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soporific

Auto-Patcher For Windows 98se (English)

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The patching goes through without a hitch... my problem is I need to know what updates increases the Windows version number to what values?

Or, if there is a way to force Windows to report a particular version number, I think this by itself may allow me to use all the updates without HPJOBBER having issues.

The updates work great, the problem is HPJOBBER doesn't want to work properly for some reason when 98 is fully patched.

Thank you for pointing out the list at the beginning, but I need to find out how those updates change the version reported.

It seems as though HPJOBBER will not work properly *at all* if certain updates are applied- at one point I saw that an update didn't change the first two sets of numbers- methinks those updates won't breake HPJOBBER... I was just hoping someone had a table or something with the version numbers being updated with whatever updates being applied...

I hope I have put this in a way that is properly understood... Sometimes I fumble with my words...

(I believe the errant program, HPJOBBER, is somehow hard coded to specific versions of files... but I don't have all the version info involved... got a list of this involved with the updates in Auto-Patcher?)

These computers **NEVER** go online. There is no internet connection even available on the site, so 'security updates' don't apply...

Thanks for the attempts at help, it is greatly appreciated... I just hope I can get the actual problem across... those are good shots, but not quite on target... take another step or two, that's where I hit a wall...

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No Microsoft Windows Updates change the version number of Windows with the exception of the long discontinued Microsoft Security Updates Cd. That did play havoc with some programs and some updates.

None of the unofficial updates included in the auto-patcher or the major unofficial update packages on this site such as 98SE2ME and 98MP10 change the Windows version either.

Now, dll file versions are something else entirely. Nearly ALL are changed when you apply the updates. For details you would consult the readme's for the assorted unofficial updaters, and the Microsoft KB articles for the cooresponding updates.

MDGx's website provides a wealth of information regarding all available updates, fixes, addons, etc. mdgx.com is his site.

If you are having a problem with a certain program or process I would suggest accessing the website of the publisher of that software or process. Searching the net with Yahoo, Google, etc can also at times yield answers from users who have experienced similar problems to yours.

I would suggest that it is more important to have Windows updated and patched than to run any one software program, so if it becomes impossible for it to get along with an updated Windows then perhaps it is time to upgrade the software or choose a different vendor's program. But first see if it can be fixed. First step would be consulting the support sections of the manufacturers website, I would think.

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Are you serious??? NOTHING in the auto-patcher changes the Windows version?!?!

WHat I am referring to is when you choose properties on my computer... it lists the owner of the PC, the vendor (if present), the amount of ram, and the Windows Version.

I know the dlls are different versions....

So, if no updates can change that version string data.... how the hell did I get 5 towers all reporting 4.xx.2222???

This blows my mind... are you 100% positive?? **nothing** was installed other than auto-patcher with **EVERY SINGLE** update applied... even the 'manual' installs...

Has anyone ever heard of software drivers somehow changing this data? It is literally the only thing installed besides the updates.... (although I know it isn't the drivers, since a non-updated tower reports 4.??.1999 still)

This is really weird. Can more people confirm this statement? (no offense intended, I seriously am shocked with this revelation... what the hell changed the version?!)

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OK lets try to clear up some confusion!!

if you type VER in a DOS box in any Windows operating system, you get the version of the operating system.

In Windows 98se it should read:

Windows 98 [Version 4.10.2222]

and if you do the same for Windows 98 gold (or first edition) it should say:

Windows 98 [Version 4.10.1998]

for more info on Window 9x versions go here:

http://users.iafrica.com/c/cq/cquirke/win95ver.htm

- even if you applied every single update you could get your hands on, if you have Windows 98 first edition installed, it should still be Windows 98 first edition at the end. You can confirm this by typing VER into a DOS box.

and in other news, I HAVE JUST HAD A BRAINWAVE !!! The most annoying thing about this project is the confusion generated when visiting Windows Update after completing a full auto-patch of your system. WU says there are still at least 7 updates your computer needs which is a pile of doggie doo doo, as absolutely NOTHING of value is added to your system after installing these "missing" updates. Anyway, while researching why this happens to one particular hotfix (323172) i noticed that the INF file that is left behind after the hotfix is installed was missing when WU checked my test system to see if the update was needed. When the hotfix was first installed, the INF file is copied over to the \INF folder in the Windows directory, but it seems that some of the subsequent hotfixes delete the INFs for updates that are superceeded. I haven't confirmed this for any other updates, but it does give me an idea: put the INFs back !!! I may have to use the registry entries that are created for some of the hotfixes, but i'm hoping I can just use the INFs. I'll report back probably tomorrow how I went.

Edited by soporific

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OK lets try to clear up some confusion!!

if you type VER in a DOS box in any Windows operating system, you get the version of the operating system.

In Windows 98se it should read:

Windows 98 [Version 4.10.2222]

and if you do the same for Windows 98 gold (or first edition) it should say:

Windows 98 [Version 4.10.1998]

for more info on Window 9x versions go here:

http://users.iafrica.com/c/cq/cquirke/win95ver.htm

- even if you applied every single update you could get your hands on, if you have Windows 98 first edition installed, it should still be Windows 98 first edition at the end. You can confirm this by typing VER into a DOS box.

Be careful there with the VER command.

Some users [for example PsycoUnc] prefer to use a 3rd party shell environment which replaced COMMAND.COM, like 4DOS:

http://www.jpsoft.com/download.htm#free

Direct download [1.22 MB, Windows based installer, freeware]:

http://download.jpsoft.com/4dos/4dos.exe

More info:

ftp://ftp.jpsoft.com/4dos/files/readme.txt

4DOS lines in CONFIG.SYS to replace COMMAND.COM [use INSTALLHIGH only if using an upper memory area (UMA) manager like UMBPCI.SYS or EMM386.EXE or QEMM386.SYS or RM386.EXE]:

SHELL=C:\4DOS\4DOS.COM C:\4DOS

INSTALLHIGH=C:\4DOS\KSTACK.COM

In such cases, VER returns something like this [example]:

4DOS version 7.50

Therefore in such cases VER is not useful for detecting the Windows version from DOS. :(

The only solutions I know of to work around this problem:

A. use a 3rd party DOS tool which can detect DOS version independent of installed shell environment [good place to start]:

http://short.stop.home.att.net/freesoft/

More like this here:

http://www.mdgx.com/dos.htm#DOL

B. or:

- backup original config.sys [rename it to let's say CONFIG.A-P].

- add this line to CONFIG.SYS from within a batch file using ECHO:

ECHO SHELL=C:\COMMAND.COM C:\ /E:1024 /P /F>>C:\CONFIG.SYS

or from within an advanced INF:

[Version]

AdvancedINF=2.5

[DefaultInstall]

UpdateCfgSys=CONFIGSYS.Section

[CONFIGSYS.Section]

; if COMMAND.COM located in C:\ root:

SHELL=%31%\COMMAND.COM %31%\ /E:1024 /P /F

; or if COMMAND.COM located in %windir% :

SHELL=%10%\COMMAND.COM %10%\ /E:1024 /P /F

Then, after your app does its thing, you can prompt the user to reboot in order to restore their original CONFIG.SYS .

But this last solution is problematic, there cannot be 2 SHELL= lines in CONFIG.SYS.

So you may want to completely replace their config.sys [after you back it up] with a custom one.

Easy to spot 4DOS into memory, if you wish:

mem /c | find /i "4DOS"

IF ERRORLEVEL 1 GOTO Label_1

IF ERRORLEVEL 0 GOTO Label_2

HTH

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Pardon me for barging in.

I noticed that everyone here says: Win98FE (Gold) is 4.10.1998 and Win98SE (Second Edition) is 4.10.2222.

Then, what is 4.xx.1999, repeatedly reported by DeadDude?

Isn't it possible that at least one of the updates included with the package has a broad range of Windows versions allowed for install, which includes 4.10.1999 and - by changing the kernel, or shell or whatever else - it boosts the WinVer to 4.10.2222?

Another question that springs to my mind is why does he say 4.xx.1999 and not 4.10.1999?

I may be off-track here, but hopefully someone gets a good idea out of this.

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Thank you for the replies... sorry to confuse with the xx, I didn't remember the actual numbers but I knew it wasn't 10.

the actual version reported (I had to go check at the guy's shop this morning) is:

4.95.2222

That's right... NINE FIVE. (sorry for the confusion, old and new and ancient standby pc version numbers got confusing late last night)

What the heck happened here?

Once again, GREAT MANY THANKS for all the help on this....

didn't mean to cause confusion, but now y'all know what I'm faced with here....

I *know* somthing boosted the version to 4.95... but what the hell did it? Does anyone know of *ANY* M$ OS with a x.95.xxxx version? Perhaps some file (ntkern.vxd or something?) isn't actually a 98SE version, but "works" and hasn't been found yet?

I don't know.... but it doesn't cause any issues except in HPJOBBER.... oh yeah, and the computers were MANY TIMES faster with that version returned....

Only installed files were Win98SE (after the Gold fiasco), driver CD from GigaByte, and Auto-Patcher 1.7, then 1.8... and that sequence boosted it to 4.95.2222

No Auto-patching at all, and it reports 4.10.1999.... but that *still* can't be right, since it should be 4.10.2222, correct??

Could one of the driver packages for the mobo be causing the change? It is the same board I posted in another thread.... this board:

http://tw.giga-byte.com/Support/Motherboar...8I865GME-775-RH

(Did I install the updates properly? ran AP1.7, then ran AP1.8 immediately afterward.)

Some extra info on the ORIGINAL OLD machine *without issues* in the shop:

This tower had 95, updated (with upgrade CD) to 98 Gold, then once again to 98SE. It gave a fuss, but manually deleting one or two files made it work. I used AP 1.5 or 1.6 on it a looong time ago (I'm starting to wonder if the same project name was used elsewhere, as this was back in 2002/3). This machine does everything 100% correct. It also properly reports as 4.10.2222

To Summarize:

Current setup, with almost correct version (4.10.1999):

I have 5 brand new towers built with the above linked motherboard. I built and installed everything... standard crap, boot from CD, fdisk&format, scandisk, copy cabs, setup with switches for no extras, couple of reboots then desktop in crappy VGA, pop in mobo CD, it does *everything* automatically...

Messed up setup, with 4.95.2222 reported:

same as above, but instead of driver CD, I used the updated drivers from the company site (link above also gets to the drivers). Comparing the two (CD to site), they should be identical... but the file sizes are a little off (I assume from compression and the 1000k/1024k web bug) STILL installs similar to above, except I picked the order... INF Chipset, SVGA, USB, Sound, DX 9, Sound (to enable *all* functions... I watched the 'proper' install to learn to do this)

Originally, I had updated the sound card drivers with a W2K version driver, but it is now only on ONE of the 5 (to nail this issue down). The versions reported all match still. (so this supports the claim that updates and drivers won't change that number)

Now I want to know how that version could be changed... I mean, is M$ the only people with the knowledge of how to do it? Or could the Intel INF installer do it or something?

Thanks for the help! Sorry for any extraneous confusion! (this issue is confusing itself, I don't need to goof up from lack of sleep)

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On Friday I will have two of these towers to 'play' with...

So, if you can think of anything you would like me to run or screenshot, just ask.

(is it possible to move or delete these posts? I just realized I am basically spamming the hell outta this thread with my OT issues... I didn't know it was OT until now)

EDIT:::: (posting 2 or three times is even worse than loooooong edited posts, right?? don't wanna step on toes)

@MDGx

Dude, you must have been uber in the womb... Do you know if 4Dos is cross-platform? It isn't involved in this particular situation, but your extremely knowledgable post on it made me miss my old Win3.11 w/Calmira Online! II shell and 4Dos.... Ever heard of Calmira II? It was a darn good 9x shell clone for 3.11

@All

I just started browins the various posts on updates, and I've concluded that I somehow have a few key files that are hacked between ME and perhaps 2k? This is quite interesting to note, because the only files installed are OEM drivers. I have yet to examine all the file versions of all the dlls, but if someone knows a quick and easy way (batch file anyone?) to pull this list, please share it. I don't want to have to manually look each file up and copy it down... but I could... I know dxdiag will show dx files, but I don't think those are the culprits...

If it really matters, 2 of these machines installed with 2 hiccups (locked during hw detection), while the third did not. On first installs, the 2 with hiccups did not boot, vmm.exe errors. Reinstalled after fdisk again, and 1 hiccup each but no more issues.

The other two machines have been 'built' a few times, but 98SE always locks up on install. It is odd, as *all* of the components are identical between the 5... and swapping parts between all 5 will make those 2 boot properly... (swap harddrives with 2 that are setup)

The device manager all appears O.K. no exclaimations anywhere... or red 'x'

Edited by DeadDude

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Don't worry. It's not off topic since you originally were wondering about what updates are in the auto-patcher and whether this contributed to your version difficulties with a program you use.

Are you sure your Windows 98SE cd's are authentic Microsoft OEM or Retail cd's? They would have a bluish/grey color to them and the Microsoft flag across the whole thing just in the cd's clear silver color. If retail they would be 0499 Part No. X04-14310 (at least one of mine I'm looking at has that number). There would be a hologram around the center cd hole with stuff like Valid and Microsoft and a few flags in the hologram.

If you start from Gold (First Edition) then use the $20 Second Edition Updates cd then it would be 0499 Part No. X04-12707. Same look and hologram around the center.

Now there was also a Windows 98 Service Pack 1 cd. 0499 Part No. X04-64496. That installs needed updates from Second Edition into a Windows 98 Gold installation but does NOT make the system Windows 98 Second Edition. If you or your OEM somehow included that in your OEM cd then it is possible that you have 98 First Edition with the Service Pack 1 pre-installed. It is possible (not sure though) that this results in that weirdly numbered version you have.

However, that does not make it 2nd Edition so you cannot use the auto-patcher. For systems like that you could use the Unofficial 98 First Edition Service Pack that is in another forum thread. You would need many updates besides that pack to upgrade whatever software is not included in that Unofficial Service Pack.

Anything with 1999 in the version is NOT 98 Second Edition.

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soperific,

In addition to the updates I listed a few posts above that Windows Update erroneously reported I needed, there were a few in the Recommended Catagory as well. Didn't write them down, but the Internet Explorer Start Wave fix was one of them. The crappy Update Notification (sure don't want that thing) and the Euro Fonts were there too. I didn't install anything as I figure that between my OfficeXP install, the auto-patcher, 98SE2ME, and 98MP10, I've got what 98SE needs to be updated.

Just wanted to let you know since I forgot to mention them.

It may not be wise to start messing with entering items manually, as you suggested you might try above. I'd hate to have manual entries screw up something, as is certainly possible with Microsoft software!

Why not just include in your documentation somewhere to ignore old updates that are reported by Windows Update to be needed?

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I thought they were originals...

The entire CD face is a hologram...

The background is a globe, with north america on the top left side. The background also says Genuine Microsoft tiled everywhere.

At the rights side of the hole it says

For distribution

with a new PC

only. For product

support, contact

the manufacturer

of your PC.

SECOND EDITION

left side of hole says

Do Not Make Illegal Copies Of This Disk

under the hole it says Microsoft (raised above the rest) Windows 98

under that is the Microsoft certificate sticker thingy (hologram as well, it is ALL hologram, hard to see in the dark, looks blank)

Isn't this a legit original?

The otherside (data side) has a ring around the hole, with more holograms

VALID smms diamond GENUINE logo logo windows 98 ASP0210 X05-39104 (NM.05) 08 IFPI L894 BARCODE

Edited by DeadDude

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Heh, all hologram eh? Newer cd's are like that, XP and such.

Never saw a 98 one like that, but who knows? The only OEM 98 I have is a 98 First Edition one which looks the same as I described my Second Edition cd's. My Second Edition cd's are all retail box ones.

Sounds like Microsoft made it, but you're saying it doesn't say 4.10.1998 once it's installed? Weird. Maybe they made some for OEM's that were just prior to 98SE being finished but that had the First Edition Service Pack as part of it.

Still, if it's official no program should have a problem running as long as it supports 98 First Edition. That's still what it is, and always will be unless you have a 98SE cd to upgrade it with once the original one is installed. Or. Cough, Cough, a Windows Me cd.

So, what oscardog said. Some hotfix's have been applied and are already on that disk.

Any 98 First Edition updates should work, but not Second Edition exclusive ones. Don't know what to do about your malfunctioning program. Do other programs work fine?

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4.10.1999 is a hotfixed Windows 98 FE, version number changed via update no doubt, easily done.

I don't believe. 4.10.2000 is Windows 98 with SP1 (CSP) but the general properties tab shows always 4.10.1998 for FE and 4.10.2222 for SE.

Petr

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4.10.1999 is a hotfixed Windows 98 FE, version number changed via update no doubt, easily done.

I don't believe. 4.10.2000 is Windows 98 with SP1 (CSP) but the general properties tab shows always 4.10.1998 for FE and 4.10.2222 for SE.

Petr

"With few exceptions, Windows 98 hotfixes are stamped with a version number of 4.10.1999 or greater, which indicates that the file is a newer version than the file that had been originally included with Windows 98. Windows 98 Second Edition hotfixes are generally stamped with a version number of 4.10.2223 or greater"

If i applied the above, in a company enviroment, I would alter certain information i.e version so I could keep tabs on which pc has which update applied. Easy failsafe method

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