Last Versions of Software for Windows 98SE

[PROBLEMCHYLD]

These are without KernelEx installed:

Foxit Reader 2.3 4015 build.

http://www.oldversion.com/Foxit-PDF-Reader.html

Ccleaner 2.06.567

http://www.filehippo.com/download_ccleaner/3938/

CCleaner 2.36.1233 is the last without KernelEx.

[ScrewUpgrading]

Okay thanks, I didn't know about Ccleaner.

Since this topic was started in 2007, some of the programs listed on page 1 aren't *exactly* the final versions for Win9x.

I'm not sure if anybody has discovered the absolute last version of Foxit Reader? But the 4015 build is newer than the 3309 listed on the main page.

I just don't have the time to go through the entire thread to find out. That's probably something I should do soon though

Edited October 3, 2011 by ScrewUpgrading

[ScrewUpgrading]

Drugwash said:

Gmail started replacing the log-in page and will soon remove the Basic HTML page as well

Call me paranoid, but I don't think it's a coincidence IE6 crashing hard on updated (presumed HTML5) pages. This already cuts out 9x's chances to access the web (what could Win95 guys use?) and next step will probably be IPv6, a subject always buried here.

That's great

Not that I doubt your word, but I don't suppose you have a link in regards to google removing basic html email?

I lost my yahoo account recently (at least from home), so did my mom, because we both have old computers with Win9x. So I made her a gmail account instead thinking that it will last a long time. Looks like I may have been wrong about that. Yeah, Windows 9x is running out of alternatives pretty quick.

[LoneCrusader]

I lost my yahoo account recently (at least from home), so did my mom, because we both have old computers with Win9x. So I made her a gmail account instead thinking that it will last a long time. Looks like I may have been wrong about that. Yeah, Windows 9x is running out of alternatives pretty quick.

Huh? Why?

I use Yahoo Mail and I prefer it to Hotmail or Gmail garbage. I don't have any problem accessing it.

Of course I refused to allow them to force me to upgrade to their "new" mail. It should work fine at least until they manage to permanently kill the classic version.

[ScrewUpgrading]

What browser are you using then? I don't use KernelEx anymore (so no Firefox 3 or Opera 11), maybe that has something to do with it. I don't know.

Every time I logged onto Yahoo I got the choice between upgrading to Beta (in which case it would tell me my browser is unsupported), or else using Yahoo Classic "Just This One Last Time." With the implication being that sooner or later Yahoo Classic would be gone for good. I swear that I recieved a message stating that after September 16(?) Yahoo Classic WOULD NOT be avilable. I simply got sick of it and deleted it. They can shove it up their @$$ for all I care.

Gmail doesn't pyschologically terrorize me with similar threats every time I log on.

Edited October 3, 2011 by ScrewUpgrading

[Drugwash]

Not that I doubt your word, but I don't suppose you have a link in regards to google removing basic html email?

At this point, I don't think any of us needs any more proof that Win9x users are going to be swept off of the www soon.

While logged onto Gmail, I switched to Standard view for a quick glimpse - a lot of useless gimmicks that make loading slower (I'm on GPRS which is some kind of dial-up with limited traffic and speed), but the ugly trick was no way to go back to Basic view! One could only do that after logging out and logging back in, when there's a short "window" of time when such choice is visible at the bottom of the screen. When that choice dissapears (and it will, at some point), then we're left out with a crawling, bloated (and possibly, soon non-functional on Win9x) Gmail - not that they'd care or anything.

My IE6 (with or without SlimBrowser as front-end) is crashing on more and more sites, including here at MSFN. Sure, it may just be my machine, fed up with all kinds of libraries ranging from WinME to Server2003; the crash is in MSHTML.DLL, which is an XP version, but may be related to something else.

K-meleon, the browser I chose for a slightly higher speed than Firefox 3.6.x, is killing the video driver every so often, which leaves me no choice but reboot. Same behavior as with Firefox, on top of the lack of page refreshing, which produces artifacts (especially on pictures) when scrolling up/down. Dunno of any other browser able to run on Win9x - with or without KernelEx - that would not exhibit such behavior. And messing with the system now would be just asking for trouble, considering it's my development environment.

[dencorso]

Opera 10.10 works beautifully, and does not need KernelEx. It can use Java 5 and Flash 9 also flawlessly.

[Drugwash]

At some point I did have some version of Opera installed, but I wiped it out long ago and there must be a reason for that. The only versions of Opera I have at hand (either on CD/DVD or HDD) are 8.02, 9.10, 9.23, 9.26, 10.62 and 11.50. Yet I've been with SlimBrowser for many, many years, due to a few built-in features that none of the other browsers offer straight up (or at all) and the vaguely similar plug-ins I could find are completely unsatisfactory.

I'm downloading Opera 10.10 right now (5-10 kB/s average download speed!!!) but I feel it will dissapear from my system much, much quicker than it will take me to download it.

If all that 21st century's world wide web has to offer me is advertising, viruses and greedy people dying to make a buck out of crappy software, then I'm better off offline anyway.

P.S. There's one thing p!$$ing me off beyond imagination: why the hell both the Gecko engine (Firefox, K-meleon, etc) and Opera, block certain javascript with no way to enable it (at least not found by me)?!?

Have a look at the screenshots below, taken on the same 98SE machine minutes from one-another; notice the Code (Expand) vs Code (Expand - Copy). Well, the most important thing which is Copy, gets cloaked by all these "advanced" browsers such as Firefox, K-meleon, Opera, etc. WHY???????

Oh and please, if I ever say "Opera" again... SHOOT ME !!! (can't even attach a picture with it!)

Edited October 3, 2011 by Drugwash

[ScrewUpgrading]

If all that 21st century's world wide web has to offer me is advertising, viruses and greedy people dying to make a buck out of crappy software, then I'm better off offline anyway.

That's why I don't play their game of upgrading and keeping up with the Jones'. I'm stubbornly going to use Win9x until I can't load a single web page. Plus, I can still use my computer for burning music cd's, playing games, and for managing my personal photos. It's also a glorified typewriter!

At this point, I don't think any of us needs any more proof that Win9x users are going to be swept off of the www soon.

I hear what you're saying. My opinion is that Microsoft will be dead within the next 10 years. Once the next generation of kids grows up without any knowledge of how to use a desktop PC, especially since computers keep getting dumbed down for the average Joe, Windows will be extinct. Just look at Windows 8 and it's new "Metro" interface. It looks like it's designed for a 5 year old. Once Windows 8 type interfaces become the norm, and whereby lots of the functions are done in the background without input from the user, you can kiss PC's goodbye. It's all going to be portable and in the cloud, I think. PC gaming will become antiquated just like using a Sega Genesis, Nintendo 64, or other type of console. Everything will be used on seperate tablet devices that you carry around with you.

In that sense, I think the PC desktop has already reached it's zenith. Probably with XP in terms of percentage of people who used it at a given time. Because PC sales have been declining for a while now. XP was probably the high point of the desktop era in that regard. Microsoft is just grasping for straws now, releasing a new OS every few years in a frantic attempt to try and keep up with the changing demands of consumers, who pretty much are moving away from the desktop. I see at as Microsoft's last ditch attempt to hang on to a market they once dominated.

You know, I wouldn't be surprised if the internet morphs into one huge facebook page or something like that. Seeing as how most people have no interest in things beyond themselves and their little circle of friends. One huge online shopping center and facebook page for women. And all forms of "bad thought" will be censored by the matriarchy and their CIA henchman. Hehe. It'll be like 1984.

My IE6 (with or without SlimBrowser as front-end) is crashing on more and more sites, including here at MSFN. Sure, it may just be my machine, fed up with all kinds of libraries ranging from WinME to Server2003; the crash is in MSHTML.DLL, which is an XP version, but may be related to something else.

Well, that sucks. Personally myself I wouldn't use IE6 in any shape or form. I don't have any problems with crashing, and most web pages load quick even on dialup. Here's what works for me:

Firefox 2.0.0.20 (javascript off)

K-Meleon 1.5.4 (javscript blocked)

Seamonkey 1.1.19 (noscript extension, or else javascript disabled entirely)

Opera 10.63 Turbo

I just did a clean install of Window ME to get rid of all the Firefox 3 and Opera 11 stuff that was associated with KernelEx, and my system is very stable now.

Edited October 3, 2011 by ScrewUpgrading

[Drugwash]

All those browsers are a joke, from my point of view. If none of them can present the Copy link that I need, then what am I gonna do with them - admire their "skins" and all those bells'n whistles that I don't need or want? No, thanks.

And BTW: it's been 1984 for a while already.

[ScrewUpgrading]

Well, enjoy your 10 year old web browser and your frequent crashes then.

I already posted a link to Gmail's minimum browser requirements... so until I see otherwise, I'm going to believe Google.

[Drugwash]

Can anyone show a screenshot of any Win9x-compatible (KernelEx or not) browser other than IE6 (or any of its front-ends) that can display the Copy link for a page similar to the one in my two screenshots above?

That link activates a short javascript that copies the code in the codebox to clipboard and I need it. I do not need any other browser that cannot do that and I definitely do not need the sarcasm of someone who recommends javascript-disabled browsers as a solution for the issue above.

As for Google... I only believe my eyes. If there's any sh!t in the experience I described in post #636, then it's definitely Google's, not mine. And future will speak for itself.

[M()zart]

Drugwash, it's only IE who allows javascript to modify the clipboard (e.g. copy something by clicking something). Other browsers (not IE-based) forbid it by design - it's considered as a security hole (for example some script just pastes an unwanted URL to malicious website to the clipboard when you are copying good link, and you just won't notice it, and paste it to the address bar). I don't know whether this is a good or bad idea. Most web developers use flash buttons for this feature, flash is able to modify clipboard in all browsers supporting flash. As for enabling other scripts in Opera - I often see webpages with some parts not displaying in Opera. For example NYT - its facebook like button is not displayed in Opera. However (in later Opera versions) all works if you mask Opera as IE (Menu -> Settings -> Quick Preferences -> Edit Site Preferences -> Network -> Browser identification -> Mask as Internet Explorer). Website of my provider also does not allow to enter code of payment cards in Opera explicitely stating that Opera is not working, but when I masked Opera as IE I was able to enter code. And everything worked OK.

Edited October 4, 2011 by M()zart

[Drugwash]

Thank you so much, M()zart! Your detailed explanation above just offered me a couple of hints as to what I could try further.

One thing I just don't get: if only IE allows that clipboard trick, then what browsers would all those AHK forum visitors use, to be able to see and use that Copy link? Obviously, according to your explanation, they would either use some version of IE or an IE-faked User Agent string in other browsers. This sounds a little unprobable, if you ask me.

I have no idea how on earth I managed to survive for all those years with an IE-based browser, no firewall and no antivirus. Was it sheer luck that no virus entered my "realm"? I'd rather say it was caution, a good look at the statusbar when hovering a link and a lot of common-sense when choosing to follow any search result, for starters.

On top of that, always having Flash disabled! You can see where you'd be going at when hovering a link, but - Flash buttons? - nope. Flash-based menus or entire sites built on Flash is what I've stayed away from, because one never knows what's behind it. You can't check what it's doing. You can't peek at the page source if something feels fishy. So - no Flash for me, thank you. And no virus in ten years or so.

Opera has gone from my system as fast as I predicted somewhere above. Too slow, too graphically bloated, certain behavior unavailable, couldn't perform certain simple actions (see "can't attach images" in a post above). Back to K-meleon 1.7.0 beta although I'm not too happy with it either.

Feels like we're sliding a bit off-topic, although it's still about Win9x compatibility, roughly.

[bphlpt]

One thing I just don't get: if only IE allows that clipboard trick, then what browsers would all those AHK forum visitors use, to be able to see and use that Copy link? Obviously, according to your explanation, they would either use some version of IE or an IE-faked User Agent string in other browsers. This sounds a little unprobable, if you ask me.

Very easy. Click-and-Drag to highlight the box of code, then either Ctrl-C or right click and "copy", whichever your preference. Yes it's a little less convenient than simply clicking the Copy link, but you don't have to deal with IE and it's variations.

I have no idea how on earth I managed to survive for all those years with an IE-based browser, no firewall and no antivirus. Was it sheer luck that no virus entered my "realm"? I'd rather say it was caution, a good look at the statusbar when hovering a link and a lot of common-sense when choosing to follow any search result, for starters.

I think that 95%+ of all nasties can indeed be avoided through caution and common sense, which you seem to have in great supply.

Personally, I find Opera faster than IE, but I think it really depends on a combination of your OS, hardware, and preference settings (such as javascript) along with what you are used to. All of the various browsers have their strong points and fans.

Cheers and Regards