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98 SE SP 3.32


Gape

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Just to be on the safe side, try to check your hard drive(s) with HDAT2, HDD Regenerator or any other similar tool that can find and fix bad sectors. The thrashing may be the result of such hardware failure.

Oh and the failed warm reboot is fairly common (black screen reading "Windows will now restart" or similar). I remember there is a setting somewhere in the registry that disables fast reboot but don't know its exact location off the top of my head. Some tweaking tools have it though. I've done it long ago and still, in certain circumstances (installations/uninstallations/updates/etc) some application may force a warm reboot, leaving the machine in a hung state. That's bad programming, nothing we can do.

One reason for a slightly longer boot time is the network card loading its drivers, logging onto the network and performing whatever functions it has to. A vanilla installation without network drivers will usually boot faster.

Thanks, Drugwash. I've located the HDAT2 ISO files. I'm going to create the CD in a few minutes and then run the tests.

Very well. I'll have to live with the warm boot problem if it comes up again.

I knew the network card slows the boot down considerably, and I'm seriously thinking about removing the drivers and device from my installation unless the longer boot time is understood and resolved. I may just forget using the LAN altogether and rely upon my USB sticks and external USB drive to move files back and forth. That would reduce the boot time somewhat.

Additionally, any errors encountered during SP installation may well lead to incomplete installation of a feature or system file(s), thus forcing the system to search for the missing file(s) elsewhere or to gather information over and over again. If we knew exactly what the error message was, we might be able to correct the problem or at least fix it for the next release.

This is where I think it might be wise for me to consider a completely new reinstallation with all the options identified and documented and then any errors carefully noted. I've got a mirror of the drive just before I did the SP3.4 update, so barring any hand-waving and people jumping up and down I might just wipe the drive after I test it and start all over again. That won't happen until either later tomorrow or Friday.

It wasn't until about an hour after I made this post that I thought of more questions.

-- Is it possible for me or others to check the installation on my machine to see if or how much of the original SP3.4 update was successful?

-- If the machine is thrashing around trying to search for missing file(s) or gather information over and over again, then isn't there a map to determine just how many files got installed, or which ones didn't?

What options did you check? This might help.

It's always better to have a solid basis to establish repeatable results, and I should have written all this down anyway. Bad decision on my part, and I should have been more careful when I clicked on the "Run" dialog box "OK" button.

Thanks, Problemchyld.

The more I think about this, the more certain I am I should punt, huddle up, and then start a whole new set of downs after I get the ball back.

For now here's the plan:

-- test the drive for errors and let HDAT2 fix them if found

-- report results of the test

New questions asked (above) after reconsidering Drugwash's comments.

Will delay the following until absolutely required to eliminate uncertainty.

-- wipe the drive (if okay)

-- push the original 4.10.2222 files back onto the drive

-- install SP3.4 with lots of note-taking

-- report results and errors, if any

Edited by Laser98IX
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Ideally, the SP should implement its own installation log system, but that would require quite a fair amount of work. Tracking down each selected option and acknowledging its (un)succesful installation would easily allow for debugging. If I remember correctly, the defunct UBCD Autopatcher project (thanks Dave-H for reminding me) used to have such logging system, to some extent.

Otherwise I'm afraid it's hard to impossible finding exactly what went wrong and why. A simple failed registration on a dll, ocx or other kind of file may screw a lot of things up, not to mention failed file copy and a possible dll-hell raised as a consequence. Hard to perform file/version comparison as it all depends on the options selected at launch time.

Edited by Drugwash
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For now here's the plan:

-- test the drive for errors and let HDAT2 fix them if found

-- report results of the test

New questions asked (above) after reconsidering Drugwash's comments.

Will delay the following until absolutely required to eliminate uncertainty.

-- wipe the drive (if okay)

-- push the original 4.10.2222 files back onto the drive

-- install SP3.4 with lots of note-taking

-- report results and errors, if any

Your plan is solid. So, let's do the once-over on the hardware, to be able to take it out of our minds.

I'd say:

-- test the drive for errors and let HDAT2 fix them if found

-- report results of the test

then

-- perform a 24h memtest86+

-- report results of the test

if both find no issue, let's move on to a controlled reinstall, with detailed notes taken.

It's a great thing you've made an image of the plain-vanilla install beforehand, so you may just redeploy it, instead of installing from scratch. Besides being much faster, it ensures all repetitions will be from the exact same starting point! :thumbup

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Oh and the failed warm reboot is fairly common (black screen reading "Windows will now restart" or similar). I remember there is a setting somewhere in the registry that disables fast reboot but don't know its exact location off the top of my head. Some tweaking tools have it though.

Yeah, that rings a bell.

Maybe the SP should make the necessary registry setting to fix this? Else I think there was a patch from MS that did the same thing.

Joe.

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Maybe the SP should make the necessary registry setting to fix this? Else I think there was

a patch from MS that did the same thing.

Joe.

Here's an article that includes several links to useful tips related to the reboot/shutdown issue: link

Here is the MS KB 187607 explaining how to disable fast reboot in registry: link

Thanks for the links, but it is already included in the main updates in SP3.x.

This is probably why others haven't witnessed it.

Ideally, the SP should implement its own installation log system

What do you suggest? Edited by PROBLEMCHYLD
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The only possible way I see to log the full installation would be a main batch file that launches everything and writes the progress to a text file. This way, we may find which package (or file) failed to install, which file failed to register and at which point during the installation the machine may have hung.

I realize this could be a tedious process, requiring many changes in the SP architecture and unfortunately I am not familiar with the complex syntax that would be required. Unless someone comes up with a better idea.

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Do Microsoft have some type of snapshot tool. If so, I can include it to take a snapshot before installation.

It will probably slow down installation etc.... Unless there is a better way, I have no ideas :}

Edited by PROBLEMCHYLD
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soporific's Autopatcher produces very comprehensive logs of its actions, and that is based completely on batch files of course.

:)

Indeed it was indeed Autopatcher I was thinking of, when I wrote UBCD. Thanks for the input, I corrected my post above.

Yes, it is batch-driven, but that man knew his way around them. Is anybody else up to par with soporific în this regard?

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Your plan is solid. So, let's do the once-over on the hardware, to be able to take it out of our minds.

I'd say:

-- test the drive for errors and let HDAT2 fix them if found

-- report results of the test

then

-- perform a 24h memtest86+

-- report results of the test

if both find no issue, let's move on to a controlled reinstall, with detailed notes taken.

It's a great thing you've made an image of the plain-vanilla install beforehand, so you may just redeploy it, instead of installing from scratch. Besides being much faster, it ensures all repetitions will be from the exact same starting point! :thumbup

Okay -- here are the test results --------

The short version is the hard drive and memory both check out with no errors, as I suspected.

I'll wait a little while to hear what the best recommendations are for my next action, but I think I already know what it will be.

(I'm using the "Code" style to display everything in straight tabular format to make it easier to read.)


First part of test page = HDAT2 V4.91b
Second part of test page = Memtest86+ v4.20 (24+ hour run)
(as of 08/10/2012 @ 07:00 GMT)

==========================================================
First part of test page
==========================================================

HDAT2 V4.91b Drive = ST32140A

Detect with read: pass 1 = 100% [2.11 GB]
Number of sectors: Tested = 4127760 Elapsed time: 00:16:24.026

Command Errors:
1. Read = 0 blocks
0 sectors

-----------------------------

Detect with verify: pass 1 = 100% [2.11 GB]
Number of sectors: Tested = 4127760 Elapsed time: 00:08:46.051

Command Errors:
1. Verify = 0 blocks
0 sectors

-----------------------------

Detect with read/read/compare: pass 1 = 100% [2.11 GB]
Number of sectors: Tested = 4127760 Elapsed time: 00:16:24.038

Command Errors:
1. Read = 0 blocks
0 sectors
2. Read = 0 blocks
0 sectors
3. Compare = 0 blocks
0 sectors

==========================================================
Second part of test page
==========================================================

Memtest86+ v4.20
Celeron (0.13) 2394 MHz
L1 Cache: 8K 17348 MB/s
L2 Cache: 128K 15152 MB/s
L3 Cache: None
Memory : 1022M 1694 MB/s
Chipset : Intel i848/i865 (ECC : Disabled) - FSB : 99 Mhz - Pat : Enabled
Settings: RAM : 133 MHz (DDR266) / CAS : 2-2-2-6 / Dual Channel (128 bits)

WallTime Cached RsvdMem MemMap Cache ECC Test Pass Errors ECC Errs
-------- ------ ------- -------- ----- --- ---- ---- ------ --------
24:01:40 1022M 12K e820 on off Std 42 0

  • Now, on to the quality of my installation, and the possibility that I selected options I shouldn't have.
  • I suspect I'll have to wipe the drive, push the original data back onto it, and make sure everything runs as before.
  • Then I'll try to find a means to establish a "basis" for that configuration using a tool such as Sisoft Sandra, based on a recommendation from a friend of mine.
  • He also mentioned "Winternals", which I haven't looked up yet, to attempt a logging of activities during the SP3.4 install. I have some reading to do.
  • After that I'll start the SP3.4 installation process noting which options I've selected. I'll need to preview what those selections are, because I'm not sure if I need everything there, the "core" IE files notwithstanding since I'm not running a "slim" version of '98SE (98Lite).
  • I'll document the options I believe I need to select, but I'm weary of choosing things unless I know what effect they'll have or what benefit, if any, I'll see afterward.
  • During the install process I'll note any messages that come up, but things are moving fairly quickly, so I may not be able to write things down as quickly as they flash by.
  • Any error messages will be noted before I click on any "OK" buttons.
  • After that ???

Problemchyld, if you need a Beta-tester for future updates after all this is done and working, then I'll gladly toss my hat into the ring.

Ultimately I'd like for the installation process to be so smooth even someone dumber than me -- and that's saying a lot -- can click on "Install" and be confident everything will do what they expect without having to know all the bits and bytes -- like you experts do.

Thanks for your help, Guys.

Again, Problemchyld, thanks for all your hard work. I'm not kidding when I say I appreciate it.

Edited by Laser98IX
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Here's an article that includes several links to useful tips related to the reboot/shutdown issue: link

Here is the MS KB 187607 explaining how to disable fast reboot in registry: link

After I read through the suggestions in that first link (great stuff, by the way) up to Step Thirteen I remembered the BOOTLOG function. I did a reboot as suggested, saved the BOOTLOG.TXT file, and found two "Failed" entries. They are:

[0001CEB4] Loading Vxd = ndis2sup.vxd
[0001CEB3] LoadFailed = ndis2sup.vxd

[0001D4CC] INITCOMPLETE = SDVXD
[0001D4CD] INITCOMPLETEFAILED = SDVXD

I'm not sure if these are significant, but I wanted to make sure I provided everything I could before going through the drive-wipe procedure.

Any other suggestions before I wipe/reload/re-install would be eagerly accepted.

I'm definitely saving all those recommendations to my own archive. I'll also read through and check off everything that is mentioned, but it's kinda late, so maybe I'll do that during the day on Friday or Saturday.

Thanks, Drugwash.

Edit: Bootlog.txt deleted -- not needed.

Edited by Laser98IX
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You're welcome!

Please read here for more details on the load failures you mentioned.

It's a good thing to have the boot log enabled during SP installation, it may offer clues as to what may fail in case of a hung boot sequence.

Understood. Essentially not related to a real "problem" so they will be ignored. I'll delete the attachment in the previous post.

I will engage the BOOTLOG during the SP3.4 install when the machine attempts to reboot.

Again, thanks.

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