jaclaz Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 I'll throw this in, just for the fun of it :http://www.wings3d.com/http://erlang.org/jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trevor89 Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 "google has all the answeres"Well, actualy Google directs you to places like here to get the answers. Its anoying when searching for something to find a result from a forum like this and find out that it includes "Google has the answere"! Anyway, Im not falling out with anyone. I just picked that quote up from... err ... one of the above posts.Trev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patchworks Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) I have been stunned when i realized that whole Vista is programmed in .net C#.net C#. that makes vista bit more efficientIf doubt that's true, but If so I (and probably Bill too, that's why he leaved) can understand now why Vista and 7 completely sucks. Edited August 29, 2009 by patchworks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsenellenelvian Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I'll give you the fact that Vista sucks.But have you even tried Win7??Or are you just believing the 5-10% of user base out there that don't like it?Windows7 is a very good and stable OS. Plus its legacy support really rivals what poor support they had in Vista. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenoitRen Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 But have you even tried Win7??Beta and release candidate versions have not been representative of the final product in the history of Microsoft products. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsenellenelvian Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I am talking of the final product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Natan Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Even the RC build (let alone the RTM branch builds and the RTM master build) has been much faster than Vista. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offler Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 For me .net doesnt mean any specificly good programming environment. Because it is windows only thats something what makes it isolated. But when i am in windows environment direct MS support of this environment may help improve development of all parts of OS - at all they have been writing their new OS in its own language. I know how can be support from developer who created programming language effective.But from another point of view there is hard to say if C# is good programming language at all, since common developers dont have such good support as developers working directly in MS.I mean - i dont care if .net really sucks, if they know how to use it. Clearly i think that other programming languages were too hard for them For me major reason why vista is not so popular is the way how it support (or doesnt support) hardware. Many generic and OEM drivers are buggy, while new drivers directly from the hardware manufacturer may work correctly, or may cause major performance downgrade (as with ATI driver, where different drivers cause difference 100 percent in shader performance)Fight between 32bit and 64bit environment is also something different. People with x64 are much more satisfied, just because support for this level is at least better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noguru Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 For me major reason why vista is not so popular is the way how it support (or doesnt support) hardware. Many generic and OEM drivers are buggy, while new drivers directly from the hardware manufacturer may work correctly, or may cause major performance downgrade (as with ATI driver, where different drivers cause difference 100 percent in shader performance)I don't think it's fair to blame Vista for ATI problems. Nvidia doesn't have issues like that on the very same Vista. Not that Nvidia is perfect. PhysX, the Nvidia gadget, runs unstable on my system if it works at all. But a 100% shader performance difference?? That's bad! I have a ATI radeon 9600 pro that refuses to do AA in 9 out of 10 games. Driver problem.... I'll stick to green from now on.Generally speaking I also think it's not really fair to complain about Vista's hardware support when doing a Win98 vs. Vista comparison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Natan Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 (edited) For me .net doesnt mean any specificly good programming environment. Because it is windows only thats something what makes it isolated. But when i am in windows environment direct MS support of this environment may help improve development of all parts of OS - at all they have been writing their new OS in its own language. I know how can be support from developer who created programming language effective.But from another point of view there is hard to say if C# is good programming language at all, since common developers dont have such good support as developers working directly in MS.I mean - i dont care if .net really sucks, if they know how to use it. Clearly i think that other programming languages were too hard for themAgain insisting on posting incorrect stuff? Or maybe it was the bad English and I didn't understand what you meant. In case you didn't understand my posts above, neither Vista nor 7 are written in C# or .NET. No idea where you got this silly idea, but please stop repeating. Note: Repeating something incorrect doesn't magically make it true. The only parts that are partly developed in .NET (in WPF) are the new games and the new calculator's UI (in 7).And .NET being Windows only? Huh? Education: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mono_%28software%29After completing a big project in C# and Mono on Linux, that was so silly to read in 2009.On the topic of .NET being good or not, I won't comment. Clearly you have little knowledge of what it is meant to be and it isn't (hey, you claim the OS are written in .NET... ). I will just say this: When compared to the Java platform, .NET is heaps and bounds ahead. C# is currently one of the most advanced languages out there. It doesn't offer the robustness of C++, but it isn't meant to. If you take a look at the proposals for the new C++ standard, you will see that actually some of the C# innovations are making their way in."common developers dont have such good support as developers working directly in MS" = So again, please, if you want people to take you seriously, please educate yourself in the matters you choose to post about. BTW, I really tried putting all the more smiling smilies, because some felt my previous posts weren't kind enough, but ****, the board has a limit on smilies, so my post will once again be unkind. Edited August 30, 2009 by Leo Natan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 OK, defintiely it is not .net, and also not C#.What did the good Microsoft guys use to write their OSes?Quick Basic?Plain C?C++?jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Natan Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 (edited) For the most part, C++ and C. ASM is used for the "close to metal" stuff.Like I said above, WPF starts to make its way in, but is currently used for really really small part. Edited August 30, 2009 by Leo Natan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dencorso Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 (edited) Probably something like about 55% C, 35% C++ and 10% assembler... if things didn't change too much in the last 10 years. I may be wrong, but I think that's about it.Added comment:@Leo Natan: it seems we were posting at the same time... and you finished first! Edited August 30, 2009 by dencorso New comment added Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Natan Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 @Leo Nathan: it seems we were posting at the same time... and you finished first! Hehe, cheers! BTW, why does every small edit register? Usually edits start getting registered when someone has already posted a comment afterward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offler Posted August 31, 2009 Author Share Posted August 31, 2009 (edited) If you think that GUI of OS is only small part of OS than you are right. But i think that GUI is one of the most used part of system, unless you use cmd line as i like. MS want to build system on it as much as possible and they start to do it. I am sure that they use asm and classical versions of C to make "close to hardware" systems to work, but once they created whole GUI in .net they have done step which has changed many things.No core part of windows was programmed in .net before, and i am sure that explorer.exe IS based on this platform.Also i never believed that Mono is equal to .net. Beta version of software which I test is able to work on any windows with framework 2.0 and later and DirectX installed after .net, but never on linux. Maybe mono miss managed directx code - dont know exact reason. It is strange, because the developers of this sofware are trying to make it work under linux for some time.ad: "common developers dont have such good support as developers working directly in MS"I worked for a company which was developing PC game. They created whole new programming language for AI. I had source codes of that language, i had complete documentantion, i had its developer at hand. Every question was answered before i asked. He knew all about it. Which parameters work, and which does not, which may cause bugs and so on.now while i betatest a software i was reporting bug, and developer told me that it is possible to store a value regarding to directX, but it was impossible to load it again. he just dont know why, but he found different way how to archieve it.thats the difference what i was talking about.I know several tricks which can cause particular versions of explorer to crash, but i have to say that vista's one is the best. And the reason why it is so i see in such cooperation as in first case.to Noguru:i was talking about generic driver provided by microsoft in major, OEM driver provided by Asus, but you are right that ATI had bad drivers lately. but it was not only bad driver included... Edited August 31, 2009 by Offler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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