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Browsing the web on 98/ME in 2019 and beyond

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in Windows 9x/ME

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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

Posted
Posted (edited)

Good to know Roytam1. This is the cipher suit from CometBird9 reported from HowsMySSL with FF10 NSS files you made.

  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384
  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_CHACHA20_POLY1305_SHA256
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_CHACHA20_POLY1305_SHA256
  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_DSS_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_DSS_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_256_CBC_SHA

This is the cipher suit with rzbrowser-tls12-20200127.7z ones
 

  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_ECDSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_DSS_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_DSS_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_128_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA
  • TLS_RSA_WITH_CAMELLIA_256_CBC_SHA
Edited by Goodmaneuver
Ciphers are in the upload I downloaded to check.
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Bruninho

Bruninho

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 2/29/2020 at 12:37 AM, roytam1 said:

for CometBird 9, please try this:

http://o.rths.ml/gpc/files1.rt/CometBird-9.0.1-new-nss.7z

for Firefox 10, please try this:

http://o.rths.ml/gpc/files1.rt/Firefox10-new-nss.7z

from my testing with latest KernelEx with Win2000 setting, it looks working.

These also work for SeaMonkey versions 2.6.1 and 2.7.2, respectively, because both are based on Firefox 9 and 10. Although, SeaMonkey runs VERY slow after that on Windows 98. Maybe more RAM?

I'm testing 2.7.2. I wonder if I could go higher updating KernelEx (currently 4.5.2) - because SeaMonkey now almost renders well a few forums (MSFN, Vogons) but still no Youtube yet and UI menu fonts are messed up the same way it is on K-Meleon. I don't even have the Widevine plugin (while on Windows 2000 and SeaMonkey 2.49.5 I do have). I can smell some progress here...

Also, since installing KernelEx, my Windows 98SE vmware machine hangs on shutdown screen (the one before black screen).

Edited by Bruninho
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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

Posted
Posted (edited)

VM on later OS must have some functioning help from the host OS as it does behave differently to a real installation. Mozilla uses it's own acceleration so to speak as there are no normal DirectX or Opengl files loaded when running. This means compatibility issues arise with later releases. VM may overcome these issues to some degree. 4.5.2 is compatible with Mozilla no harm trying latest KEX and trying my settings here https://msfn.org/board/topic/178283-how-you-really-browse-the-web-on-98me-in-2019/?do=findComment&comment=1176984 remember a reboot is required after adjusting the registry, check in the KernelEx dropdown to see if modules are using the setting chosen by clicking on the file properties. The hangs on shutdown screen usually has got to do with video card not changing modes, has to be a good card. UI menu not working properly ; make sure SeaMonkey uses KEX setting Windows 2K and USP10 may need a upgrade see here https://msfn.org/board/topic/173233-kernelex-45-core-updates-45201617/?do=findComment&comment=1163531 no higher versions work with Mozilla but still work in Opera, but once higher version is loaded in memory then earlier version will not take its place. If you do try new KEX then the Core.ini needs to be altered manually yourself there is no altered post. See here https://msfn.org/board/topic/173233-kernelex-45-core-updates-45201617/?do=findComment&comment=1172371 Should not require a RAM size change if working before. The web site I mentioned, once page is loaded RAM goes back to low levels again.

Edited by Goodmaneuver
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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

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Posted (edited)

I have discovered that in Opera if you adjust the zoom slider across to 200% the page fills 100% width on MSFN forum. Same with CometBird9 when zoomed above 200%. Effects posting though with Opera, there is no space bar working at end of text. 190% or less still has a narrow view.

Siria, I tested your code again in Wyzo 3.6.16/28 and it is brilliant. I did not copy to correct folder first time. It works for CometBird8 or 9 as well, just make a folder in AppData profile named Chrome and make up a userContent.css. I copied the example ones over from inside OMNI.jar omni\defaults\profile\chrome as well.

Edited by Goodmaneuver
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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

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Posted

Deomsh, Yes I think Opera can be made to work with similar code. I will look into that soon.

Bruninho, The shut down screen hang can also be the last write to the HDD. Say a SCSI card does not toggle off BIOS (something like that) it will cause the stoppage at about that time. Does a restart cause problems or just a shutdown?
 

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siria

siria

Posted
Posted

Thank you for confirming that layout fix works in other browsers of that era too.
Note:
As mentioned in a previous post, this userstyle for browsers of Firefox2-3 era engines is adjusted to my screen width of 1024px, since I couldn't figure out how to make it use "100%" of screen. That means the width is hardcoded for 1024px, using fix numbers, but of course lucky people with wider screens can easily increase the numbers to their own screens.
The CSS code can be pasted in the personal userstyle sheets, whichever anyone uses.
Am only familiar with Mozilla/Gecko browsers, and as Wunderbar98 explained already, their default path is .../yourprofile/chrome/userContent.css
and if not existing, the file can be created with an editor like Notepad++, or look for "userContent-example.css" and change the name.

Am quite optimistic that userstyle also helps Opera12.02, since the forum looks exactly the same as in my old Geckos. Just have no clue how to handle that browser and couldn't figure out yet in a first attempt how to enable personal userstyles there, or what I may have done to prevent them. Funnily found lots of css-files and also checkboxes to enable them and set folder paths, and settings for authorstyle and userstyle and whatnot, but still nothing got injected. Surely my fault, but didn't try further since others know this better anyway :-)


Browser's DEFAULT stylesheets
Looks like those are very easily accessible in old gecko browsers!
In FF2+3.6 here: ../programs/browsername/res/***.css
There are several, the most fundamental one being "html.css"
In younger geckos they are also contained, just unzip omni.ja(r) and do a file search for "html.css"

The advantage of those "default" styles compared to "user" styles is that those are not overruling the original styles of websites, only provide initial settings if none exist at all yet in old browsers.

So far in a quick first step have only compared "html.css" in K-Meleon74 (FF24) and KM1.6 (FF3.5), then copied over a few html5 tags into KM1.6, plus a few random younger tags seen on caniuse.com. But that's just a start, update from FF3.5 to FF24, and fixes hardly anything yet, since most new tags are simple "block" features, just with more or less margins. Some day will have to compare new tags in younger FF versions too.

Hardly anything useful here yet, except mainly "mark", a new tag for highlighted inline text.
And "time" is inline too.

mark {
 display: inline;
 background: yellow;
 color: black;
}

time {
 display: inline;
}

article,
aside,
figcaption,
footer,
header,
hgroup,
main,
nav,
section {
 display: block;
}

/* added to existing blockquote */
figure {
 display: block;
 margin: 1em 40px;
}

/* hidden elements */
/*#### html5 / only added DATALIST+TEMPLATE from KM74 */
area, base, basefont, head, meta, script, style, title,
noembed, param, datalist, template {
  display: none;
}

/*#### only table border color / copied from KM74 */
table[bordercolor] > tbody,
table[bordercolor] > thead,
table[bordercolor] > tfoot,
table[bordercolor] > col,
table[bordercolor] > colgroup,
table[bordercolor] > tr,
table[bordercolor] > * > tr,
table[bordercolor]  > tr > td,
table[bordercolor] > * > tr > td,
table[bordercolor]  > tr > th,
table[bordercolor] > * > tr > th {
 border-color: inherit;
}

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loblo

loblo

Posted
Posted (edited)

MSFN forum posts have a max width of 1310 pixels for me (and no minimum apparently or very low) on Opera 12.02 at 100% zoom which is absolutely fine on my 1920x1080 display. I don't think there is anything to "fix" there.



 

Edited by loblo
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Bruninho

Bruninho

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Posted (edited)
On 3/2/2020 at 1:36 AM, Goodmaneuver said:

VM on later OS must have some functioning help from the host OS as it does behave differently to a real installation. Mozilla uses it's own acceleration so to speak as there are no normal DirectX or Opengl files loaded when running. This means compatibility issues arise with later releases. VM may overcome these issues to some degree. 4.5.2 is compatible with Mozilla no harm trying latest KEX and trying my settings here https://msfn.org/board/topic/178283-how-you-really-browse-the-web-on-98me-in-2019/?do=findComment&comment=1176984 remember a reboot is required after adjusting the registry, check in the KernelEx dropdown to see if modules are using the setting chosen by clicking on the file properties. The hangs on shutdown screen usually has got to do with video card not changing modes, has to be a good card. UI menu not working properly ; make sure SeaMonkey uses KEX setting Windows 2K and USP10 may need a upgrade see here https://msfn.org/board/topic/173233-kernelex-45-core-updates-45201617/?do=findComment&comment=1163531 no higher versions work with Mozilla but still work in Opera, but once higher version is loaded in memory then earlier version will not take its place. If you do try new KEX then the Core.ini needs to be altered manually yourself there is no altered post. See here https://msfn.org/board/topic/173233-kernelex-45-core-updates-45201617/?do=findComment&comment=1172371 Should not require a RAM size change if working before. The web site I mentioned, once page is loaded RAM goes back to low levels again.

Jeeeesus. I'm very confused as to how to update and apply your settings. I'm new in this.

EDIT: Alright. I think Microsoft Installer is already there (I can't find the "update" you mentioned though), I think I've got the USP10.DLL from MDGx's website (It was included in another update I think, for RTF?). And PSAPI.dll is already updated. KernelEx is updated to 4.5.2016 according to the verify.exe, although I got it from here which says a different version. Still, SeaMonkey 2.7.2 is showing wrong font family... What am I missing now?

Edited by Bruninho
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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

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Loblo, could you keep a copy of your application data profile of Opera. In my case I keep a copy of the Opera program folder as I am using the 12.18 files. It will probably be the browser.js that makes the difference mine has changed at 31/01/2019. My browsers have succumb to Google's mobile search view for some time now has your Opera got full width on Google search? It might be easier if you could post the browser.js for us? 

Siria, A web article said to make up a opera ***user.js file and place in the profile next to browser.js for GreaseMonkey mods to work in Opera. Not all code is totally compatible though & there are articles out there https://github.com/mislav/user-scripts/blob/master/toolkit/gm_functions.js  I believe this one is written for Opera, it may give some clues. This has to be done also, force Opera to use the new JS file here https://www.ghacks.net/2008/08/10/greasemonkey-in-opera/ All we need is the first part of your coding for Opera to view full width again - (if it is viewing 1/2 width), the rest of the code is important for CometBird9 down to the FireFox2 only part. Other info https://simply-how.com/enhance-and-fine-tune-any-web-page-the-complete-user-scripts-guide & http://www.howtocreate.co.uk/operaStuff/userJavaScript.html . ViolentMonkey for Presto here https://github.com/violentmonkey/violentmonkey-oex

Bruninho, What web site gives the wrong font family? I think you need to update fonts? I made a mistake SeaMonkey does not need 2K settings. Are you OK about changing KEX registry settings and the alteration to Core.ini?
 

Edited by Goodmaneuver
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Goodmaneuver

Goodmaneuver

Posted
Posted (edited)

Thanks Loblo for your upload. It is exactly the same as mine. The date change for mine was probably done when I saved my profile last time. The narrow width view is more complex but I believe it would be the profile differences or country specific server differences. It is interesting how your Google search looks like a modern Opera by the sound of it. My search is centered in the middle of page not to the left. Your posting is the same as mine about 1280 wide at 100% zoom.

Deomsh, I tried Kiosk mode, good to find out about it. MSFN looks the same though compared to normal mode. The only response from the keyboard was Alt + F4.

These settings are made automatically when Opera enters kiosk mode: - "Quoted, minus a few OS specific."


Start-up dialogs are not shown
Full-screen mode is enabled by default
All toolbars are disabled
The application bar is disabled
Panels remain accessible
Opening links in new pages and in the background is disabled
Speed Dial is disabled
Users cannot exit full-screen mode by pressing Esc
Direct access to the system and other programs is denied through blocking of application keys and system keys on Windows
Ctrl+Esc is disabled
Alt+Tab is disabled
Alt+Escape is disabled
The Help function is disabled
 

Edited by Goodmaneuver
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