you have problems with that.

Hi eidenk,

It appears that I solved my original problems for now!!We'll see in the next few days,whether that's true or not!

I reinstalled Win 98 on top of itself and,then ran SFC again and,this time I was able to extract the missing/deleted files from the Win 98 OS disk! I could'nt believe it,so I ran SFC again and,it completed without any further problems.BTW I finally downloaded the"Autopatcher 98 v 1.95" it took 23 hours over a period of a few days.Now in order to update evrything with it,do I just pop it in the CD drive and,let it do it's thing or what? Thank you and Eck for all your help,I really appreciate it.

VAN

[eidenk]

Glad you got it right. Unfortunately I can't help with the autopatcher because I have never used it.

[Eck]

Pretty much you just run it. It extracts all its stuff to a folder that you can change to what you want during setup. I usually changed it to C:\AUTOPCH to make things easy. I never ran it from a cd, preferring to have it on the hard drive but since it places everything into that installation folder anyway it probably doesn't matter.

When you run it the first time it will probably warn you of needing dialup networking 1.4. I just choose the option it offers of installing it automatically and silently.

He has a lot of nice time savers toggled off by default. Therefore it is prudent to go through each screen and turn toggle on and change on or off the stuff you want.

Lately soporific has been mentioning that the 98SE2ME section install is likely the best fix in the package. Well, I use it too but choose to toggle it off in Auto-Patcher and install the full version myself afterwards. Same with the 98MP10 section. I just like to install stuff once, especially since unlike Auto-Patcher these programs do not check for previous installations of themselves and will just redo everything including the backup files. I just find it less confusing to install those two myself. If you do not own a Windows Me cd then you'd better keep 98SE2ME toggled on in Auto-Patcher so you get that important Explorer fix. You can't install the full 98SE2ME unless you have a Window Me cd in the first cdrom drive or the contents copied to a folder on your hard drive.

The stuff in the manual installs folder is important to install when you are finished. Just not the Dialup Networking 1.4 since you already had Auto-Patcher do that for you.

I've been toggling on the SHELL98 fix to stop slow copying, Explorer freezing but some have experienced undesirable effects from that so it's up to you. It's off by default. Like I said, I turn it on and haven't had problems from it.

I also turn on the stuff in the Windows Media section. I want the Legacy files (which is WMP7) and the WMEncoder 7.1 installed as I've found that some programs need WMEncoder and the only way it installs properly is if it is installed on top of WMP7 and before updating to WMP9. So I turn all that stuff on.

I do not turn on the majority of the Tweaks as these are mostly done for me by 98SE2ME. I do let it install TweakUI and the System Policy Editor unless I've already installed System Policy Editor myself through my full version of the Windows 98 Resource Kit. The important tweaks to do if you also do not want to use soporific's choices are adding the following to system.ini using sysedit.

Under VCACHE add

MaxFileCache=393216

Under 386Enhanced add

ConservativeSwapfileUsage=1

DMABufferSize=64

MinSPs=16

There is another addition added by the older Unofficial Service Pack and 98SE2ME but it is really for system with more than a gig of RAM. It sets Windows not to use more than that. With a gig or lower you're better off not messing with it.

It is advisable to use your System Properties advanced tab to set the same Virtual Memory for both min and max. I use 3X my amount of RAM for both. This moves the Swap file out of the Windows folder and onto the root of C: and also stops unnecessary hard drive thrashing and is especially useful if you have plenty of RAM (over 256MB). Slows fragmentation too.

Those are some of the things I do but the point is you're going to be easily able to keep 98 updated without tons of individual downloads and decisions about what to install when. Great program.

For further questions about it I'd use soporific's sticky thread for it though. This'll get you started.

[Evanhoe]

Glad you got it right. Unfortunately I can't help with the autopatcher because I have never used it.

Thanks eidenk,

I think eck has it pretty well covered!

VAN

[Evanhoe]

Man,ECK,

You must be some kind of professional typer/typist, to provide such detailed information!!If I tried to provide that kind of detailed information/tips,it would take me a day(Smile).I will keep and use the tips as required,and come back here as needed.Thank you very much.

VAN

[Eck]

Yeah, heh, I've gotten yelled at for being that detailed when asking for help. Especially when trying to lighten the heavy reading mood by adding in some unrelated personal rambling. I'm glad you got some info by reading it. No, it doesn't take me that long to organize my thoughts when writing. So, thankfully, it didn't take too long to type that out.

Nice complement there. I'm not professional. I tend to get up to professional caliber in my hobbies but never figure out ways to make money from it! Oh well.