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winxpi

Did something happene in Autum 2008 to the Win98 community?

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Most people don't buy a new OS just because it's out. They get a new OS through the purchase of a newer computer, because the older one either broke or has become 'slow' (as if computers age and slow down...) because of their malware collection.

Most of official and legal documents and forms are in pdf, for a reason.

Indeed, to faithfully print them on a piece of paper!

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Most people don't buy a new OS just because it's out.
Wrong! Actually, that's what they do, because they're being taught so all the time. The advertising crap that's pouring out of every kind of media tells people they "have to get the newest because it's the best thing ever invented". And they always fall for it.

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You know I would have to agree with Drugwash on this just because of one thing. People downgraded from Vista or refused to buy Vista because they heard about how bad it was. Personally I don't think its that bad. That isn't the point I am trying to make. People wouldn't downgrade or refuse to buy it if other people said not to. So now everyone is talking about how great Win7 is. So in reality their opinions' will have a dramatic effect on the new OS.

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People wouldn't downgrade or refuse to buy it if other people said not to.

I went back to XP, and also moved backwards to older versions of Nero, Acrobat, IE, Firefox, and several other programs after using them and verifying that the only "advantage" for me was in using an increasingly more bloated product to do the same old things. I like progress, but I try to have it clear in my mind what means progress just for me and for my daily needs. My needs are not the needs of Microsoft.

Edited by seaweed

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People refused to buy computers with Vista. Come on, most people don't even know what an operating system is.

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@BenoitRen "most people don't even know what an operating system is."

You are totally right.

Edited by seaweed

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most people don't even know what an operating system is

They might know it's name, but that's about it :)

Most people don't buy a new OS just because it's out.
Wrong! Actually, that's what they do, because they're being taught so all the time. The advertising crap that's pouring out of every kind of media tells people they "have to get the newest because it's the best thing ever invented". And they always fall for it.

Amusing theory. Care to back it with some evidence? If there is one thing that the media told you not to do then it's buying Vista. Instead they have been recommending to stick or even downgrade to XP.

And now they will tell you to wait for Win7 because it's so great.....(99% vista under the hood, same performance, but UAC has lost its edge (castrated) and the looks are different so it must be better right?)

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I plan to be using Win9x a decade from now.

Windows Xp does not allow me to do anything which I need to do and cannot do in Win9x

I will never install windows Vista/7 ad infinitium ad nasium.

Most of the problems with Windows XP and later are design related.

Win9x was the last Microsoft OS designed for stand alone computers, so it does not have the admin rights, permissions AND (the main cause of the virus proliferation) the ability to interconnect between other computers without additional software.

Windows XP was based on the Windows NT kernel - BUT the Windows NT kernel was designed for corporate networked computers, and not standalone machines.

When Microsoft decided to combine the Win9x and Windows NT lines into Windows XP, what really happened was merely adding a wider diversity of drivers to the corporate version of Windows and then calling it a desktop OS for individual computers, but regardless of what MS said, it was not an appropriate OS for stand alone computers which didn't need the Administration functions permissions essential on multi-networked computers.

With Windows Vista, Microsoft again changed directions. Since, at the time they started work on Vista with their predatory practices they practically owned the office suite and browser market, they went looking for another BIG area where they thought they might be able to use their OS dominance to leverage an increased market share. They found one, the entertainment industry. Consequently, Windows Vista and later have been designed to use DRM to make the computer OS less changeable and modifiable than the typical set top box furnished by the cable companies.

Just like the move to catering primarily to corporate WAN needs caused problems for the original stand alone computer users who allowed MS to achieve such a great Market dominance, the move toward catering to the needs of the entertainment industry and DRM is causing massive problems for their corporate users.

The current "How great is Windows 7" is similar to the pre-release "How great is Windows Vista", just before Vista was released, but I think that when Windows 7 actually comes out and is used, it will be found that Windows 7 is little better that Vista, as it is basically Vista's emphases on DRM which was the cause of most of the problems with Vista. While Version 1.0 of almost all MS OS, historically had so many problems as to be often considered undesirable, this is not the case with Vista and even the later SP upgrades did not fix the problems, as they were concept related more than software related.

Insofar as the demise of Windows Drivers for Win9x, I have always though the most likely cause was MS related - take down your Win9X drivers or you loose support - I came to this conclusion after I found HP printers which had shipped with Windows 98 Drivers in the box when they were the latest and greatest listed as not working in Windows 98 by HP, and drivers furnished by HP in the box with the printer not available for download if somebody lost their CD. As it is very easy and beneficial to their customers to leave the Win9X drivers on the site with a note that they are no longer supported, I think pressure from MS. Why might MS want to eliminate Win9x boxes? Because with Win9X and DOS you can perhaps do things to Vista which MS doesn't want you to be able to do.

While I intend to move to Linux from Win9x rather than to Vista, I think Linus is more of a networked designed OS rather than a stand alone desktop type OS. For instance I believe that Linus uses TCP/IP for as their Ethernet protocol rather than NetBuei or Netware meaning that you cannot have a different protocol for your Ethernet than you do for your internet. I also think that there are admin rights and permissions in Linux similar to the stuff you find in XP and which have no place in a stand alone machine. The advantage in moving to Linux from Win9x seems to be similar to the advantage in moving to WinXP from Win9x, in both cases you have permissions and such so you can control access to various resources by software, rather than controlling access to resources by controlling access to the whole machine as you do with a stand alone desktop box. However, if you are going to Linux from XP, instead of Vista, it's all good, you still have the permissions but you do NOT have the DRM. I know little about Linux than what I have read, as I have never run it.

As I do not do P2P, play games, or do anything with video (although I do heavy photo editing, and worked as a designer using CAD in the aerospace industry for many years) I find that an OS like Vista which requires more power to run the OS than any application I might run on it including the CAD programs and the high end photo editors - to be somewhat less then environmentally friendly. This does NOT include anything made by Adobe as the Photoshop related products produced by Adobe are the only programs I know of which could give MS lessons in how to write bloatware!

Adobe has bought into DRM perhaps even more than MS - their goal with flash is to produce ads which HAVE to be fully run before you can see the web page content.

Acrobat up to 5.1 did not allow the running of software from within a .pdf file, and I have never installed any later version pf Acrobat Reader. I have on occasion found pdf files with newer content which Acrobat reader 5.1 couldn't display but then I went to Foxit reader. Foxit reader 1.3 is the last version WITHOUT javascript support, and Foxit Reader 2.2 is the last version which does NOT have multimedia support.

I have never been able to see how a format which was supposed to provide universal viewing and print support for a document needed to be able to run anything from within itself. Back in the old pre-computer days, you couldn't type something in your typewriter which would enable the letter to go over and turn on the TV when the appropriate page was turned to!

I plan on running Win9x a decade from now, I have 9 of an identical model of Thinkpad, IIRC it was the second from last model which would run Win9x and as such, they will run any version of a MS OS

from DOS 1.0 through WinXP SP3 (I only have WinXP SP2 and some pieces of SP3 as the full version of SP3 adds WGA), and I have Windows updated not merely turned off but removed. My computers don't automatically talk to Microsoft for any reason.

I also have 3 sub notebooks of the same model which run Win9X.

Whenever I see Win9X compatible items disappearing from the marketplace, I generally get several of whatever it is, so I have enough to keep the Thinkpads operating for a long time.

I have just noticed that PS2 compatible keyboards have been disappearing so I got 3 more, as I had few which were PS2 AND USB compatible.

'Course, as I do not plan on upgrading to Vista/7 there is no need for me to buy new desktop machines or notebooks for a long time. As Microsoft has been concentrating on giving users less and less control, it means that on the later MS OSs, anything which is broke will stay broke unless MS fixes it, and we all know about their sterling performance in that area!

I think that the reason for the decline in Win9x users is mainly due to software, when the latest versions of so many programs will not work under Win9X, and so many users have been "educated" to 'update' everything automatically. As they find the later version of whatever deluxe won't work with Win9x they finally bite the bullet and upgrade to XP, rather than staying with the last version of whatever deluxe which DOES work under Windows 9X, and figuring they do not need the 'upgrade' enough to switch from Win9x.

I am running 98SE2ME, and then I used 98 Lite to remove IE and WMP ( I replace WMP with the K-lite codec pack and Media Player Classic) and I have never installed any version of Outlook.

I have been running A Thinkpad A22m as my primary internet machine, connected over dial-up, with NO firewall and no antivirus and have not gotten Viruses or spyware since I first connected the machine to the Internet in January.

I am using the Thinkpad as my primary machine for Office type applications and e-mail and internet access, and only turn on the big desktop when I am doing photo editing or CAD. I have a KVM switch to switch my monitor, keyboard and speakers between the desktop and the Thinkpad, and I figure I have saved a fairish amount of electricity since I have been doing it.

In fact, I could run that machine on Linus as the only thing which keeps me tied to Windows is some of the photo editing and CAD software.

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While I intend to move to Linux from Win9x rather than to Vista, I think Linus is more of a networked designed OS rather than a stand alone desktop type OS. For instance I believe that Linus uses TCP/IP for as their Ethernet protocol rather than NetBuei or Netware meaning that you cannot have a different protocol for your Ethernet than you do for your internet. I also think that there are admin rights and permissions in Linux similar to the stuff you find in XP and which have no place in a stand alone machine.

It sounds like you might like Haiku. It's based on BeOS, an actual home OS. There are permissions, but they don't restrict you, as they're only there for POSIX support.

Haiku is still in development, but it's definitely something to watch.

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A lot of Win98 users seem concerned about security backdoors, speed of their OS or their budget. I think these users will simply migrate to ReactOS. I hope the die-hards start hacking ReactOS and contributing their extensive knowledge of Windows too.

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Well it's simple ;) If software and hardware support wouldn't had disappeared for Windows 9x then I would still have been using it. I mostly use Windows XP as Windows 98 SE can't support multi-core/multi-cpu systems and can't support a lot of ram either(there are patches I know). :( Installing Windows 9x is full of hassles, but if you love computers like me :) then it is just fun to install Windows 9x and fix the problems until you have got a fully working OS, which is satisfying that you have managed to do it. However I can't say that any OS is hassle free :} , I had a lot of issues installing XP x64 Bit on a Lenovo Thinkpad T61, and the "add hardware" sux in windows xp :angry: And then we got the terrible Vista. It is so unstable and is so slow!!! But if I was to choose between a fully driver installed and fixed OS, then I would without doubts choose Windows 98! :) But then again all this flash player talk what does it have to do with the original post in the thread? Isn't it off-topic? It's like saying "Mmh butter taste better than margarine".

So WINDOWS 9x FOR THE WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:w00t:

Oh and the reason to people choosing vista is probably that it is what you get these days when you're buying a new computer.

AND a lot of software designed for example XP can still be runned under Windows 9x, but maybe refuses to run as it says that it is not a supported OS, is probably some co-operation with MS to destroy Windows 9x :sneaky:

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"I ***ing hate Vista! Why didn't they leave Word as it was in XP?"

I *know* people don't understand what an O/S is, when they call office 2007 vista.

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I am testing Windows 98SE (+ RP9 + Kex 4 + IE6 + Opera 10 + MPCHC + a lot of software and my hardware) face to face with Windows Vista 32 bit on same machine. In few days i write a report about it and i hope i shall find a comparison of same with windows XP.

right now i see that Vista is usable on my system only as a cross-plattform reference tool which helps me to find real and fake incompatibilities between several things - drivers, hardware, apps. At all i see some improvements in vista (especially the memory and CPU cache management, better sw compatibility as Win98SE+kex, really good sw environment) but i see a lot of disappointments in this system (it is very very large, sound does not work correctly, graphics are not working correctly, at all only few devices are working correctly).

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I question the accuracy of the percentages for each type of OS. If that info is obtained from checking the user agent, they could be way off. Most 9X users I know aren't browsing with IE6. They're using an alternate such as SeaMonkey, K-Meleon, etc. Several of these enable the user to spoof the user agent, either directly or by using an extension or free-standing app like Proxomitron as an aid for dealing with sites that don't work properly with 9X systems. I would guess that most 9X users have run into such sites and know how to spoof the user agent.

Then you have to remember that not everyone takes their Windows 9x system on the Internet.

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