jaclaz Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 We are talking two different languages. Did you use Notepad (which is NOT a hex-editor) to change the menu.lst file or the embedded menu.lst INSIDE grldr? However, it doesn't matter, simply try this:For the moment, boot to the ASUS, get to command line and issue these commands:map (fd0) (hd31,0)[ENTER]map --hook[ENTER]root (hd31,0)[ENTER]chainloader /ntldr[ENTER]boot[ENTER]You should get back to the BOOT.INI choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wimb Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 The Format Stick procedure of Make_USB.exe can make use of CHS Knockout Patches for the MBR and the BootSector to overcome your troubles with nx240x63 geometry.Use Format Stick with NTFS FileSystem.More Info:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/index.php?...5306&st=215http://www.boot-land.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=5306 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 10, 2009 Author Share Posted July 10, 2009 (edited) We are talking two different languages. Did you use Notepad (which is NOT a hex-editor)I know it is not a hex-editor, this is why I wrote what I did. The hex editor would show me a bunch of numbers, right? How would I know which ones to delete/modify to get rid of "--ignore-floppies"?to change the menu.lst file or the embedded menu.lst INSIDE grldr? I changed the file, didn't get that educated to figure there is one inside grldr (but suspected this is not what si needed). Was up to trying a commandgrubmenu.exe import grldr menu.lst but didn't do it yet.For the moment, boot to the ASUS, get to command lineI am not getting to the command line on ASUS. The 2 pics is all I get. I don't know what to hit on the 1-st one to get to the command line and on the 2-nd it doesn't let me.On F8 I see this pic.Format Stick procedure of Make_USB.exeWill try, thanks. Will get another stick for this, I guess. Edited July 10, 2009 by Tulert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 I know it is not a hex-editor, this is why I wrote what I did. The hex editor would show me a bunch of numbers, right? How would I know which ones to delete/modify to get rid of "--ignore-floppies"?Sure :Recipe for an omelette:get 4 eggsbreak them in a frying pan with some oil, add a little saltcook for 3 minutes at medium heat, while stiiring with a wooden spoon or forkSince I have no eggs, oil or frying pan, I put some bread in a pot full up to the brim with water, cooked it for half an hour in the oven.The omelette does not taste good. I am not getting to the command line on ASUS. The 2 pics is all I get. I don't know what to hit on the 1-st one to get to the command line and on the 2-nd it doesn't let me.Hmmm, try putting a copy of menu.lst on your internal hard disk, in C:\menu.lst.grldr ahould be able to find it.Once you are in it, press "c" for command line, and try issuing the commands previously listed.On F8 I see this pic.Sure , that's the normal "safe mode" of Windows.jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 10, 2009 Author Share Posted July 10, 2009 Since I have no eggs, oil or frying pan, I put some bread in a pot full up to the brim with water, cooked it for half an hour in the oven.The omelette does not taste good. Almost Since I don't know what is an egg I'll go read an article. It says it's a round 3D white object sold in the DrugStores. So I go there and, bingo, golf balls qualify.Next I cannot break them - bummer! So I need to go read the article again and see what I misunderstood. In the meantime the Lab doesn't know what is going on, so why don't I entertain them a little bit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 10, 2009 Author Share Posted July 10, 2009 try putting a copy of menu.lst on your internal hard disk, in C:\menu.lst.The disks are brand new from the store. Is there anything else we could try except for me unmounting them? Is it important to check the result of these commands from the stick prepared with your files? If not -- I can take a different stick and it should get me to the grub> prompt like it happened before.Sure , that's the normal "safe mode" of Windows.Whatever, the point was I am able to see 3 screens, not 2 like I said before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 Hmm, I thought it was a re-install, not a "brand-new" one. OK, I would say time to go with plan "B" (don't worry, we do have plan "C", "D", and probably a few more):Could we go with Micro Center? I have a lot of those Sticks and it's easy to take another one of same type if experimenting makes it dead.Time to risk a bit (again don't worry, unless you do something weird, there won't be problems):The other thing to try is to see if, since you have a USBest UT165 controller, the correspondent "manufacturer tool" can "flip the removable bit".The tool should be this one:http://flashboot.ru/Files-file-219.htmlhttp://flashboot.ru/uploads/files/public/U...5_1.65.17.0.rarThe manual for it should be this one:http://flashboot.ru/uploads/files/public/U...ual_EN_V4.0.rarIf it works, the stick becomes a "fixed" device, just like any hard disk, and thus the ASUS should recognize it properly.Plan "C", should you not want to go for plan "B" above:Can you please attach a copy of your current MBR of the stick - the one which is booting now - (it should be one of the files I sent you, buit I've lost track whether we did some mods to it)?I can try adding a second "fake" partition to it and see if the findings of member Online on boot-land apply to your Asus, or you could try doing it directly:Access the stick (Physicaldrive n) with beeblebrox:http://students.cs.byu.edu/~codyb/You should see a single entry "filled" with these data:#0/0E/80/0/1/1/490/254/63/63/7.887.852and the other three ones "blank".now, add this data to second entry:#1/21/00/491/0/1/491/0/63/7.887.915/63This post has a screenshot that could help in guiding you doing the above:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/index.php?...=7739&st=54jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 20, 2009 Author Share Posted July 20, 2009 (edited) OK, I would say time to go with plan "B" ...try is to see if, since you have a USBest UT165 controller, the correspondent "manufacturer tool" can "flip the removable bit".I tried UT165 1.65.17.0. The result is Error 0x28 "Run SCSI command Failed".Then I formatted with Fuwi's tool and it boots on a Laptop with the same blue splashscreen.On ASUS: if BIOS: Auto => Motherboard logo if BIOS: Forced FDD => get to grub> promptAny commands I should run here while it works?The backups of the MBR and the Bootsector before UT165 1.65.17.0 operation attached.**************************************************************Also Log from the UT165 1.65.17.0MFPT [1] runUnit Test ResultUt165=======================================================Start Date : воскресенье,19 июл 2009Start Time : 19:31:53End Time : 19:32:03Consume Time : 00:00:10-------------------------------------------------------Port 0 : Connectstatus : Code:0x28 Stage : Search Blank Blocks = 00:00:05:958Stage : Read L2P Valid Blocks = 00:00:01:600Stage : Write ISP Code = 00:00:01:731Stage : Update CIS = 00:00:01:882Capacity : 3851MBVID/PID : 1307/165Inquiry : USB 2.0 USB Flash Drive Serial Number : 0000000000000FIntel-2421-32GbOperating Mode : 2.0 - DualTotal Bad Blocks : 6-------------------------------------------------------Port 1 : no device-------------------------------------------------------Port 2 : no device-------------------------------------------------------Port 3 : no device*******************************************************Diagnostics I saw:Device Tree List: [Port 1]Status: Code:0x28Capacity: 3851MBFirmware ID: AM0684USB VID/PID: 1307/165Inquiry Strings: USB 2.0 USB Flash DriveSerial Number: 0000000000000FWrite Protect: NoFlash ID: Intel-2421-32Gb 89 d5 94 3e 74Operating Mode: 2.0 - DualI understand from Flash ID that it isA=2 => MLCB=4 => 4K page BlkC=2 => dual channelD=1 => max chip numbers=1Tulert090719.rar Edited July 20, 2009 by Tulert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 The result is Error 0x28 "Run SCSI command Failed".Hmm.I wonder what went wrong. I'll have a look at the files and see if I can create a MBR for "plan C". jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 20, 2009 Author Share Posted July 20, 2009 The result is Error 0x28 "Run SCSI command Failed".I wonder what went wrong. Who knows... People there report all kind of errors and say they've got their flash drive recovered nevertheless... So I am not sure what stage I've got to. My flash changed it's name and the name I see in Asus bios.Also I read a little more and somebody says they've restarted the program several times (sounds like 3-4) with 0x28 and eventually got Ok. So maybe I should try that too. I wonder if there is a forum with replies and not just error reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 22, 2009 Author Share Posted July 22, 2009 (edited) to see if, since you have a USBest UT165 controller, the correspondent "manufacturer tool" can "flip the removable bit". If it works, the stick becomes a "fixed" device, just like any hard disk, and thus the ASUS should recognize it properly.I tried it again and got OK in the UT165 1.65.17.0. So what should I do with this stick now to test it on ASUS, i.e. Fuwi's tool, your files, nothing.It looks crazy in Beeblebrox, by the way. Edited July 22, 2009 by Tulert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted July 22, 2009 Share Posted July 22, 2009 So what should I do with this stick now to test it on ASUS, i.e. Fuwi's tool, your files, nothing.Good. If the device is now "Fixed", you shuld be able to use "normal" Disk Management to partition/format it.I would anyway clear the first, say, 200 sectros with dsfo or another tool, just to "start from scratch".If you are using Disk Mangement under Vista, make sure you have the Registry Fix for proper boundaries, see here:http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?showtopic=21186http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?sho...21186&st=18jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 If the device is now "Fixed", you should be able to use "normal" Disk Management to partition/format it.Call me dumb but what would make the stick a bootable device though? Just a format won't be enough or am I getting crazy?I would clear the first, say, 200 sectros with dsfo or another tool, just to "start from scratch". If this is not too much trouble for you could you pls print a command for dsfo? I don't understand if HDDs and Flashes have the same structure & whether there should be a partition table and so what is the 1-st sector to clear. And whether it matters now or after 1-st format or at all. The flash works as a storage already & doesn't request a format so I don't understand what is Ok and not Ok to erase.If you are using Disk Mangement under Vista, make sure you have the Registry Fix for proper boundariesWe agreed on Win XP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaclaz Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Call me dumb but what would make the stick a bootable device though? Just a format won't be enough or am I getting crazy?It's not at all a dumb question , this kind of things is not usually written in BIG FRIENDLY letters on the cover of the XP manual (the one that MS completely fails to provide ).Just for the record, I keep dearly an old DOS manual that came with Compaqs several years ago, it is a nice 300+ pages manual with all commands in detail: ahhh, the good ol' times you got something in exchange for the price you payed when you bought a PC/OS license.... In DOS there were THREE distinct "phases":FDISK would partition the device, i.e. write the MBR CODE and DATAFORMAT (after a reboot) would create the filesystem on it, i.e. write the bootsector DATA and filesystem structures (but NOT make the filesystem bootable)SYS would make the filesystem bootable by writing the bootsector CODE and transfer to it the System files: IO.SYS, MSDOS.SYS and COMMAND.COM (same could be done with FORMAT /S)In NT based systems this is done in TWO "phases"Disk Management partitions the device, i.e. write the MBR CODE and DATAFORMAT (no reboot needed) creates the filesystem on it, i.e. write the bootsector DATA and filesystem structures AND make the filesystem bootable by writing bootsector CODE also, BUT without transferring the system files NTLDR, NTDETECT.COM and BOOT.INIThe whole problem with USB sticks is that the device is seen by Windows as "Removable", and Disk Management won't allow partitioning it, and besides, only one partition will be mounted to a drive letter even if the stick has been partitioned in several partitions.By flipping the "Removable" bit and making the device seen as "Fixed" (or using a Fillter driver like cfadisk.sys or dummydisk.sys - but this only works within Windows NT builds), you effectively transform the USB stick in a Hard Disk, and Disk Management works allright, exactly as it would for a "real" hard disk (USB connected or not).The flipping may hopefully also make your motherboard BIOS detect the device as a HD, and let you boot from it with the "from HD" setting. (this is the scope of the experiment)If this is not too much trouble for you could you pls print a command for dsfo? I don't understand if HDDs and Flashes have the same structure & whether there should be a partition table and so what is the 1-st sector to clear. And whether it matters now or after 1-st format or at all. The flash works as a storage already & doesn't request a format so I don't understand what is Ok and not Ok to erase.No prob. Any device connected to a Windows NT based system will get a (let's call it for simplicity) "low-level" name or address, in the form of \\.\PhysicalDriven.If the device is partitioned or formatted or both, Windows will also assign a LogicalDrive to each partition/filesystem it can find (what you normally see as drive letters)http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/P/physical_drive.htmlhttp://www.webopedia.com/TERM/L/logical_drive.htmlIn other words:the PhysicalDrive is ALWAYS the "whole thing".the LogicalDrive(s) is/are part(s) of it.In the case where the device is a floppy or "super-floppy", i.e. it has no partition table PhysicalDrive and LogicalDrive are the same thing, as they BOTH start form the first sector of the device.In the case of a partitioned device (assuming with just one Primary partition for simplicity), you have:PhysycalDrive|-MBR (one sector)|-Hidden sectors (usually 62, sometimes on "bad" Vista partitioned 128)|-LogicalDrive (read Partition)|---Bootsector (1 sector for FAT16, usually 6÷12 sectors for FAT32-this can vary, 16 sectors for NTFS)|---filesystem structures (FATs or NTFS structures)|---actual DATA (files you can normally see and access) Have a look at this:http://www.ranish.com/part/primer.htmBy accessing the PhysicalDrive (thus at offset 0), and wiping (by filling with hex 00's) the first 200 sectors, you effectively wipe anything the partitioning/formatting program may read and try to "understand", and that in some case fails to understand correctly.A command line is given here:http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?sho...22975&st=21Be very, VERY careful to choose the RIGHT "n".A good idea is to run beeblebrox WITHOUT the USB stick connected, take note of the LAST PhysicalDrive, then re-run after having connected the stick: LAST PhysicalDrive should have been incremented by one, and THAT is the RIGHT "n" to use.jaclaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulert Posted July 25, 2009 Author Share Posted July 25, 2009 (edited) Thanks for all the info. I read some of it, will get back once I have a chance to the rest.At the moment I did fsz 200_sectors.bin 102400 dsfi \\.\Physicaldrive1 0 0 200_sectors.bin 'Disk Management' => Format Copied boot.ini, ntldr, grldr to the stickGot when booting on a laptopDisk errorPress any key to restart...On ASUS with the same stick & option Auto in BIOS I do get beyond Motherboard logo now to this:Please select the operating system to start:Microsoft Windows XP ProfessionalMicrosoft Windows Recovery ConsoleThe pic is similar to Click hereIs it normal/OK that Grub4Dos is not in the menu? Edited July 26, 2009 by Tulert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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